This isn’t a rhetorical question. If you’ve asked yourself more than once, “Is my girlfriend/wife/fiancee a crazy bitch?” as a clinical psychologist, I’m here to tell you the answer is, “Yes, diagnostically speaking, she may very well be a crazy bitch.”
A crazy bitch insidiously makes you feel like the unstable, angry person. You soon doubt your interpretation of events and experiences. In lots of cases, this type of woman may have a personality disorder, such as Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD), Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) or Antisocial Personality Disorder or some combination of the Cluster B disorders. In other cases, they may not qualify for diagnoses, but it doesn’t really matter. Abusers are highly resistant to change regardless of whether they have a personality disorder or not.
Here’s a quiz to find out if your wife, girlfriend or ex is an abuser:
- Does she fly into rages without warning over relatively trivial matters like a web page loading too slowly?
- Are you always the scapegoat/bad guy whenever she’s frustrated, disappointed or just plain bored?
- Do her friends (that is, if she has any) describe her as a “drama queen?”
- Does she describe herself as a drama queen? If so, congrats. You found one with a modicum of self-awareness.
- Is her lipstick a little too red? Is it applied like theater makeup and a tad crooked?
- Did sex begin with an earth shattering bang and fizzle into infrequent, transactional and conditional sex?
- Is she a black-and-white, all-or-nothing thinker?
- Do you lie to your family, friends and colleagues about what goes on at home?
- Do you find yourself making excuses to your family, friends and colleagues for her inexcusable behavior?
Do you find yourself walking on eggshells around her?- Does she hate your friends and family and become angry or tearful when you spend time with them?
- Is she pathologically jealous?
- Does she project her feelings onto you? For example, she’s yelling and raging and then accuses you of being angry.
- Does focus solely on her emotional experience while exhibiting little or no empathy for yours?
- Have you distanced yourself from friends and family because of your relationship?
- Does she place you on a pedestal one day only to tear you down the next day? “I’ve never known anyone like you before. You’re so wonderful!” Next day: “You’re the devil! You’re the most selfish bastard I’ve ever met! You don’t love me!”
- Did she change her identity after she landed you? For example, when you first met her she was a sexy, adventurous, sweet ballbuster; now, she’s afraid of her own shadow, has no outside interests and goes ballistic if she has to do anything without you.
- Does she put you into “no win” situations in which nothing you do is good enough and you’re guaranteed to fail?
- Does she exhibit stalker behaviors? This usually occurs during the courtship phase or when she senses you’re about to make a break for it. For instance: Calling and hanging up? Calling over and over and over until you answer the phone? Does she wait outside your home, uninvited, until you arrive? Does she show up at places she know you’ll be, also uninvited? Has she tried to get close to your friends in inappropriate ways?
If you answered “yes” to more than two of these questions, you may be involved with a female abuser. You’re not alone. They’re everywhere.
Most of the men who ended up in my therapy office were there because they were experiencing stress, depression or anxiety as a result from being in a relationship with an emotionally abusive woman. Ironically, most of the time they were shamed and pathologized into seeking counseling by these women. Never mind that most of the symptoms my male patients experienced were a direct result of being in a relationship with an abuser who most likely had one of the abusive personality disorders
If you think you may be involved with an abusive woman, good luck. They’re typically treatment resistant and they never really get any better. If you choose to stay in the relationship, I strongly recommend you educate yourself about the signs and symptoms of abuse, personality disorders and learn some basic behavioral management skills.
Counseling, Consulting and Coaching with Dr. Tara J. Palmatier, PsyD
Dr. Tara J. Palmatier, PsyD helps individuals work through their relationship and codependency issues via telephone or Skype. She specializes in helping men and women trying to break free of an abusive relationship, cope with the stress of an abusive relationship or heal from an abusive relationship. She combines practical advice, emotional support and goal-oriented outcomes. Please visit the Schedule a Session page for professional inquiries.
Want to Say Goodbye to Crazy? Buy it HERE.
Crazy woman from istockphotos.
Walking on eggshells from “ada loves you” on flickr.
Shit – I could answer yes to SEVEN of the above….
….kill me
Al-
I answered “yes” to all of them when assessing my ex-wife
its great to know that im not fricken alone, i dont know what to do any more i feel like i am falling in and out of love with her daily… she admits she has a problem, but never changes. its a god damn roller coaster
Nick: When my daughter was 1 month old I was told by my ex that she would take my daughter from me so she never knew who her father was.
The next day my ex was telling me how much she loved me.
I stayed for as long as I could (almost three years) to make sure I had a strong bond with my daughter before I was locked out during another blow out.
My ex also acknowledge she had problems, but I can tell you after 3 years on the roller coaster the roller coaster ride WILL NOT END.
Dr Tara is the expert here but my advice – Get out – and get out now.
Scarry sounds like my ex wife. Oh wait it is. Sorry David. It’s not our fault. The only one that suffers is our children. The ride will never end for us.
i did the same, i stuck it out with my crazy ex until i knew that my kids could pick me out in a crowd, then I pulled the rug from under her lazy, crazy butt, i brought home a moving truck, gave her a furniture store card for 2 grand and money for rent, and still she went to a womens shelter and kept my kids away for 88 days until I learned that all i had to do was get to the court house and I had a court date 9 days later. All that heart break was resolved when the judge gave me the three days a week that i was asking for. she tried to say that i was abusive but i did my homework, voluntarily went to an anger management class, got assessed by a social services psyhc and brought him to court with me. The judge balked at her abuse complaint because she had no police report and I was granted my parenting time starting that same day. The first thing my 4 year old said to me at pick up was “happy dada home”. He is ten now and he and his little bro say that to me every day. She has moved on to another poor sap, and the kids are already asking when they can stay with me fulltime. pls pray for their safety.
i feel like im going thru the same thing right now, but my baby is 1.5 yrs old. and i get told im abusive and i have to choose my family or her, and stuff that happens years ago or months ago never gets forgotten. so my first step is to see like you said an anger management class. thanks for your help i dont wanna lose my daughter
I’ve been here almost 7 years at first great but as the years go by worse and worse we have 3 girls it’s holding me here but seriously it’s crazy she says I cheat or talk to other women all the time and I caught her cheating red handed idk what to do
at least she admits it
I wonder just what percentage of women are like this. I talked ot one pastor that said many of the women he counseled were getting out of relationships because they were bored. These women are being conditioned this way, because this is only a recent phenomena
admitting it is the first step, but as the the dr. states ,typically these woman never change. god bless the ones that do.
my life…exactly…
i feel you bro, im in love with my sour patch kid.
10 out of 17. Mine also has OCD (Obsessive Compulsive Disorder) on top of everything else. Cleaning herself like crazy, making life miserable to me and her family on a non-stop basis. Things like, passing nearby of a mail envelope which has been left on the floor drives her nuts cause the envelope is dirty. Things like keeping her cell phone and all the remote controls at home in plastic sandwich bags so she doesn’t have to throw them away if somebody outside of the family touches them. Things like not sitting next to me on the same couch because I have my daily clothing on me. Things like following me around the house to make sure I washed my hands everytime I stepped out and came back.
Oh boy, I must be crazy myself for marrying this woman, I see no other explanation!.
I hope that anyone who is reading this and is in this situation WITHOUT kids will think twice about starting a family with such an unstable person. My grandmother was like this (actually, she was much, much worse) and wreaked havoc on my family for years. Obviously, I’m glad I’m here and I’m glad my Mother is here, but bringing kids into a situation like this is only going to make things worse as they will become pawns in her game. She will manipulate, abuse and treat them like crap – just as she has done you. They will bear the scars of her behavior and never feel adequate enough because of all the shit she has put them through. My grandmother literally ruined my Mother’s adult life (as well as childhood) with this childish bull shit. Just read the comments of these men who have kids with women like this: RUN LIKE HELL.
7? I got 12.
Yesterday was our 11th marriage anniversary.
Are you staying for another 11years?
Hell I answered yes to 15, sometimes to 2.I must say the first 6 monthes were the best 6 monthes of my life, then thing began to change, slowly she went from Totaly awesome to total nut job. I can’t figure out why her exhusband moved into the spare bedroom for 8 years, and stayed away for weeks on end befor finding a girlfriend and divorcing her. It sure wasn’t anything she did.
Yeah, consider yourself lucky. Besides jealousy, lipstick, pedestal and stalking (sofar) most of these things ring true and have happened. Daily. 5 years long.
God, am I stupid or what?
Hey, me too: i answered yes to 7 questions….but i didn’t need this test to know that she is a bitch. I would have already left if it wasn’t for my 3 yr old daughter. what should i do? it happens way too often that i just want to leave and never come back without giving any warning , just leave. but then what would happen to me and my daughter? I feel really trapped
I am feeling the same way. It feels like my happiness, my life, my hopes and dreams have been ripped apart by this woman. I am sorry to hear, but can’t you take your daughter and fight her for custody.
I know how you feel. I just ended my marriage with my wife who was diagnosed with BPD and I also answered yes to over 7 of those questions. I luckily didn’t have any kids with her. I do have a friend that has two little girls and he was married to his BPD wife for 9 years. He is divorced and two years later remarried to a great kind, “genuine”, loving woman. We were talking the other day and he said getting divorced was the best thing he ever did for him and his girls. There was some hell to deal with but in the end it is worth it. Life is too short, don’t let her control your life. It has only been two months since my divorce and I 1000x better than I did. You can take your happiness back, these women are cruel and controlling.
I feel trapped also. I have a 15 yearold son and a crazy crazy wife that works for a lawfirm. She threatens me all the time with…. you will be broke and homless when i get finished with you. She is extremly mean, controling, un affectionate…cruel…cuses at me and all I do is is non stop fix, repaire, help people in our family etc. I am told by our friends all the time rthat I am the nicest considerate affectionate man they know. IM screwed!!
I swear,Ive been through/seen at least 13 of them…just got divorced 3 months(and I actually didnt see see it coming—)…and Im still wondering what more I could have done….going to divorce support group for the first time tonight.holy friggin crap…gotta get my shit straight….
looks like i am in the crazy bitch club.. i thought i loved her but i think i have bitten off more than i can chew this time.. she is just not reasonable and now my sex life is pittiful i was getting more when i was single, not that that is the most important thing but jesus… cant be bothered any more its time for a new start. its been almost a year of frustration.. what a bitch.. my advice if your reading this and you are wondering if your gf or wife is crazy and your unhappy get out of there while you can. if its not good now dont hold on in hope that its going to get better, trust me it wont you will just end up in a bad place. run.. run realy get the f”*k out of there while you can.. life is too short to waste on somebody undeserving of your affection!!!
Hell I am at 8. I am hoping it is just because she is pregnant.
It has been a hell of a ride.
My wife won’t forgive me for anything. She is always right and I am always wrong. Her way or the Highway.
I answered yes to 11 of these. I know this girl is wrong for me. I don’t know why I’m still with her. Our good are great, our lows are terrible, and I’ve always felt she doesn’t approve of who I am or how I live. I can’t bring myself to leave her. I feel like I’m in high school again, I’m a grown man.
I am late finding this article, but decided to share. I have been with my wife for 5 years. I can check off all except one. When I found out I was dying from a genetic disease she treated me worse. Ruined my career, ruined my finances, ruined my friendships, and then blamed it on me being a failure. I believed her . tried to kill myself, several times. Ended up back with her after the infidelity, lies, drug abuse. I have lived through all of it. She told me she hopes I die , literally the same day we found out I had less than a year to live. She left me homeless, broke and alone, but it wasn’t enough she would message me reminding me all the time then offer me sanctuary because I was her play thing.. I am the person she destroys to feel better about herself. The worst part is she convinced everyone it was my fault. Which led me to believe its my fault this article came a little to late for me l, but simply knowing I’m not crazy and that everything I suspected was true is true, is enough. I made peace with my declining health, and unfortunately me and her are together. I have no other option since she crippled my entire world so that I couldn’t get away. I appreciate anyone who listened.. I have never gotten the chance to get that off my chest .. At least not to anyone who believed me about her..
Man, enjoy the rest of your life ON YOUR TERMS. There is a great Russian saying that goes something along the lines of “You’ve already crossed the line so you may as well dance.” Dude, if the clock is ticking and you know you’ve already crossed the line and you’re about to face the reality of death (alone, I might add) – then go out with a bang and dance your heart out. Don’t live miserably to the end.
I don’t know if this is common, but my wife pouts at the slightest disapproval. For example, if I don’t laugh at her “jokes,” or on the rare occasions when I tell her to “stop it.”. The pout also makes an appearance when I dare to start a “we need to talk about [x]” discussion.
She pouts by sticking her lower lip out really far – it’s cartoonish. I’m starting to think, however, that it’s not deliberately comical. Usually it’s a quick flash of the lip, unless she’s about to start crying (which happens when I’ve held her accountable. This leads straight into the “not my fault and you’re so mean” spiel.).
And a couple of times when I’ve screwed up extra special, she gives me this look where her face muscles all go slack and her eyes seem to turn black. It’s _horrifying_.
So, “makes inappropriate faces” might be another hint…
That’s a good addition to the checklist, Mr E. Inappropriate or disproportionate reactions are definitely a common occurrence with these women. I’ve heard others describe the last facial expression you describe as “the death stare” and, yes. it’s horrifying.
Remember, the emotional range of these women is that of a 5-year old. Hold her accountable, criticize her or ask her to have a conversation she doesn’t want to have (for fear of being held accountable or criticized) and you’ll get one or a combination of the following three responses:
1. Tantrum
2. Tears
3. Cold, sullen withdrawal (i.e., pouting)
Thanks for the addition.
Best,
Dr T
No 1. check, No. 2check, No. 3 check,check and check. Been there for a long time now. And the”LOOK” as it’s sometimes called is a “death look”. very well put. When I first met my wife I know she could “look daggers” at anyone who crossed her but in those early days I never thought that that look would be turned on me. Wish all this information has been availible 40 years ago.
This is great info to know, only thirty years to late for me. Unofrtunately the church does not recognise this either, as the man is supposed to bend over backwards for the woman regardless of what she does
Agreed. My church laughed off abusive behavior as just being a female thing and that somehow lasting years with an abusive psychopath was an honorable anniversary to be celebrated. That. Is. Sick.
We have progressed to a point in the modern era where rational thinking IMHO has now become irrational. Politically correct laws pervade everything, and the lives of many men are viewed as expendable in regards to family.
I was married for twenty years. She left 3 years ago and hooked up with a guy that worked for me for the previous 7 years. I tried to leave 10 years before, but she got pregnant with our second child. I moved hell and high water to please her, she always found something to criticise or complain about. Lost contact with all my friends, most of my family and and all my colleagues. Made excuses all the time why i couldn’t make 20 years of staff parties-didn’t go by myself either. I changed my interests and lost me. She lied about many things or hid the truth. The silent treatment and withholding of emotional intimacy and love were her well developed weapons. I eventually realized I had lost her too years before, shortly after we were married. Yeah, I did the right thing by the church and family and tried to make it work until depression, stress,self abhorence and resentment made me give up and just be a door mat. This pushed me over the edge untilI stood up for myself, went on a fishing trip with my 65 year old brother … and she kicked all of points 1-17 into ultra mode. Counselor even told me her emotional wounds were real and i should treat them as such. So much for reality. I didn’t even get a chance to talk to her face to face in sessions. Wish I had of nipped it in the bud 17 -18 years before. Much better now but scars run deep.
Amen brother! I’ve got seven more years before plan B and I can’t wait to be free.
I have have 17 years left.
Yes i have went through this also the control thing got way out of hand she wanted to control everything i was involved in she even want to have some type of job booking my band’s jobs and then if someone tried to dance with me i was yelled at like a kid all the way home i told her that i had talked to my ex- whom i left for her. she hated her and told me that she should be around when ever i talked to her.rage and conflict were always. involved sex was good but then while having that she would bring up my ex during that i finally moved in to the other room. occasionally going back our room and later it all would star over again finally she went and had a agreement for the house drawn up because she rented the house a year and a half before i moved in but we bought the house together and she felt she should keep the house. i did not know what i was dealing with because her family won’t tell her she needs help the preacher at my church said you love your wife like God loved the church But he’s never lived with this woman only me finally i got my own place gave her the house and now she says i ruined her life.by leaving and of course she has never done anything wrong. there is so much more but she had me thinking i was crazy and feeling guilty and sorry for her
Wow, I never knew only 2 symptoms were good enough to tag these hellcats.
Mine used to pout, complain when I spent time with family, direct what I bought and what I should wear, laugh at things masculine, like the show ‘Manswers’, and return a cold, deadly stare when I asked her questions that stumped her. When I saw that, I submissively apologized and then she raged about how I was disrespectful. Oh, she also teased me sexually, but when the time came for actual sex, she broke down crying.
Diabolical vamps.
Hellcats, what an apt word.
how do i leave a woman like this while fearing that she will self-harm and knowing i’ll probably have to change my phone number? i love her but i think she is why i’m depressed… i’ve always been introspective but never this frantic and downtrodden.
oops i noticed a typo in my email right as i hit submit… hope i get notifications
Hey tmoo, you can not let yourself fear her self harm. You are not responsible for her actions or her happiness. Get out, don’t look back and do whatever you need to do to take care of yourself. You will feel better when you do. Good luck.
god it’s going to be so hard because our lives are so intertwined… we’re in the midst of moving from a room in a house to an apartment (my name’s not on the lease, and there’s a third party, one of her friends)… i tried to leave once before, but she got bery compassionate and convinced me i was a scared little boy trapped in an adult’s body. i have no one to talk to because all my friends are alienated, evem geograpgically, but i can move bavk with them. she says i can’t leave because we have ferrets together… so glad they aren’t human babies. thanks kenny, i know you are right but it is very hard to just leave, and i think how she’s conditioned me to think makes it harder. typos: mobile device, please excuse.
Thanks for that answer, which I needed. (Worried about the woman I’m divorcing, who is self-dangerous.) Now that I think about it more, I can feel sorry for her without thinking for one second that it is my problem or responsibility.
i call that death stare the medusa face. has she ever punched you for running a yellow light, kicked you in the ass as you were leaving the house to avoid getting physical with her or just escape her rants . of course she has. get out and enjoy your freedom because as it is you are in prison with this woman, there are beautiful girls out there, your sisters and mothers are perfect examples.
The Death Stare! I know it well. Those are the times I actually feel physically intimidated.
Problem is most people do not see that side of her.. They may think she is over bearing, but if I go through the divorce it will be my fault to most people.
I do not hate her I think she is a very good mom and made me a better dad, but I cannot stand how she treats me and doing it around our kids.
I stayed 21 Plus years of this and have a 16 year old, 13 year old, and a 6 year old. I am not perfect, but many of things I was driven to. (Not abuse of any kind). I feel alone and isolated in my basement, but I also do not want to interact with her.
My marriage has been interesting, decades of giving in. My advice is never marry for sex. I have been physically abused and battered. I have never fought back. She has damaged our walls with her angry violence. She gets nuts 1 day a week and lays down and sobs and freaks out and for no reason the next day is a completely happy person. I love being around the kids and find enough satisfaction there. I fear it will be worse if I leave before the kids are out of school. So I just keep on keeping on. FYI. She has become her mother.
oh, god this might be my situation. she tells me to go hang with my friends and is mad about it when i get home.
I answered yes to about 5 of these questions, and honestly, I think I might be able to say yes to more… but after 8 years, the lines sort of blur, so I can see how she’s made me feel like I’m the goofball. She always will tell me to go hang with my friends and the once per month that I do, I get a damned guilt trip about it.
are you the doctor that posted a story? wow , that sounds unreal
Mine would encourage me to hang with my friends, too. But would call, facebook, text, whatever me a couple of times while I did so. “The kids are finally asleep, after a long battle!” at 10pm, “Kid A is coughing all night”, “I’m so exhausted, my back hurts, because I carried Kid B all day…” and so on. Making me feel bad about spending time without the family. Thinking “no, I can’t go out again, I already did that 4 weeks ago, she’s so exhausted because being a SAHM is the hardest job ever, apparently”. I mean it must have been super duper hard, because she complained all the time, right? *sigh*
my god, THIS. i answered yes to six of the above, and the one that gets to me the most is when she tells me to get out and won’t even listen to a word i say, then when i do go to leave she gets angry that I’m leaving, she has severed abandonment issues to the point of i can’t go outside for a cigarette while we’re fighting because she’s afraid i won’t come back, yet try to open the door and she’s locked me out
That’s a cluster B whacko in a nutshell. Abandonment is their single, biggest fear.
Wow i have the same thing with my wife of 4 years
I think my girlfriend is definately Narcisistic after reading this – she’s got most of those traits but the one I find most annoying is her distorted perception of reality where I will do something and then be screamed at that I have been told 3 times before not to do that – where as in reality i’ve never even heard it mentioned. I’m also aware that she has been slating me behind my back to her friends and family which is really getting on my nerves as half of what she has been saying isn’t true (well in this reality!).
What do I do? Should I confront her and risk a minefield tantrum and half the house being blown up!??
Confrontation rarely works. Oftentimes, NPDs/BPDs twist it around and blame you. Also, you will unleash the hounds of hell if you dare to criticize your NPD girlfriend. In fact, the more accurate the criticism, the nastier the NPD will become.
What should you do? Ask yourself why you’re in this relationship. What are you getting out of it? Why do you tolerate her behavior? Why don’t you end it before, god forbid, you have children with this woman and are tethered to her financially for the rest of her life?
Kind Regards,
Dr T
I think this is a very helpful website. It has been many years since I splt with my ex, but the scars still remain, and I must admit I was warned before I married her. She was very cute, and I thought her behavior would change. I had no idea at the time she had a personality disorder, and since she blamed nearly everything on me, I thought I was the problem for years. She forced me into a thankless job with a company I ended up hating because they cared litle for their agents and had high turnover in that position. The real problem was in the inability of the church to recognize her behavior and blame me for leaving(divorcing) her to keep my sanity, after she literally drove me into it.
I have been with mine over 20 years and the first 7 years were fantastic. Slowly over the rest of the time together she had developed most of the traits you listed. I’m afraid that if I divorce she will end up with most of what we have. Over the years she has become slightly disabled with Fibromyalgia. Now I will look like an ass if I try to leave.
EA, the first 7 years I was with my wife were fantastic, also. It was as though a switch was flipped overnight. I am sorry to hear about your disability. How has your wife responded to this?
What if you happen to love this person? Its sad I know, but I feel attached to her, even if I know she causes me pain. I’ve never dated anyone else, successfully. She’s the only girl I’ve been with and its been for 10 years. She pretty much all I have, unfortunately, your check list almost describes her perfectly. The biggest one is, that there is not room in the relationship for my problems, if I complain to her, or have an issue with her, she makes me out to be the bastard, and guilt trips me in to recanting. Worse thing is I don’t think she knows she’s doing it. Its like she manipulating me without consciously trying.
The best advice I can offer is: leave before it’s too late. After five years of marriage and two kids later, I’m really tired of all the attempts at controlling me as well as being made to feel that I will seldom do anything right in her eyes. I’m also tired of making excuses for her, thinking that m true love will somehow rescue her. She wants a divorce as I have have been “rebelling” for a while now. I’m convinced that she never really loved me as she is too busy loving herself. Believe you me I started off quite enthusiastically and in love. But tolerating all her crap made me a very bitter person: although she wants to part on friendly terms “for the sake of the children”, I can’t even stand to be in the same room with her and I feel very defensive everytime she starts to speak to me expecting her to have some snide remark or demand. I see she is reading a lot of Christian “self-help” books for relationships, but when she mentions it to me she normally makes it about what I must do and not what she or us must focus on. She would tell me I need to communicate my feelings to her, but when I do she will either judge, minimise or ignore my concerns. About six months back, she gave me back the wedding rings saing she wanted a divorce, I said to wait since she just gave birth and I thought it was the hormones. Well get this: three months ago all of a sudden I get a complaint about how I’m no longer showing her love and how I’ve become HER . When I asked about the wedding rings, she tells me I must propose to her as she proposed to me to get married . To me this is very arrogant and angered me even more: clearly it is all about HER and she feels entitled to string me along as she deems fit. She doesn’t even get it wh I’m angry. My biggest regret is that I gave my children the wrong mother.
Wow, when I read your comment about how she wants a divorce because you’ve been “rebelling” I got chills. I’m always accused of being a rebel any time I speak up and attempt to state my side of an argument. Now she is beating me up because I am “not the same person that I married” according to her. That is because I have quit being a doormat and just going along with everything that she wants. It took me over 5 years of being married to this devil before I finally realized that she was just going to continue to take advantage of my easy-going good nature and bury her high heels deeper and deeper into my throat. During one blow out yell-fest she said she missed the old me. I told her she killed the old me, that he’s gone and now she gets the new me. Her favorite label for me was passive-aggressive (thanks female-biased family counselor) so I dropped the passive and now she just gets the aggressive. She hates it, which is ironic because she is uber-confrontational and thinks it is wonderful to just say what is on her mind regardless of who it may affect. I hate it too because it is not who I am. In this relationship, I used to be a very easy-going guy not sweating the small stuff. I always thought that if I gave her her way on little things that didn’t matter, if something really important to me came up she would remember how I never got in the way of what she wanted and she would return the favor. Funny how someone who can remember what I was wearing on a particular day 7 years ago and exactly what I said during an argument about something that I have completely forgotten about 6 years, 11 months and 3 weeks ago can’t remember the good things that I’ve been doing for her all along. What I didn’t realize at the time is that I am dealing with a person with a behavioral defect. She cloaks her agenda with “I am doing this for the good of the family, for us.” She plays the martyr to a tee. She calls me “the lawyer” because usually the only time I will engage her is when I have some firm ground to stand on. She hates it when I have a valid argument and the moment she senses that I have a slight upper-hand in the fray, she finds an excuse (I don’t have time for this, the baby can hear, etc) and walks away. She accuses me of not finding “appropriate” times to discuss issues with her yet 9 times out of 10 she initiates the argument in the “inappropriate” venue (usually in front of the kid) knowing full well that it is an issue we do not agree on and then tries to turn me into the bad guy for responding. It’s like being in grade school and getting in trouble because you hit the bully back after he punched you in the nose. Another thing I find interesting and conflicted about her behavior is how she touts “abandonment issues” as her core problem and yet she is the one who is very flip and quick to throw the “D” word around, as she did tonight. It must feel great to be that free and not worry about the affect your words have on others. She grew up without a dad. He left her and her mother when she was an infant. In my experience, women who grew up without fathers are so screwed up in general and especially in relationships. I’ve dated several and should have known better. Hindsight, what can I say?
I totally understand where you’re coming from. I am starting the divorce process (her choice) and I’m hoping she doesn’t financially ruin me with spousal support in addition to child support for the 2 children.
I’m always wrong. I’m always the bad guy. I’m unreasonable. I’m illogical. She even makes up stuff when she goes on about all the things I’ve done to her. It’s truly mind boggling.
Dan, you have described my marriage and my most recent relationship which I ended 10 weeks ago. I totally know how you feel, I guess the one good thing about me is now is that I am now alone, however I am not lonely!
I have come to realization thanks to this site, I that I have a lot emotional abuse issues, low self esteem and worthiness issues from my childhood. I am now taking the steps to working myself so that I can stop the cycle.
Last night I had my first emotional break down and in a sense I feel good about it. To be honest I feel it was purge of bad emotions and now I feel I can really begin to heal.
I was so in love with my ex-girlfriend, I wanted to marry her and give her the world but now when I look back, the cost of doing so would of been my soul.
I believe you should not have to beg anyone to be with you and after all the games and guys she threw at me I just shut down. I really should of had the courage to say and do something at the time but I just couldn’t. To be honest I could not believe that this woman that I loved so much would hurt me so but after spending time on this site, I was dealt a no win situation, of course I did not know what I know at the time and I just played along. My health went down, my relationship with my children were effected, I became moody and would snap at anything.
Now that I have removed my ex-girlfriend from my life I have seen incredible changes with myself, however I am still scared, I am not use to this new empowered me, I am making the child in me grow up and he does not want this although it is for the better, I will benefit from this growing pain and so will my children.
I am proud to share with you that I did not give in the child in my contact my ex-girlfriend, I was so messed up last night that I want to beg for her to come back. Well guys, I did not do it! I am so relieved today.
I do know if I ever get that feeling again, all I have to do read the articles and posts this site then the feeling goes away. Thank you once again to everyone for letting me share. I love you all!
Robert
You’re not alone buddy.
You’re on the right track. Keep it up.
Remeber. Pain will be temporary, but quitting lasts forever.
How many of you guys HATE weekends as much as I do? I really wish I could work 7 days a week because work is the only place I can find any peace. Tomorrow I will be wearing my TGIM shirt!
I recall that seemingly never ending time. The weekends were always the worst time and by Monday when I arrived at work I would be so emotionally numb and feel like I had run a triathalon. It wasn’t until late Tuesday that I began to feel normal again. This went on for months until I tricked her into going to marriage counseling and the counselor told her to stop yelling at me for the 15 minutes of time on Saturday and Sunday mornings when I did my free weight lifting. The counselor called it my “sacred time” and all people should have some every day regardless of what alone activity you’re doing. In response to the counselor’s comment my wife (now X) screamed at the counselor. From that point on I made it a clear habit to take that time and keep that boundary drawn. Looking back on it nearly a dozen years later, that was the best change I could have ever made. If your partner won’t support you in something basic and fundamental, then she is not your partner. She’s just using you. Best wishes and good luck.
Ha! My STB-X is the same: Stating she is the more “direct one” who “says what’s on her mind”, and I’m the pleaser who trys to avoid conflict.Yet she would flip her shit the very moment ANYONE would be honest to her. Slight sulking, withdrawal and backstabing later on if it was just about some difference of opinion – a major rage-episode if it was about her.
And yes, these people can sense your arguments making sense a mile away, and when they KNOW they are losing the argument, because of rational and logic, they will either withdraw with a strawman-argument, “don’t want to talk about it” or will blame and insult you to death. So that after 5 minutes you don’t even know what the “discussion” was even about.
But I think they DO remember the things you did for them. Back then, those things were wonderful to them, a proof of your love – right now, they are to be expected for they are entitled to them.
My SAHM did less and less of housework. In the end, when I brought the children to bed (which I love, dont get me wrong), she said after 7pm “It’s home time for mommy!”, while I was doing laundry / dishes / younameit till 10pm. What did I get for that? Her saying “I even considered you might be gay” after the break-up. Ugh! All while I was the one almost begging for sex after months of emotional and physical withdrawal from her side.
When she once hugged me out of the blue after maybe a year of withdrawal (we haven’t cuddled once in four years after our first child was born), I couldn’t move! I didn’t know how to react. I was frozen like a statue, unable to do anything, fearing either outcome of my actions might be wrong.
Anyone watched Arressted Development? It was like the scene where Lucille hugs Michael: “Why are you squeezing me with your body?” “It’s a hug, Michael!”
I read this and after dealing with my ex-wife for as many years as I have, I read this quiz with my marriage in mind.
The question about the lipstick was the only no.
I read the description down below and yes, she’s the reason I was in therapy for 7 years.
Wow.
Another possible addition:
Do mutual friends/roommates confront you when they’re upset with her?
I can recall several instances where a friend / roommate has come to me about her behavior (frequently with some hostility). I always figured this was because I was an easy target, and felt weak.
I definitely think poor boundaries on my part encouraged this behavior (I should have stopped them and told them to talk to her, not me), but I think the root problem is that they were afraid to confront her directly.
When I foolishly bring up whatever the friend/roomie complained about to her, I get interrogated and eventually raged at when I freeze up and stop talking. She’ll also hold a grudge against the person in question for ages.
The good news is, I’ve finally figured this out, and have started telling people to just talk to her. Curiously enough, they never do…
I’d love to know if this is a common experience.
ditto, ditto, ditto
Yep they hold grudges forever
Yep, common in my case at least… I don’t want to say never, (as in things will never get better), but don’t buy into the lie that in time she will get better. My opinion is give her a fair ultimatum to begin change tonight, and to continue improving daily within reason, or give her a time limit at which point you will leave.
I answered yes to 12,amazing! I was with this crazy witch for 14 months, not counting the 10 breakups/makeups and I actually asked her to marry me thinking this would ease the toxic abuse she would dish out on a continous basis, never did, nothing changed with this BP/BPD SMI woman. Everyone thinks she is the most wonderful,Christian woman on the outside for all to see, unfortunately that was the person I fell in love with, but on the inside she is a monster with demons as confirmed by two of her exe’s whom I shared notes with after we broke up, they both told me she was dangerous and stay away from her and be thankful I didn’t marry her.
So I’m not alone? I answered “YES” to all the questions above except the lipstick one too. The bad thing for me, is that I DO have kids with the woman.
She uses the kids as leverage whenever she feels like “leaving” because (insert today’s excuse here). Every evening I get “talked to” about how I can be improved upon. If I question her or call her out on any of her shortcomings, dear Lord in heaven the hell that follows is undescribable.
Guys, if you are with a woman like this and do not have chilcdren with her… GET OUT NOW!!!! NOW! NOW!
I pray almost everyday to get cancer.
Hi Run4TheHills,
If you’re praying for a terminal illness, there’s a definite problem. There’s a third option to dying and staying in this relationship: divorce. Marriage to these women can be like a slow, long psychological death (rather like certain forms of cancer), so why not cut the tumor out?
Yes it will be difficult and painful for both you and your children, but so is remaining in an abusive relationship. I know it isn’t easy, but the price of freedom, the eventual peace of mind and ability to enjoy life again is so very worth it.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Divorce, agreed.
Once you decide to take control of your destiny and take the first step…like meeting with a lawyer…you’ll be surprised how quickly your feelings of helplessness and despair will disappear.
Post-separation, you’ll be poor and you’ll miss living with your kids full time, but when you’re with them you’ll be walking tall. They’ll know it, you’ll know it, and it feels great.
You’ll be amazed at how much more enjoyable it is to spend time with your children when your ex isn’t off on the side treating you like a hand-puppet.
Your predicament seems overwhelming, but it isn’t.
JP
Thanks, JP. Glad you’re back.
Dr T
I agree do it
I lost count, some she doesn’t exactly fit into. Those she doesn’t fit into, her mother is a perfect fit. Her mother has most of these qualities too where applicable (obviously not the sex one). My gf complains about her mother’s behaviors and turns around and does the same crap. Point is, i don’t know if this kind of behavior is picked up by daughters or if its hereditary, but it’s something to think about. I know my gf has 3 older brothers, all seem rather level headed and fairly passive, just as their father. I’m the same way, probably a characteristic that plagues most men that stay in relationships with women like this.
I’m considering breaking up. Either I’m in denial, or conditioned, but my gf doesn’t seem completely EXTREME, but mostly there, we’ve talked about our problems and sometimes she can talk fairly about it…right now we are on a mutual “break” which just means we only see each other one day a weekend and she still calls and texts b/c she doesn’t have or isn’t close to any friends, except for one living 5 states away. Even then, they only talk once every few weeks.
I feel ya dude. Remember that most of the time girls turn out to be a lot like their mother whether they like to admit it or not. With your situation you have to think why she doesn’t have any close friends. Just dump her and get on with your life. It will be the best decision you ever made. I too am in a effed up situation. Been dating this girl for 7 months, and for the past 2 months she has been non-stop asking me to move in with her, even though I’ve told her numerous times I’m not ready yet. She has been married 3 times and has 3 kids, one doesnt live at home. I’ve never been married, and I don’t want kids of my own. She gets 12 of the situations above, even though I point out things like this to her, she gets p***ed off and flies off the handle and accuses me of being an a-hole. She brings up my ex’s non-stop and points out why I was the cause of the break ups in those relationships, even if my ex gf make some other dude stick his dong in her. She gets extremely jealous if a female talks to me or if a female friend calls. She gets angry when I hang out with my friends and accuses them of being gay. Everything started out awesome and I thought I finally found the one. But about 4 weeks ago we stopped having sex and she started getting angry over the slightest thing, ie, not responding to a text while i’m at work, friends calling me, me not pumping her gas, etc. I’m dumping her today.
OK – I got 7, and several others would have fit, if worded slightly differently. Been married 20 years – I had no idea what was going on until recently, I just thought that’s the way it was with women. Don’t know what I will do – will take a major hit with a divorce and I am not that young to start over, but what the hell. What made me reply to your post was the comment about accusing your friends of being gay – she pulled that crap on me. LOL – what a joke.
I do everything and I make all the money. And we have no sex. My question is, what do I get out of this – answer: nothing. I do feel sorry for her though, because she is screwed up. Good luck to everyone on here.
Don’t be stupid like me, don’t waste your life away. Get out now while you still can.
good call doc, i feel that now every day even after five years of the abuse, i say what i feel now , don’t have to edit my conversation with anyone. my kids are still too young i feel to bring new woman over so I just golf and have dinner with ladies when I’m alone. What age do you think it’s appropriate to introduce a new woman into childrens lives. of course the wife has had many men over and the kids have seen many movies at the theater at their expense, this is confusing them but at least they see what i see and will make the right choice hopefully when they are older. Thanks for your forum as it is saving lives,not just bad times but actually making men healthier by the minute.
I had a buddy that when I would ask him how he was doing, he would reply, “I’m looking forward to death.” Now he has a terminal illness, a long drawn out terminal illness. He was hospitalized for weeks at a time. I would ask him if his wife visited. He said she did a couple of times a week, but she was busy.
Be carefull with the divorce option. The courts have an extream bias towards women and you could lose bigger then you ever imagined. My best advice is to plan any divorce you intend on initiating carefully with a lawyer before you ever mention it to your wife.
I am deffinently in a bad situation. I could answer yes to a lot of them not so much the stalker stuff. definitely not getting sex which is extremely hard for me to deal with as she cheated on me a few years back.Now I feel I’m becoming crazy. my situation is a little different as we have 2 kids together house and 8 years of a relationship but I’m not married. and I’m only 25. I can’t leave because I don’t want to give up on all that I have accomplished let me repeat the I have accomplished. and being only 25 it hasn’t been easy to support a family and accomplish the things I have especially with her fighting every step of the way. don’t understand why she cant sit back and enjoy the ride quietly. Also not sure how that would
legally work out. definitely couldn’t
afford the child support thing and
obviously with her there would be no
working it out.
Glad i’m not the only one who has thought that cancer would be better than a relationship with a crazy ass woman. There have been nights where I have went to sleep hoping and praying that I wouldn’t wake up the next day. Thats how you know your wife is insane, where death is the only way out of the marriage and you fully accept it.
Hi Richter,
Death is not the only way out. You can leave. Even if you have children, you can leave. If the choices are divorce or death, choose divorce. You just may find you have a reason for living once you’re away from the source of your misery.
wow lol just read this comment after my first divorce and onto my second marrage and this is hillarious because ive jumped out of the frying pan into the fire with this one lol
answered yes t o l i p s t i c k as well. omg
I knew it and I wish I came across this site earlier. My wife displays most of these signs other than the red lipsticks. Talk about pathological jealousy .. today I suggested to an old lady who was the owner of a grocery store we shopped at, that it was cold and she should get a small heater …. my wife lost it and called me a disgusting bastard and accused me of chatting up another women! My conversation was less than 5 sentences about the weather and a heater.
It’s been 3 years now of living hell and being cut off from my family and friends 🙁
I can answer yes to at least 8 she has driven me from my family and hates all my friends and throws shit fits if I want to go have a guys weekend. I’m accused of horrible things by her and told I’m worthless lazy and a gd fat ass almost weekly. Except the ups and downs are over now we seem to be on a downward plung. If only I didn’t find her so sexuall but I will survive. She has to go.
Forgot to add that what really upset me was because of the conversation about the weather and a heater, my wife threatended to abort our unborn child (only 3 months) and apparently it is *my* baby not hers.
Hi ST,
That’s awful. Unfortunately, once you have a child with a woman like this, you’re pretty much screwed in that she will continue to use your son or daughter as a device to control, manipulate and hurt you. This is only the beginning. What are you going to do or have you resigned yourself to this life?
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Can they medication for this?
this is my life except i will not marry her, she wont leave, she hates my family because of what color outfit they got for my daughters bday claiming it was a puke green color and that they purposely buy our daughter boy colored clothes when in fact it is a girls outfit. stupid how my brother has a baby 6 months after us and to my girl its all about what baby gets what and what color it is. so dumb. and now im in a tough rut. shes tellin me shes goin to change my babies last name if she leaves, shes going to move far away. ruin my under the table job for me. everything to ruin my life if i get her to leave me. im miserable everyday since my daughters first bday. 7 months later im still hearing crap about how my sick mother didnt make it to the party, but made it for the second born granddaughter. i think who cares but with my girlfriend, everything is on purposely done and my family hates my daughter, which is definitely not true but in her mind , the stupidest things mean you hate an innocent baby. Im a laidback kinda guy that doesnt like to start problems and hopes they blow over. but with my girl problems from years ago are always broughten up over and over and over again.
I wish sometimes I had the money for a lawyer and knew what steps i had to take so i could at least have joint custody of my daughter. its just ridiculous the way my girlfriend thinks. Oh my bad my FIance thinks. If i tell ppl she is my girlfriend i get bitched at for that. i mean its just ridiculous. I get texted at work 60-70 texts bitching about my family . Insane , the mental abuse i go thru.
And as soon as we get in argument she goes into bedroom with our daughter and sits with her back against door so i cant get in. NOw the last time i got tired of hearing my daughter crying so after a while i pushed door and of course my fiance pushed it back as hard as she could. It was like a tug of war battle just to get door open.
i had to open door theres no toys or anything for my daughter to do in my room besides go thru boxes of paperwork and destroy the room, cause theres no way my fiance was going to move from blockin door.
So anyway i got door open a smidge after the tug of war battle, and now my fiance is saying i hit her with door, and her back hurts and I am abusive.
she scares me, and posts on facebook to the world i abuse her, when really she is nuts in the head and only thinks a one way path.
and oh yeah forgot to mention this fact too, that her mother is bipolar also. so i think maybe genetically there could be something wrong and i really need to get outta this relationship or im doomed for life. ill probably end up in jail for flickin her on the wrist , its that bad.
please god or whoever , help me give me the strength to survive and be with my daughter i love her soo much and im being told now im a sperm donor. and yes thats what my fiance is telling my 1.5 yr old.
too much in my life to say, i would take a giant book with all the crap ive been put thru.
My heart goes out to you. Start a journal and document everything. Next, apply for legal aid. If you qualify….meaning you don’t own much of anything and your income is below a certain amount, you will get a lawyer to represent you in family court. Take her to court for joint custody. Every separation or divorce is ugly in it’s own way but look around you. Everyone gets over it. If legal aid is not available where you live, go to the courthouse and ask them how to start a custody case. You can actually do it yourself. You don’t even have to leave her to do this. Just explain to her that this is in the case that something happens between you, considering the problems in your relationship. If she freaks….call the cops out of concern for your child and document it. She will probably cite abuse as a reason you should not have custody.
My wife exhibits these first two on the list:
Does she fly into rages without warning over relatively trivial matters like a web page loading too slowly?
Are you always the scapegoat/bad guy whenever she’s frustrated, disappointed or just plain bored?
And doesn’t really exhibit any of the other characteristics (although I admit that I am often nervous that she will be inappropriate in front of others). I am trying to figure out what to do about it. I guess my question is, if she is an angry and over-emotional person at times (like 2 to 3 times a week), would you still recommend getting out of the relationship? Thanks.
Boy oh boy, did I experience quite a “deja vu” reading your post. And I think I figured out #1…the “trivial” stuff is what gets them going because it’s quick and easy–just like a TRIGGER! Whereas important stuff, like a discussion of finances, is avoided because CALM, rational talk is necessary. Here’s a simple example…
I’ve been unemployed for quite a few months, thanks to the economy. If I go to Home Depot and spend $20 on something NEEDED for the house, I get the 3rd degree, “we don’t have the extra money”, etc. Yet, she’ll think nothing of blowing $100 on some “chotchkies” (definition: worthless knick-knacks). Or, she’ll send an extra hundred or two on credit card bills…not that reducing them isn’t important, but, at a time like this, we really can’t do it! But, again, it’s that CONTROL thing-do as I say, not as I do.
With regard to #2, yep, you’re always to blame…get stuck in traffic, it’s YOUR fault you went the way you did. Circumstances are meaningless, you are the problem.
You say you’re nervous in public with her…ah, the classic “walking on eggshells”. And yes, even if you don’t wind up the target of her detonation, you’re sure to be embarrassed by her behavior.
Hi RF,
I don’t have enough information to advise you one way or the other. I encourage you to read more posts here and from other resources and see if it continues to resonate.
Maybe she just has an anger management problem. Or, perhaps, she has bigger issues.
Sorry I’m not able to provide more insight.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
holy shit, i answered yes to more than half of them. here’s the next step…how the hell do i get OUT of this relationship?
Hi Scott,
Is this a rhetorical question or do you really want to know?
Best,
Dr Tara
Dr T, I second Scott’s question. I don’t think of that as rhetorical. I’d REALLY like to know some specifics. I can’t wrap my mind around the ‘break-up talk.’ Scares me to death. I’m not suffering physical violence or fearing for my safety (though a little voice does tell me to be careful), so when is it ok to just leave? Leave a note. Seems cowardly to me, but I entertain those thoughts.
Kent Kent Kent! Cowardly? man o man I would call it heroic…leaving a note. Ya always hear of the guy who just went out for a loaf of bread or a pack of cigarettes and was never heard from again. Imagine the restoration of self esteem that would trigger. I guess tho, you could keep dickin around until your like me…..15 years of wasted life….I’m finally free from the shedevil. Many regrets for not leaving after the first whacky episode.
As I keep reading through these comments I just feel more and more like this is my situation. Sometimes I want to leave but feel like I can’t because I’d basically have to wait until she’s gone (stay at home wife who doesn’t do the housework) and then get everything I care about keeping out otherwise she’ll destroy it , I can’t kick her out with no place to go, and then i’d be afraid of her breaking in later, or she’s expressed suicidal tendencies before, i guess when i consider leaving i get overwhelmed with everything. at the same time i don’t know how much more of this i’ll put up with to be with a woman i love (i thought unconditionally), i think i need help but don’t know if i should go to a psycologist or the police
Ive answered yes to most of these questions. The scary part about this is that i am so in love with her that i struggle to break away from this. She keeps saying that because i wont commit to her that she has every right to be like this, and if we were in a relationship, she would be a lot different. Could this be true? I seriously doubt it after reading these posts. She also has this sexual knot on me that i cant seem to let go of. Im a man after all and i have desires.
they get worse after marriage, because now they feel they’re entitled to treating you worse, after all it would take alot more for a divorce than a breakup.
They get MUCH WORSE after marriage because the system is slanted to benefit them. Trust me, the canard of “men won’t commit” is a ruse to convince men to enter into binding contracts with the mentally insane. RUN BROTHER! God bless.
Genius! Well said!
GET THE HELL OUT NOW!!!!!!! My wife will not believe that I love her. I’m 5 years in and my story (as far as HELL on earth craziness) is nothing less than extraordinary. I have had most of the items on this list, and it feels far more not even mentioned. Blame is always the name of the game, and it’s not her, it’s you (us), men etc. I’ve gotten better, she’s gotten worse. Just saw this site today in desperation cause I told her 2 days ago I want a divorce, I want you to move out, I will not explain, it is not negotiable. After 5 years of seeing through her insecurity and her bullshit, she admits shes the problem, but this is only been her behavior as I’m about out the door. LOOOONNNNNNGGGGG story short, it is not your fault if she refuses to deal with her own insecurity. No matter what you do, now matter how far, she will accuse you, she will judge you, she will fuck with your mind until it’s gone if you let her. Don’t get sucked in. If you really love her. Get real, get counsel, and work this shit out starting tonight with support so that whatever issues ( hurts, fears, insecurities ) get dealth with in mature order. Or else, like my case, they will not change, they will only grow more unbearable, become even more unreasonable, and even harder to “solve”. Bottom line, you can’t do her, you can only do you. You’ve still got the freedom to choose what you will tolerate and why. There is no law against love. But true love will not allow abuse, no matter where it’s coming from or where it’s going. Don’t get sucked in.
By the by, if this has no bearing in your situation, appologies, but beware it could very well be the case. Find out before you proceed, or risk ending up like so many miserable men, wishing against reason for death due to one HELL of a reltaionship. Nuff said!?
Oh my god, I knew what I was dealing with was BS. My gut always told me I am doing nothing wrong and I would get angry. Then I would just think to myself, well, now you just have to deal with this until the kids get older. What a way to live, dreading almost every day except spending time with the kids. I love my kids so much 4 1/2 and 17 months. Why just last Monday I was helping at our church to move into a new building, she knew I was there, cleaning up, moving chairs, painting, etc. Then when I got home @ 8:30 got the cold shoulder. Then she woke me up at 11:30 to argue about why I was there so long. So as every other time trying to “CLEAR UP” what I was doing helping at a church mind you, she says she is moving out on Saturday.
Well she has used leaving with the kids in the past as a way to get what she wants. I have since snapped Tuesday and basically told her not to wait until Saturday to move out. My gosh, I was helping at our church. I can never do anything right, like I’m never spending time with my friends, then when I do I’m in trouble. I have been blamed for having an affair, I have been blamed for not ever wanting to go out to eat, I have been blamed for so many things, its hard to keep track.
The few days of her moving out she is already telling me I can’t see my girls. This sucks, I don’t know what to do, my emotions are all over the board. I heard a little toddler talking at the store and I wanted to cry. I hate this.
The crazyness started at the start of the relationship, I should have went with my gut feelings back then.
I am seeing a counselor provided by my work tomorrow because I don’t know what to do. I used to be so happy go lucky and high self esteem never needing a counselor in the past, and this woman has brought me to my knees.
Oh, and I answered yes to way to many of those.
I need a hug.
Thanks, dave
Hi Dave,
You need to contact some father’s rights organizations and find yourself an attorney who specializes in this. As awful as she was to you while you were together, if she’s already threatening you with your kids this early on, you need to protect yourself as best as you can. Have you spoken with your family and friends about what’s going on? I’d give them a head’s up because your ex is sure to make the rounds badmouthing you to anyone who will listen.
I’m very sorry to read about what you’ve been going through. It’s not right. Does anyone else who’s been in a similar situation have advice for Dave?
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Yeah, I’ve got some advice for Dave. After he gets his hug-grow some testicles. She will beat him to death with the kid threats because she knows it is the only way to rip him apart. What would I do? I’d tell her that I want the divorce done as quickly as possible and just tell me where to send the child support checks. I’ll see the kids when their 18. Yeah, Sure, it’s an unrealistic bluff (for him) but if done correctly it would turn her on her heels within a week! This blasted game with the kids in the middle only works because WE AS MEN LET IT! What ensues is years of paying child support while trippin over her latest weiner to see our kids. I say SCREW it! Have a nice life lady! In my case I mean it. Ten to 16 years goes by fast. Those kids will be well aware of what a wack their mother is by 18. They will be more than willing to have a relationship with their REAL DAD by that point. I’m dead serious. Pull the rug out! Or at least run the bluff….ya can always reverse course.
Dave,
A threat to keep you from your children is a declaration of war. It is cruel and dirty.
Go straight to the toughest lawyer you can find. Do not pass Go, Do Not Collect $200.
JP
.
Dave I feel for you. Sounds exactly like my wife, you can NEVER do anything right in her eyes. I have not contacted ANY of my friends since my relationship with my wife (then girlfriend) for 5 years now. I only see my parents/family about once a month. If i try to see them more often, or even try calling, its all hell break loose.
If I go to a shop and the shop assistant is female, I’m accused of wanting to have an affair with that shop assistant even if I just say “Thank you”. If I got to a restaurant and I look a waitress in the eyes while ordering, my wife storms out of the place accusing me of wanting an affair or chatting up.
Then she tells me I dont take her out – you guess why!?
Now that I am always sitting at home, just yesterday she saw my playing an online war game that allowed me to chat with other players. All hell broke lose and again, I am accussed of flirting with girls. I told her to read my text conversations and her answer was she refuses to read it, if I’m not flirting just then, I was before or will in the future.
I KNOW it is not me. I was raised in a healthy, normal family. I had strong friendships and high self esteem and was always positive in outlook on life. But these days, I keep feeling bitter and starting to think dying is better if not for my ageing parents and our yet to be born baby.
These days, I am too afraid to even take a walk, or put out the garbage without letting her know in case she accuses me of seeing somebody in my few minutes of absence.
I pray to God every night for an answer, but there’s none forthcoming, at least that I can understand.
Hi ST,
Divorce is a better option than death. Protecting yourself and preserving your sanity does NOT, I repeat, NOT make you a bad guy. Another reader, John, posted recently how there is a double standard in that women who divorce abusive husbands are viewed as heroic; whereas men divorce abusive wives are viewed as spineless deserters and slimeballs.
Given this popular distortion, I think it is far more courageous for men to make this choice because they receive far less support and become the recipients of further abuse by family law and the courts.
I encourage you to stop praying to God and consult with a good attorney. Do you want to spend the next 18 years of your life like this? You owe it to yourself and to your unborn child to be a strong, healthy and happy man and parent.
Just my 2-cents.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
I used to work with a woman who I now recognise as major BPD, anyway her boyfriend was not allowed to even look at another woman, no matter who, even if the woman is talking to him. She did this to him & her housemate, a much older lady anyway, & he made the grave error of looking at his girlfiend’s housemate whilst they were conversing & that was it. She was wild, he was in the dog house! Unbelievable & we found out later she was hitting on our boss around the same time! She wore the bright lippy too!
To add to the story (it was number of yrs ago), it wasn’t only that the boyfriend couldn’t look at other women. Her housemate told me the 3 of them were having a few drinks socialising at their place at a table, & the boyfriend had to CONSTANTLY have his eye balls on his gf ‘admiring her’ even when said housemate is talking to him! She said she had to talk to the back of his head most the night! He looked at the housemate for a few moments once, & that spelled the end of their evening! This woman, as I say made a play for the boss who’s partner told us about it. She told the boss they’d be great together they’re both ‘so powerful’ how deluded she was! This same woman caused utter chaos in our office. Ended up fired for being so bitchy, competitive, jealous, etc. Unbelievable, she eavesdropped on me confiding to a coworker that I was uncomfortable facing her in a sales contest the next day I had no choice in & my misgivings about her conduct, & I got daggers from her for weeks! Crazy stuff. She came to our super casual work parties dressed up like you wouldn’t believe with brightest lipstick.
The reason I came here was due to my partner of 10 years displaying BPD signs, however I realise now his symptoms are nothing compared to his psycho mother who only 1 out of her 4 kids will even speak to. She totally damaged their trust in women & humans in general & to this day will not even admit the things & cruel behaviour she committed. This stuff really affects people long-term. I realise my partner displays the signs but is also reasonable & can admit it. But he has some responses ingrained due to his childhood.. If I had his family life growing up with her, wow I don’t know how I’d have coped.. Constant drama, blaming ,denial, conflict non-stop. He stopped all contact with her when she started picking on me behind my back for no reason at all, other than I wasn’t ‘good enough’ for her son. I was too skinny & her other son’s partner was too fat!
THIS B I G HUG to you Dave from cold England : )
Don`t worry, she`ll soon get fed up with the kids and want you around babysitting.
PS for some reason these people with BS etc are VERY VERY selfish!
Hi Dave,
i small piece of advice, leave now! I mean run now! I did what you said, stayed for the kids and now they are teenagers. She has the kids wrapped around her finger and when i decided i had enough which has been so many times, the kids blame me for not saying sorry to whatever the problem with their mother is. I mean, the kids don’t care that she is wrong, they just me to fix it. I was kicked out last year and i rented an appartment and my wife said to my kids and everyone she knows that i abandoned them. The kids wanted nothing to do with me.tried calling everyday, when i would text them i would get told off. when i confronted her about the kids attitudes her answer was “i can’t control how they think”, makes me sick. i eventually went back because she was suicidal and drinking everyday and was begging me to go back and things would change. 1 week after i went back, the same routine continued. And the frosting on the cake, my kids are emotionally scarred and look at me as i’m the bad guy.
Damn Dave, are we married to the same woman? I don’t know how many times I’ve been doing something completely innocent and good, like you were doing at your church and then I get my balls busted when I get home. And what is it with the big discussions right when you’re falling asleep? She loves to do that, I guess because I am out of it and can’t think clearly. I hope you were able to get out of that sham of a marriage and keep your kids. I’m headed toward the same road soon.
You’re more vulnerable when you’re tired. Also, depriving you of sleep weakens you, which also makes you an easier target. Also, it seems like many of the ones who engage in “midnight feeding frenzies” are also SAHMs. They’re at home all day, while you’re out working, inventing reasons to be aggrieved, then they clobber you with it when you’re trying to wind down from the day. An excellent reason for these women to go out in the world and do something productive, like, say, get a job.
I think the quiz actually leaves out a few important points. a) Does she refuse to get an outside job? b) Does she exaggerate medical symptoms for herself or the kids? c) The lipstick may not be crooked but the makeup is overdone. d) Does she purposely make herself dependent on others, eg. refusing to learn to drive?
Anyway, to all of you men that choose to stay with her for whatever reason. Your assets will increase and those in Ontario are entitled to half your assets, and half your income. She will find another sucker and take your money anyway, as long as she can. My guy’s X is taking home more than he is what with support and the new sucker’s income. He bought her a nice house….lol and she never had a job outside the home for more than 18 years with 2 children ten years apart. She napped every day and had to be home for Jerry Springer. The oldest child is an adult at 23 and she has turned him against his Dad, even though she screwed around on him. Go figure. To this day, if I say something that Steve perceives as criticism, he gets totally defensive and we may end up arguing. An unexpected phone call from me during the day, has his guts clenching and his pulse racing as he wonders what new catastrophe is in store for him. I know that everyone has their own baggage but my guy is so damaged by this woman that it interferes with us. Guys, get out before this woman damages both you and your children irreparably. Trust me. You don’t want to see your daughter turn into her, and on your own, you can provide an example that will offset the poison coming from the other side.
Thanks for the feedback Mike911. I have a question for you and everyone. I dated my wife for 3 years before marriage and have been married for about a year. At this point she wants to have kids and I also would like children. But before I read this site I had a nagging feeling about how appropriate it would be for her to raise children with an anger problem. She even admits that she has an anger problem and says she is trying to control it but simply cannot sometimes. When I read the above I guess she is a crazy bitch if I need to ask the question as Dr. T says. But really she only has the first two issues going on and the quiz says she is a crazy bitch if she has more than 2 of the characteristics. Quite the opposite actually exists for me. She is very good about sex. She likes when I spend time away because she wants me to do what I want. She doesn’t hold any grudge about it. Etc. etc. She just has a crazy inexplicable anger problem and I am often the blame for her anger even when it makes no rational sense.
So here goes the question I am having at this time: Do I have kids with her?
Reading all of the comments I think I am walking into a mine field. I wonder if others guys were like me in that their wife/girlfriend only had the anger problem and later developed into the psycho exhibiting all the other problems on this list? I grew up in a relatively stable family and am not used to all these fights/problems. I need help/insight!
Hi RF,
I would suggest that if you’re going to stay with this woman and if you’re going to have children with her that she address her anger issues before conception. First, if you have any doubts re: staying with this woman, you probably want to think long and hard about kids. Second, her anger issues won’t get better on their own after you have a child, they’ll get worse. Kids are stressful and exhausting, which will shorten your wife’s already short fuse considerably. Saying, “I need to work on my anger problem” and doing something about it aren’t the same thing.
RF, do some more reading. There are other posts on this site. Read the ones about professional victimhood, emotional bullies, and 13 signs of being an NPD/BPD. To see if she’s really serious about working on her issues, tell her you want to see a therapist with her. Calmly explain you have some concerns re: having kids because of the conflict in your relationship and aren’t comfortable with starting a family until you both understand whats going on. Try to be as gentle and non-blaming as possible. If she flips out on you again, it doesn’t bode well for things to come.
Meanwhile, make sure she’s using birth control or you take responsibility. This is usually when “accidents” happen.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Dr. T,
I stumbled onto your website. You have given some very helpful and insightful information. I answered Yes to 6 of these questions.
Its still hard for me to imagine my wife as a BPD because she seems so passive aggressive. But then again I’ve always compared my wife to her sister, who is a truly obnoxious, histrionic, berating and self-centered slob. My wife (soon to be ex) reacts more by sulking and withdrawing affection. I’ve felt like I had to walk on eggshells around her for years, as nothing I did was enough. Just having her out of the house for the past 4 weeks has been liberating. Not coming home and worrying and stressing about what I need to do for her , “is it ok for me to go play my guitar?”, or is she going to get mad because I’m not sitting in the room with her while she watches one of her shows on TV despite being disengaged from me – freedom from this is great.
The guy who divorced her sister told me that it was like an anvil being removed from around his neck when he obtained the divorce. That he was married to a “real woman” now and life is great.
I’m actually going through the divorce right now . . . . you’re website is very helpful with moving forward and seeing some of the things I should not have put up with, but did, for over 10 years.
Thank you.
Hi John,
Thanks for the positive feedback and congratulations on removing your “anvil.” I’m sure you’ll get through the divorce process, with all its ups and downs, and appreciate your new found freedom. Once you’re finally rid of her, you’ll wonder why you waited so long.
I have a friend whose ex didn’t like it when he played the piano to relax after a stressful day. He’s apologetic about his piano playing, thanking me for “tolerating it” and “letting him” play. I love music and think it’s a gift to have it in my life. It just goes to show how sick and abusive these women are that they can’t stand it when you express your creativity and take care of or uplift yourself. They want to anchor you down in the barren wasteland with them.
Thanks again, John. I wish you the best with your new lease on life minus the ex-wife!
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Dr. T,
Thanks for the encouragement. We have two girls. I’ve read a lot of posts from guys worrying about their children. One thing I’ve learned in the past 10 weeks: the time I’ve had with my kids since this started is ten times the quality time than when my wife was around and constantly undermining me.
Whatever time you have with your children after the divorce is going to be more time with them than when you were married !!!
One thing I’m trying to come to grips with is how I let my wife treat me the way she has for so long. If someone was “coming at me” I would normally not back down from a fight or an argument. With her, she would never address anything I said substantively. I was always being told my “tone” was bad. My facial expressions were “like a kick in the stomach to her.” I remember her one time telling me that I never said anything bad, but it was the way I said it. She has had me trying to behave in a “non-defense provoking, corporate-like” manner at home for several years now.
First of all, I’m not an obnoxious, cantankerous, bullying litigator but a rather calm and quiet regulatory attorney – I don’t go to court and argue cases. I finally started to defend myself against some of her complaints – the response was “there you go again, throwing it back at me.” I could never win. She had me thinking I was crazy, an extremely difficult person to be around, and needed therapy. I ended up calling and talking to some of my friends just to ask if I’m really that difficult a person to get along with. The self doubt and self-questioning I put myself through has been very painful.
Keep up the great work. You are giving more help to people than you probably realize.
John,
After reading your posts I see a similarities between your soon to be ex and my wife.
I wonder if she might be BPD because she seems to fit the criteria but, absent the narcissistic rage. She is more likely to act like she doesn’t care whether I’m around. She’ll ignore me and spend hours watching TV or reading. This past month after I spend 5 days in Michigan, visiting my family and hunting, she barely acknowledged me when I got home. She instead talked on the phone all evening. When later questioned her about that, she said she didn’t recall acting that way that evening.
She seems to go through cycles of days or weeks where she will be cold and distant. If I ask her how she is doing your response will be a sharp “I’m fine”. If I try to kiss here she turns away from me. Then the next day she’ll be affectionate with me, sometimes to the point of being clingy.
Things can seem fine and then something will happen, I’ll say or do something that she doesn’t like, and then like flipping a switch, back to cold and distant.
I really get the feeling that I’m married to two different women. On the good days or weeks, I feel loved and am optimistic about working things out. The bad days or weeks are very lonely and it like she doesn’t care anymore.
She wasn’t always like this (or I didn’t notice. Love can blind a man.) It seems to have developed and become more acerbated over the 11 years we’ve been together. Looking back now, I can see it progress in her actions and words.
Anyway, without going into all the details, I’d really like to know, from the readers and Dr. T, are there other disorders/conditions that share similarities with BPD that develop and become worse over time?
Can some be like a BPD without being having BPD? Would that affect the way one should deal with that individual and the likelihood of healing the relationship with that person? Is she just a High-Functioning BPD?
Also, for John specifically, did your wife’s BDP-ness seem to become progressively worse over time or was it also there?
Again, John thanks your posts. Dr. T, thanks for the blog.
Hey B.E.C.,
It’s interesting how you come to this site and see posts by other guys and see a lot of the same thing over and over. It’s a great eye-opener to see that you aren’t alone and that the problems in your marriage really are not 100 percent your fault.
“Also, for John specifically, did your wife’s BDP-ness seem to become progressively worse over time or was it also there?”
Honestly, I don’t think my X is BPD (my divorce was finalized on 9/10). Sure some of her behaviors fall into the above descriptions listed by Dr. T. However, when I read the definition and diagnostic criteria of BPD I think of psychotic, over-the-top wacko devoid of reality, and she is not that. However, I could probably add a seventh because she did have this strange preoccupation with red lipsticks and would talk about her “lips” when referring to getting her red lipstick on. No kidding!!
I do believe she is a narcissist and was emotionally abusive to me. A therapist has unambiguously told me that she is a narcissist and her treatment of me was emotionally abusive and emasculating. That, the confirmation I’ve received from this site, and also talking to my family and friends (is that consensus seeking?) are enough validation for me. For me personally, I don’t feel a compelling need plug my X into a specific cluster B personality disorder to come to grips with the demise of our marriage. I did a lot of journaling; writing many of the things down that she did, talking about it with a therapist and family, comparing it to the blogs and posts on this site, and I realized how bad the marriage and treatment of me was. I don’t recall where I read this, but someone wrote something about the golden rule in reverse. Is your wife treating you the way you would treat someone else? I know mine didn’t. I’ve also learned to look in the mirror and understand that I let her act that way to me; a mistake I’m determined not to make in the future.
To answer your question more directly, I’m not sure she became “worse.” I think I became more and more drained to the point where I couldn’t give anymore. The marriage just deteriorated and once she decided it was over – it was over. I think she was all take and no give, so when I hit that point she was done. That is what she told me: “I’m done.” She never came out and said she wanted a divorce. She initiated and started the process. I had thought for years I would wait until my girls were 18 and then I would just file and have her served. She truly did me a favor; I clearly see that now. I look at some of the pictures of me over the past year (I’ve started dating and was looking for some pictures to put on an online site) and I think I look flipping crazy in some of them. It’s frankly disturbing.
Your wife’s behavior sounds very strange to me. She sounds very cold and unaffectionate. I never really thought of my X as flipping an affection switch on or off, but it is an accurate analogy. Do you have any children? I think a lot my X’s anger had to do with an inability to cope with parenting. It was as if she was just angry like a spoiled brat because she actually had to work and was not going to be taken care of by her mother now that she had children and was married. I was always jumping through hoops because whatever I did was never enough. She literally was furious that I did not get a six figure a year job so that she could stay home and not work. I think she wanted me to mother her and essentially be a co-wife. Whenever I didn’t do something or enough of whatever the hell she wanted, she would pout, sulk and withdraw. I remember her yelling at me one time “do I have to yell at you like I’m your mother in order to get you to do what I want you to do.” My X primarily sulked, pouted and withdrew affection, but I have received many ass-chewings too. Many were just bizarre and completely out of the blue. I still can’t believe I put up with that crap.
Does your wife do anything else to mess (f&%^) with you? I think many have experienced the denial of saying things, changing their stories, “twisting words like crazy pretzels.”
Does your wife have any empathy for you? For example, I have a bad back and herniated a disc 17 years ago. I stay in shape, workout and stretch regularly, which is how I keep healthy. I don’t have to take pain pills. Typically 2 or 3 times a year I will do something; pick weeds, bend over and pick up a toy or tool, twist the wrong way, and boom I’ll have spasms for 1 or 2 days. I’d sit in the recliner and use the heating pad, take some ibuprofen, stretch and get over it in a couple of days. But for one or two days I’m not jumping through hoops – now I’m not an invalid, but I’m in pain and I want and need to sit in my chair and crank the Thermafore heating pad. X would get really pissed at that and complain. “When are you going to be better? What did you do? Why did you do that? You are always doing this or you are sick? When is this going to be over, it’s making my job with the children more difficult.” The pouting, sulking and dirty looks would come on strong. Summer before last, I was really stressed by her as she wanted me to get a 6-figure job so she could stay home and not work. I was having more episodes, and even muscle spasms in my chest. Dr. T has a blog about this crap affecting you physically – I think its true. X had virtually no empathy. Nothing. Her servant was not serving and she was pissed. I can’t imagine telling my X when she was sick, having allergies, or cramps “when are you going to get better? I’m having to watch the kids, it’s making my home time difficult and I’m not getting to play my guitar.”
I’ll tell you what though, it’s great to get your “man card” back. Some of my buddies have been jacking me about that – this is a good thing brother. I went hunting in South Texas last weekend and it was GREAT! I did not worry about getting back early in order to make sure I smoothed things over because she watched the kids for two days. No pouting or that cold, distant, forlorn look on her face. That “poor me, I’m a sacrificing victim” demeanor because she was with the children for two days. Oh and the hunting was good too! Now that deer season has started, I’m going again.
I know it’s many many mohths past on this blog, but rereading these articles is sometimes helpful. When I came across this,
“I’ve also learned to look in the mirror and understand that I let her act that way to me; a mistake I’m determined not to make in the future.”
it HIT HOME HARD. This is where I’m stuck on right now. My divorce finalized March 2010. What I’ve been dealing with is how I could have allowed such bad behavior to me FOR SO LONG AND ALMOST RIGHT FROM THE START? What is wrong with me? Normally I don’t allow people — male or female — to mistreat me. Something about the sexual nature of that relationship I think provided the environment for me to tolerate the CONTINUALLY WORSENING treatment over 18 years. I guess that’s what I need to figure out for me personally. Maybe others of you have been through this and have some pointers.
Regards
holy crap…..ditto …I feel like you,I was just drained at the end,she sensed it told and her her big quotes were”we love each other but were not in love”,”Im done””Own my half….”the last one cracked me up/baffled me the most…I honestly tried loving her til the end and I even asked for 6 more months(but then it hit me…Ive given all I could..)and if anyone was done it was me…according to her..I never “maxed out” on all of the potential I had,I wasnt passionate enough for her,etc…this site and stories /comments are amazing…Im divorced 3+months and some of the crap/physical/mental abuse I took….what the hell happened??????
Thanks for putting so much effort into your post. Your words are truly a mirror to my own experience. I had fusions done in my neck and I remember her being pissed at my recovery rate….as for getting the man card back…nothing like 5 days in Cancun-my particular celebration!
John,
We don’t have any children. We did try but lost the baby at the beginning of the year. We had issues when we went to visit my family at Thanksgiving (she was pregnant then) which ended with her wanting a divorce and demanding that I drive her to the airport or else she’d walk there in the snow. She eventually drove back from Michigan in a rental car by herself and still states that I made her do it. The next two months were rough. Her mother past away then we lost the baby. We haven’t tried again because I insisted that we start marriage consoling again and work through our issues.
I fear that if we have a child and get divorced, I will have to fight to be a part of its life. She always referred to it as “her baby” even after I repeatedly asked her to say “our baby”. When we were about to go into her doctors for the second ultrasound, she felt the need to remind me that if she wanted she could have the doctor not allow me in the room for the ultrasound and not let me see the results.
We’d been to two marriage consolers before the pregnancy both of whom, she didn’t like. We stopped going to the second consoler because my wife wanted a separation. After we left the consolers office, she changed her mind.
She has stated she wanted a divorce several times over the past four years. I’d fight to keep her and the harder I tried the meaner she got, cursing and insulting me. When I’d give up and say yes, she’d change her mind.
Finally, after another round of her wanting a divorce and then changing her mind when I said ok, I wrote her a letter telling her what I needed to make our relationship work. Part of that was that the next time she wanted a divorce, she would be it. She hasn’t said it sense although, she have been very negative about our relationship. Even when things seem to be going good and we are having a good time, she’ll make a comment about how we never have a good time together or about how we won’t make it.
My wife does say things to mess with me. An example; when at therapy, the consoler asked use why we were still together. I said that it was because I loved my wife and was committed. She said she was still with me “because it’s convenient”. I later asked her about that she said she was just saying that to hurt me. When we were have a similar discussion between the two of us and she asked me why I was still with her, I gave the same response, and when I asked that same question to here, she said she was “letting it run its course”. When I asked why she never gives love as a reason for being with me she says that I should know that she loves me and that she shouldn’t have to say it.
A lot of the times after she says something that makes me think “WTF?, I’ll give her some space and try to bring it up at a later time. But, by the time she’s willing to talk she says she doesn’t remember it or that she’s over it by then. End of conversation.
It feels like she doesn’t apply the same standard to her behavior that she does to mine. She’ll make remarks about my mother in front of others but I can’t even ask her sister (who is no living with us) to not park on the grass without my wife telling me that that I’d better be polite when I do it. She can make fun where I’m from (Michigan) all she wants but I can’t say anything about where she is from (Haiti) without her getting defensive and argumentative.
She’ll often complain I don’t do something, such as house work, talking to her, my weight, taking her out, talking to her, etc. Once I make progress on the issue she is complaining of, she’ll start on the next.
One day, while she was complaining out us not going out enough, I suggested multiple things that we could together (Art exhibition, museum, movies, etc). She rejected my suggestion and later asked why I didn’t want to take her out.
As for empathy, it comes and goes with her affection. Sometimes should very caring but others she won’t. If I have a sore back and ask her for a back run she’ll respond, “What’s in it for me?” Other times it like she has to try uncaring. She’ll start to do something nice for me and then stop and say, “Why the hell am I doing that?”
She says that I don’t do anything for her but, every time I try to do something, she doesn’t want me to and usual says something along the lines of “No, you shouldn’t have to” or “It’s not your job”. When I do something (like fixing the toilet) and point it out to her, her response is that she never asked me to do it or that it doesn’t count because I something I should be doing anyways or that she could have hired somebody to do it.
She’ll often become angry or cold towards me if I spend more than a few hours with my friends or pursuing my hobbies. I.e. she’ll get mad when, once a month, I shot in a match at my gun club, which will last until about 2PM on a Sunday. On the day that I volunteered to enter the scores into the computer (at home), she kept asking when they were giving me for doing that and she said that I’d rather do that then spend time with her.
When we go out to my friends or see family, she is withdrawn and quiet. People ask me if there something wrong or if they said something to offend her. If it’s her friends and family, then she if very outgoing and talkative. When I asked her about this, she said that it was just the way she was and that I should learn to accept it.
I’ve been keeping a journal since January, to try to help me to sort things out. It’s interesting to see the way she transitions from cold & distant to the next day warm and friendly like nothing even happened.
Thanks for the feedback. Just writing this helps me to straighten things out in my mind.
Hey B.E.C
In one of your posts you said ‘I fear that if we have a child and get divorced, I will have to fight to be a part of its life’.
HERE IS WHY NOT TO HAVE CHILDREN WITH A BPD/NPD – I’m a living example.
Before I was locked out of the house last year my child was removed for a week and I was told to leave the house if I wanted to see my not yet 3 year old girl.
After I was locked out of the house some time later I had to go to court to gain any access at all after going 7 weeks and missing my daughter’s 3rd birthday – not even a phone call.
Before I had court ordered access my ex was telling everyone who would listen to her that I was a ‘flight threat’. Complete BS.
Since then I can not get any cooperation at all or any time other than the court ordered time with my now 4 year old.
I was unemployed this past summer and so I had plenty of time and saw my daughter a grand total of 12 days.
Recently I was told by my ex that ‘I’m getting all the access I am entitled to’.
My 4 year old daughter has made comments to me like – I have two dads now. I don’t have a home with you dad I just visit you I only have one home. And my favourite – dad, mom says all the stuff at my home is hers now. Still trying to figure out why she won’t return my underwear and winter boots.
I went at 2:45 pm to a 3:00pm Junior Kindergarten appointment and my ex was getting ready to leave – she had intentionally gone early to try to prevent me from seeing my daughter and participating in her education.
The other day dance class was canceled because the teacher was sick but even though my ex knows I drive 20km to go she didn’t call me to let me know. Of course as I am told biweekly – ‘I don’t have to do anything’.
I can not even get a phone call through to my daughter despite calling every weekend I don’t have her for almost a year now.
I could go on and on. And I won’t even get into the horrible BS that goes on in family court.
DO NOT HAVE A CHILD WITH THIS KIND OF WOMAN – DISASTER WAITING TO HAPPEN.
The joy is my daughter and I are closer than ever, my time with her is focused on her and we enjoy every second. I saw this crap coming and actually sacrificed work, my life to make sure I spent as much time with my little one and build a strong relationship.
Sadly at just over 4 years my daughter is already starting to resent her mother. I can’t imagine what things will be like when she is older – other than she will likely be living with her dad at 10 or 11.
Reading these comments from all you guys is making my blood boil and froth with venom. My wife and I have a one year old daughter… if the wife EVER pulls this s*** with me, manowar, there’s gonna be fireworks.
Dr T
This is so sad. I used to enjoy music and arts. These days if I express that I like such things, my wife comes out with “why? Who are you seeing?”. I enjoy learning new things, new languages and when I comment on wanting to learn something new she’ll say “Why? Are you seeing someone or need to impress someone?”
WHY is she behaving like this? Read my other posts, WHY is she like this? I can’t understand it. If she is so insecure yet so controlling, what is the point of being in a relationship at all?
Hi ST,
WHY is she behaving like this? Read my other posts, WHY is she like this? I can’t understand it. If she is so insecure yet so controlling, what is the point of being in a relationship at all?
A woman like your wife will only tolerate you having one interest; her. Friendships, family and leisure pursuits are seen as threats to her control and divert your complete attention away from her.
She doesn’t want a mutual relationship. She’s not capable of it. She wants and obedient handpuppet. Furthermore, even if you surrender your b@lls and totally submit to her dictates, she’ll then criticize you for having no backbone.
The only way to win is to stop playing. You need to make a choice about the kind of life you want and the kind of relationship you want to model for your child.
Best,
Dr T
I just found these articles and my jaw is on the floor! All of this applies to my life! I had no idea what I should do and have been laboring over divorce for YEARS! This comment you just left really resonated with me. My daughter is musically inclined and has learned to play on her own. My wife frequently makes her STOP playing the piano because it upsets her peace. I look at her in awe not knowing how to respond. I am currently in a 4 day silence fight because she will not let my kids go with me on a 4 wheeling trip. I guess she hates my family… AHHH! How maddening!
I hear you! The silent treatment is the ultimate isolation technique. Dr. T says prepare, prepare and prepare before you go into divorce because she will probably become unhinged…then again they’re always unhinged so it’ll be like normal. My record is 45 days of the silent treatment but it was aided by me being out of town so that record should have an asterisk…8) Good luck.
My son is with a woman who exhibits all the above traits (except for the lipstick one). He thinks he is in control because he’s learned to walk away whenever she gets upset — which is more and more frequent. He barricades himself in his room downstairs with the door locked, goes for a walk, or to a movie. She had been reeling him back in with niceness or aking cookies, but I feel those times are waning. None of us in the family can figure out “why” he would want to stay in such an abusive woman who is jealous, manipulative, and who is always criticizing him or getting mad and going into a rage!! Interestingly enough, the more he blocks her out, the more she seems to try to get into a fight with him. They’re going to counseling, but she finds fault with that constantly and doesn’t want to go. I feel it’s a matter of time before she’ll refuse to go. She attacks everything about him and their relationship (or lack of a relationship!).
Hi Janice,
I’m sorry to read about what your son and your family is going through because of his girlfriend. She probably tries to fight with him when he blocks her out because many of these women use conflict and anger to hook you in. They accuse you of crazy things and you defend yourself, which only prolongs the insanity.
The only defense is to walk away and stay away. Unfortunately, I don’t think counseling will help. These women often use therapy to blame and shame their partners into submission with the help of a bad therapist. And, if you should happen to find a good therapist who holds this kind of woman, she finds fault with the therapist and stops going.
You have my sympathy and sincere wish that your son comes to his senses very soon.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
I have 3 quick ones… they’re funny now since i’m out of the relationship, but they rattled around in my skull when they were happening.
1 – we’d be talking about some thing, and if my mindset was not completely in sync with hers (agreeing 100% with whatever she was saying), she’d snap at me, saying “don’t roll your eyes at me”. WTF? ummm…. i haven’t been 5 years old in a LONG time. trying to convince her that i kept eye contact the whole time, and that her accusation was completely unfounded, was like trying to teach calculus to a goldfish.
2 – so then the conversation would start to turn sour, and she’d accuse me of saying (x, y, z). of course i never said any of it, and would tell her so. so would then try to defend it, not even entertaining the possibility that she could have been mistaken. at which time i would calmly say, “no, i didn’t say that, not even close. you know how i know? because i’ve never even thought it”. at which point she would cross her arms and stare at the wall and pout… or fume.
3 – one night all of the planets aligned, and i got the opportunity to ask her that if i just simply gave in to anything she wanted and never stood my ground, would she would label me as a wimp and lose all respect for me as a man. and her answer was yes. i couldn’t beleive i actually got a thoughtful, insightful answer from her. but it was proof that no matter what i did, there would never be any peace.
the point of these snippets is that there never was a correct answer. i would be accused of being a heartless, self-centered bastard if i disagreed with her, or a complete wimp if i agreed with her. and it didn’t matter what i said, what stance i took in any given conversation or subject matter. she could have a sock puppet on her hand, call it my name, and i would take the brunt of a conversation that i was never a part of. it really was all in her head.
cue the circus music…
I had the exact same things happen to me with 1 and 2. I never tried #3.
The more I look back at these sorts of no-win scenarios, the more I’m convinced it was never about the answers (there are no right answers, as well you know), but more about her getting an attention fix. By bait and switch questioning, and the absence of right answers, she can play the game all night (and she often did, for nights in a row, despite knowing I had to go to work the next morning).
In addition to the attention you’re giving her, by playing these games, she gets the added benefits of (a) sapping all of your energy, and systematically destroying your defenses, and (b) getting you into a state of learned helplessness, where you become continuously more pliant.
Sometimes, I think it wasn’t even about her demands, but more about her enjoying the show of making her puppet dance.
Ah, good times.
Not.
they’re an attention junkie. the narcissistic supply really is like a drug. if they don’t get their fix, they act out, cause a scene, create falsehoods, manufacture drama, and then point the finger at everyone else but them. they will never take responsibility for the actions and words they use to manipulate. to them… the end justifies the means. it’s about winning at all costs, obtaining that fix. just like an addict… you can’t help them until they’re willing to help themselves. and if they don’t see it as any type of problem, then they will not change, no matter how devastating it is to them and to anyone that loves them. very sad but true…
for a guy that really cares deeply… it was a very tough lesson to learn.
Hi Kev and Freedom,
What these women do is far more toxic than putting you in a no-win, damned if you do-damned if you don’t situation. It’s a far more subversive variation called a double bind, a concept developed by anthropologist, Gregory Bateson:
“The double bind is often misunderstood to be a simple contradictory situation, where the victim is trapped by two conflicting demands. While it is true that the core of the double bind is two conflicting demands, the differences lie in how they are imposed on the victim, what the victim’s understanding of the situation is and finally, who (or what) imposes these demands upon the victim. Unlike the usual no-win situation, the victim is largely unaware of the exact nature of the paradoxical situation in which he or she is. The contradiction may be entirely invisible in its immediate context and therefore invisible to external observers, only becoming evident when some broader context is considered. Typically, a demand is imposed upon the victim by someone who they respect (a parent, teacher or doctor), but the demand itself is inherently impossible to fulfill, because some broader context forbids it. Bateson and colleagues defined the double bind as follows (paraphrased):
1. The situation involves two or more people, one of whom (for the purpose of definition), is designated as the “victim.” The others are people who are considered the victim’s superiors: figures of authority (such as parents), whom the victim respects.
2. Repeated experience: the double bind is a recurrent theme in the experience of the victim, and as such, cannot be resolved as a single traumatic experience.
3. A “primary injunction” is imposed on the victim by the others in one of two forms:
* (a) “Do X, or I will punish you”;
* (b) “Do not do X, or I will punish you.”
The punishment is assumed to be either the withdrawing of love, the expression of hate and anger, or abandonment resulting from the authority figure’s expression of helplessness.
1. A “secondary injunction” is imposed on the victim, conflicting with the first at a higher and more abstract level. For example: “You must do X, but only do it because you want to.” It is unnecessary for this injunction to be expressed verbally.
2. If necessary, a “tertiary injunction” is imposed on the victim to prevent them from escaping the dilemma.
3. Finally, Bateson states that the complete list of the previous requirements may be unnecessary, in the event that the victim is already viewing their world in double bind patterns. Bateson goes on to give the general characteristics of such a relationship:
1. When the victim is involved in an intense relationship; that is, a relationship in which he feels it is vitally important that he discriminate accurately what sort of message is being communicated so that he may respond appropriately;
2. And, the victim is caught in a situation in which the other person in the relationship is expressing two orders of message and one of these denies the other;
3. And, the victim is unable to comment on the messages being expressed to correct his discrimination of what order of message to respond to: i.e., he cannot make a metacommunicative statement.
Thus, the essence of a double bind is two conflicting demands, each on a different logical level, neither of which can be ignored or escaped. This leaves the victim torn both ways, so that whichever demand they try to meet, the other demand cannot be met. “I must do it, but I can’t do it” is a typical description of the double bind experience.
For a double bind to be effective, the victim must fail to see that the demand placed by the primary injunction conflicts with that of the secondary injunction. In this sense, the double bind differentiates itself from a simple contradiction to a more inexpressible internal conflict, where the victim really wants to meet the demands of the primary injunction, but fails each time through failing to see the situation’s incompatibility with the demands of the secondary injunction. Thus, victims may express feelings of extreme anxiety in such a situation, as they attempt to fulfill the demands of the primary injunction albeit with obvious contradictions in their actions.”
The fact that most of these women do this instinctively without premeditation is pretty frightening.
Best,
Dr T
it was all quite silly when it was happening, but it wasn’t a damned bit funny.
Ouch I too agree. This was performed many times to flawless perfection on me as well. Ouch, OUCH!
Dr. T, tell me if this is a good example of a double bind.
Let’s take something as simple a dinner. In the past few days, you’ve made steak, chicken, pork chops, and seafood. Today, you’re discussing dinner with your BPD, and they say “I’m sick of everything”. OK, so you suggest that you go out to eat…then you get the “we can’t afford it” statement.
Now you’re screwed either way…can’t cook at home, because “they’re sick of everything”…can’t go out to eat, as “we can’t afford it”. Either way, you’re never gonna hear the end of it…
Hi Mike91163,
Yes, this is a good example of a classic double bind situation. Double binds induce a sense of powerless and learned helplessness, which weaken you and make you more susceptible to her abuse and control.
Hope this helps,
Dr Tara
It seems I’m not the only one. Father of 3 here, and I wasn’t sure what I’d find when I googled, but … I can relate. I’m honestly not sure what to do. I’m constantly paralyzed, mentally. Finding myself in “twilight-zone” arguments. I’ve suddenly realized, my wife thinks she’s a gifted fortune teller, or psychic. I’ve literally left the room multiple times because I wasn’t even sure who, or what, she was even arguing with. The weird part is, in all of her grand accusations and assumptions, the person she seems to think I am… would be a serious asshole.
I have a strong mind. I have a lot of patience. I cannot seem to penetrate the attack/defense setting that she is stuck on, even with experimentation of flattery, etc. I can feel myself floundering. I’ve always considered it a point of strength to be able to deal with her insane versions of the past, or her insulting predictions of what I’m thinking…
I am in between personalities, one day shes venting all of her fears and worries and needs a shoulder, the next she’s demeaning me in front of the kids, again. I do have a weak spot, I hate being disrespected for no reason. But what can you do when she denies it? I don’t mean sort of denies it, I mean pathological liar denial.
I’m going to shoot myself out of the canon now, thanks for the circus music….
Very very frightening, indeed.
Actually, I have to laugh, because up until your last sentence, I was thinking “she’s not that talented to plot this all out in advance.” But you’re right. It’s instinctive, and on the fly. Amazing.
Thank you for this. It only helps explain things more and more.
In terms of “he cannot make a metacommunicative statement,” any attempts I made were met with continuous frustration, argument, rage, subterfuge, and misdirection. I was suddenly the “bad guy” for “attacking” poor, helpless, her.
I’m almost at 8 months no contact.
Life returns a bit more each day.
Kev, 8 months no contact and life is returning?!….that scares the crap out of me. 8 months and this is still not history for you. I am finding it real tough I admit and am now 14 days (yes Im counting them!) away from her, only 4 days without hearing from her. I know I must must must get away from her and I am trying, but 8 months?!! oh god….
Hey Simon…
Just saw your reply now, my apologies for not responding sooner. Yeah, it was 8 months when I posted that. I’m now at almost a year. Things are progressing. Is my life entirely back? No. But I am better, and stronger than I’ve been in a long, long time.
I was in the relationshit (not a typo) for about a year. She broke me in half, and did her best to destroy the bits and pieces that were left over. Yet, I’m coming through it, through therapy, and, honestly, this site, and my interactions here.
I don’t know how long you were in the war zone yourself. And, I’m sure it’s safe to say “your mileage may vary” in terms of getting over and through things. Healing comes, and it comes at the speed we need it to.
I have no doubt that you’ll get through this, too, brother. Just don’t rush it. Take the time to put your stuff in order. That way, the next relationshiP will be that much more fulfilling.
best to you,
-Kev.
Hi Kev,
This is great advice for everyone. I believe that the more positive things you add to your life after shedding one of these women will help to accelerate the healing process.
My very best to both you and Simon.
Kind Regards,
Dr T
Just think of her as a bottle of poison…because poison is what they are and yet to all others they can function quite normally.
Simon, Kev
I’m at 4 months no contact. THAT IS THE BEST THING I COULD HAVE DONE! I have kids so it’s very tough, but there are ways. We communicate through the (home environment) Day Care people and through our lawyers. If I can recommend one thing to better health AND better recognition to what you were in, then it’s
!!!!!!!!!!!! NO CONTACT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I just (and I mean 1 minute ago) got a text message from my (STB)ex’s mother. It was actually addressed to my son, but I KNOW IT WAS SENT BY HER. She wanted to know what he was doing for New Year’s Eve? WTF?!!?!
It was very very hard not to reply with a smart remark, but as Dr T’s articles say, “No Contact” means NO CONTACT. NONE. ZIP. ZILCH. NADA.
“No contact is for our own recovery of health.” I read that in one Dr T’s articles or a commenter’s blog. THAT IS THE KEY. I realize now that the only way to recover my health is no contact. I REALLY REALLY REALLY want to have 12 months NC under my belt. Kev, tell me it’s not that hard. Lately I’ve been fantasizing calling or visiting my ex, and I know that is VERY BAD!
Comments?
Recovering Alpha – 12 months is a good goal. 🙂 I’m about 6 hours and 11 minutes away from the 12 month marker as I type this.
Yes, I’m being that exact about it. 🙂
Yes, it gets easier with time, and distance. As you’ve said, you are in a better place than you were 4 months ago. Remember that each day. Remember that when you hit 5 months. Remember that when you hit 6 months.
When you feel the nostalgia come on, remember what she did to you. Remember the fights. The belittling. The snide comments. The cold shoulder. Remember how she made you feel like a criminal and unworthy of even the slightest bit of affection.
Do you really want to continue those conversations with her? Because they WILL continue, if you resume contact. I suspect you don’t, so don’t.
When you feel the urge to contact again, DISTRACT YOURSELF. Put on some music. Read a book. Go for a walk. Call a friend, or a family member instead. Have them meet you for coffee, or a drink. It’s okay to confide in someone you trust about what you’re going through, and ask them to help you find something else to occupy your time and mind.
You may think “this time might be different!” This time she might act kindly towards you. This time she might admit or acknowledge her mistakes.
It won’t be. She won’t. She can’t. If she does, she’s lying.
NO CONTACT. NONE. ZIP. ZILCH. NADA.
It gets easier with time. There will be good days, there will be bad days. You have kids in the mix, and it will be tough. There may be accidental contact. Learn to discern what is a manufactured emergency where she tries to get you to engage. The text message you received may have indeed been accidental, but as you said, it may have been something more.
DO NOT ENGAGE THE ENEMY. DO NOT FEED THE BORDERLINES (or Narcissists either, for that matter).
I’m not in any 12 step programs, but when things get bad, I adopt the “one day at a time” approach. If the future seems daunting (and at 4 months out, it still will at times), concentrate on the here and now. This moment. The next moment. The moment after that.
It may also seem like an appealing idea to gloat to her and say “look how far I’ve come! Look how much I’m over you!”
DON’T.
NO CONTACT. NONE. DO NOT ENGAGE. DO NOT FEED THE BORDERLINES.
You don’t need her approval. She’s never going to give it to you anyway.
You may have already lost some, or you may yet lose some friends in this whole process. Be prepared for that. It’s okay. It sucks, but it’s okay. You’re going to find out who truly loves you and is willing to stick by you in this whole thing.
Hang in there, and have a safe, happier New Year, and remember: NO CONTACT. 🙂
6 hours, 1 minute to go now. 🙂
Be well, and good luck!
Hello Recovering Alpha, Simon & Kev,
I just wanted to say a BIG Congratulations & how it is so good to see posts of this positive nature with you all going NO CONTACT! You should all be so proud of yourselves! I do not even know you & I am proud of you all! 🙂 Stay strong/no contact & Happy New Year with your new found freedom! Good Luck & All My Best. Happy New Year Everyone.
thank you. 🙂
It means a lot. And I promise you, I’m not just saying that.
I was married to a Borderline Personality Disordered woman for 8 years, at first
I was very confidant, had many friends, very happy but as time went on life
got strange, she tried to destroy all other relationships I had with other
people, borrowed money from everyone including employer, than filed for
bankruptcy, we got divorced, I was very frightened she was going to kill
herself, she threatened to kill me if I let her ex-husband know about
her behavior because she thought she would lose custody of her daughter,
life was a nightmare I barely kept my job and belongings, it took years
to recover financially. After 3 years I felt like I had before I meet her,
very happy, healthy, lots of friends, many girl friends, eventually I got
married and have 2 great kids and loving wife. I had no contact with her
in 14 years though we lived in same town, last week she walked just outside
of the city limits and shot herself dead, she was a school teacher. I
was shocked and thinking about her brings back all the sadness and confusion
and memories of her peculiar behavior, I am mostly angry at her for doing
it to herself. Fourteen years ago I felt like I was the main actor in a
Alfred Hitchcock movie, I would awake thinking I was coming out of a bad
dream and realize it was for real. There is a lot of effort to try
and ‘cure’ people with borderline personality but they cause more suffering
to the world than they can feel themselves. I feel so fortunate to
have my life back.
I would feel better about ascertaining my situation if I heard one thing. I constantly question whether or not I am the messed up one. Am I controlling, demanding, explosive, jealous, trivial, decietful, etc…
Of course, I don’t just “want to hear it,” but does anyone else think this way often? Maybe I have a problem with BPD(now that I have learned what it is). I don’t think I am any of these things, but “let he that lives in a glass house…” Maybe I play the victim. I don’t know anymore. So, is it just me??? Heck, I guess if it was, it would be a feeling of elation. Then, I just go seek the help that is needed, without depending on someone else making that decision for themselves!!!
Mark, the mere fact that you mention that “Maybe I have a problem with BPD…” means that you probably do NOT have BPD. Spend a bit of time browsing this wonderful site, and others on the Internet, and you’ll quickly discover that the VAST majority of BPD/NPDs utterly refuse to acknowledge that they have a problem. The BPD person might look at these sites and say “It’s not me! It’s my spouse/significant other/parents/friends/etc. who has a problem!”
What you are suffering (and it is suffering!) from is PROJECTION. Read throughout here how BPDs “project” their feelings and thoughts upon YOU. All of us have those characteristics you mentioned (controlling, demanding, etc.) to one degree or another…BUT, in the BPD’s world, they are perfect, YOU are the problem. For example, if you work as a manager, you may be perceived (right or wrong) as demanding…well, in some cases, you may have goals set by higher mgmt. to meet, and therefore must expect certain things out of your underlings. We all might be somewhat jealous of pro sports players who make barrels full of cash. HOWEVER, while your jealousy level might be a 2 on a scale of 1 to 10, in the BPD’s world, they crank it all the way to 11!
Your feelings are 10000% in line with what all of us who deal with a BPD person feel most of the time…that we’re wrong, and this occurs because you’re constantly having this “wrong-ness” being reinforced by the BPD person. BPDs are very skilled at taking the most secure, happy, and smart person and beating them (both verbally, mentally, and sometimes physically) into a meek, wussy shell of themselves.
With regard to “playing the victim”, you have to look back at how you behaved PRIOR to your current relationship…if “bad” things happened in your personal or professional lives, and you “shrugged it off”, but now play the “poor me” game, then NO, you are not “playing the victim”; this is what your BPD person has done to you.
Your 2nd sentence is very revealing…almost to a person, we have ALL felt this way at one time or another in our BPD relationships…just take some time to browse through reply posts and you’ll easily see this pattern. Websites like Dr. Tara’s help you realize that you are NOT ALONE, and that you CAN get through this and escape, and have the chance to rebuild yourself.
Good luck!!!!
Mark,
A relationship with a crazy person, by its very nature, leaves you doubting your own sanity, sense of reality and character.
Of course nobody on this site can confirm with 100% certainty that you are NOT crazy, which is why you need a trusted advisor–a friend or therapist–with whom you can discuss your feelings and experiences and get a reality check when you need one.
This is especially key if you’re the kind of guy who doesn’t have a lot of confidence in his own reality in general. People who doubt their own reality testing often come from families with a lot of craziness in them and they grow up wondering if they’re a bit crazy too. Then, if they get involved with a wingnut, they’re never quite sure if the girlfriend/spouse is nutty of if they themselves are. This is a tough place to be, and it’s the kind of achilles’ heel that a BPD/NPD lover will instinctively exploit.
It gets even more dicey if you do in fact have a minor mental health issue. Say, for the sake of discussion, that you have mild depression for which you take an anti-depressant. Once you admit this to your BPD/NPD lover it’s likely she will never take your feelings or opinions seriously, dismissing them instead with comments like “have you forgotten to take your medication again?”
In other words, even if you DO have some kind of mental health issue, it doesn’t necessarily follow that she’s NOT crazy and destructive.
And in any case, you don’t have to be perfect to expect to be treated lovingly in your relationship. When healthy people love you they’ll happily tolerate all kinds of faults and quirks.
JP
The chances are it’s not just you. Like Mike91163 points out, the fact that you’re willing to look at your own behavior with such honesty
Oops…sorry for that last fragment.
I was gonna say, the fact that you’re willing to look honestly at your own behavior suggests that whatever is going with you, the chances are it is NOT a personality disorder along the lines of BPD/NPD.
JP
Hey jp, you NAILED me with one comment: “…have you forgotten to take your medication again?” I have posted elsewhere about my wife’s problems with me taking opiate pain meds for severe chronic pain due to rheumatoid arthritis. Anyway, I’ve been off of them for the past 7 months (at her “request”), and just recently went to my primary care doctor with her in tow for advice re: pain mgmt. Well, long story short, he was no help…but, we’re going to try Lyrica, which is used almost exclusively for fibromyalgia or neuropathic pain–neither of which I have, but, we’ll try it anyway.
So, I’ve been on it for a week or so now, and the other day, the wife got pissed with me because I forgot something she told me the day before. I got the “are you taking pain meds again?” speech, and the “I hope this medicine is causing problems…”
Very calmly, I say “Hon, in the past 6 months, not being on ANY medication, have I NEVER forgotten anything that you’ve said to me?” (And yes, I do forget things…I guess it’s the old selective hearing bit or “tuning her out”) There was nothing but COMPLETE SILENCE on the other end…of course, I then got “I gotta go now”…and, the rest of the day, while she wasn’t a total bitch, I got the “cool” treatment.
Like Jack Nicholson said in “Men of Honor”: “The truth? YOU CAN’T HANDLE THE TRUTH!”
Mike, your comments resonate with me. I have a severely herniated disc between L4 & L5 that, due to my age, the neurosurgeon did not want to operate on… says I’m too young, give it time, take the meds. So I go to a pain management doctor and take opioids daily.
My wife has this completely irrational hatred of medication (to the point that I must fight with her to give my teething daughter some tylenol on the nights that she’s screaming in agony). Of course, she doesn’t like me taking my pain medication, but I quit rolling over and playing dead and took a firm stance and let her know that she could not tell me how to care for my body. I’ve since been taking a similar approach any other time she spazzes out for no good reason… seems to be working… maybe she’s not that much of a BPD (or perhaps, she’s not a severe case).
Doug. Mine was a definite cluster b and also dictated which medication to take….NONE. This insisted upon by her through my 4 knee surgeries and cervical fusion. I did what I wanted while she carped incessantly about it. Control control control. Their wretched souls are coming unhinged so to feel better they become dictators.
I do have one question – where did you hide the camera in my house?
If I can answer yes to all but one do I win a prize or something?
Yes, Matt—the booby prize!
… I don’t know where to start. I answered yes to 13 questions up there. I have already triple-checked to make sure I didn’t count any twice. Here is my situation: I am 18 (please don’t focus too much on my age… I hear it enough already, I’ve realized I made a mistake getting married so young, but my options were limited.) I don’t know what to do. Thankfully I do not have any kids. I love my wife, but she for sure has this condition. Life has been hell because of it. I’ve tried leaving her before when we were just dating, but she always guilt tripped me back. I’m not allowed to talk to females, and if they talk to me she gets angry at me, but I have to admit, the jealousy in her has calmed down a lot. It went from an “OMG You A**, your cheating on me!! F*** you” to a “why were those girls talking to you.” She constantly only cares about her feelings and ignores mine. I don’t get much sleep in the army, and on the weekends when I go home, I spend some time with her, then I start dozing off, and she starts complaining at first, then pouting, telling me that I never spend time with her and when I do all I do is sleep. Then once my eyes are closed she will continue to shake me, slap me, or say or do something that will infuriate me, just to get me to wake up. I’m going to have to say I’m concerned about the sex life too. Started off with a bang, came to a series of speed bumps, a halt for my basic training, then sky rocketed right after basic and is now again at slow speed bumps. I see her Friday night till Sunday afternoon, and I expect to have sex a least once. She promises great sex all day, and keeps putting it off until she picks a fight so we don’t that day, and don’t the next day. And I go back to the barracks same as I left. And I have to be very careful about bringing up sex because she yells at me and says that’s all I want. I don’t know what to do. Finally letting this out has made me feel better but reading responses will help a lot too. Thank you.
Hi Jacob. Life is for making mistakes and learning from them so don’t beat yourself up over making any mistakes. You are young and if this is no longer for you then get out as soon and painlessly as possible. You have already admitted it was a mistake, no kids are involved so run man!
It quite normal to have a very strong bond or love with someone when you are young but over time you kind of drift apart. You are still both growing up and changing rapidly.
Looking at your script above I would say that the fire has gone out a bit for you guys. Take it from me, it doesn’t get better and if kids do come along then you are stuck or have the heart wrenching agony of walking away from your child.
Take a really long hard look at your life and decide if this is really not for you and if it was a mistake (your words) then fix it now before its too late.
All the Best
Replying to:
ST, on September 10th, 2009 at 5:26 am Said:
Dr T
This is so sad. I used to enjoy music and arts. These days if I express that I like such things, my wife comes out with “why? Who are you seeing?”. I enjoy learning new things, new languages and when I comment on wanting to learn something new she’ll say “Why? Are you seeing someone or need to impress someone?”
WHY is she behaving like this? Read my other posts, WHY is she like this? I can’t understand it. If she is so insecure yet so controlling, what is the point of being in a relationship at all?
Awesome point, ST, but it’s sadly simple: Your wife (AND mine) NEED someone to “project” their insecurities on…they have, most likely, ran off many other people (family and friends) with their projections and controlling-type behavior, so guess who’s left as the “punching bag”?
Simple example: My wife and I have Facebook pages. I know most of her friends, female AND male, and am secure enough that it doesn’t faze me in the least. However, she’s asked many a time who this or that female friend is in that condescending, suspicious tone…meanwhile, most of them are former ELEMENTARY or HIGH SCHOOL classmates from 30+ years ago who I haven’t seen or heard from until their FB friend request!
But therein lies an irony…while ALL of my “old” friends were ones who searched ME out and sent friend requests, she hasn’t gotten many (if any) from her old schoolmates. Gee whiz, why might these people want to “catch up” with me, yet no one seeks HER out? Hmmm…
Facebook thing?? Yeah, we got that occuring here as well……no one reaches out to her……Wonder why? She only converses with FB friends that are triple Divorce’s with a hatred for men…
Ugh. I’d prepare accordingly then. She’s probably getting advice about how much she’s entitled to and divorce advice from similar women.
If you decide to leave, I very strongly encourage you to find an attorney who’s very skilled in dealing with high conflict personalities. 3-time female divorcees are usually alimony pros.
Best,
Dr T
Wow, I had to go back and read THIS article again. So many months ago when I first read this article in search of what my ‘pain’ was all about. The ‘whys’
It’s all right here. Even the added ones by Dr. T and readers that contributed. When I first read this 5-6 months ago my blood curled and I got ‘chicken skin’. It was chilling to say the least.
Now, I can read it and I just shake my head. The misery and damage this disturbing stuff was the core reason for.
Abnormal and dysfunctional to the MAX. Yes, toxic crazy bitch! BUT, what a huge job at disguising this garbage can of crap.
Glad I re-read this article. Reminded me of where I ‘was’ then and ‘where’ I am now. With work still to do on myself.
Wow I literally drowned to learn to swim. Must know the waters infested with sharks though!!
Good stuff this is! EVERYONE should read this first as a primer!!
Thanks, Bert. That’s why this was my inaugural post.
I’m happy you’re in a different place now and encourage you to keep moving forward.
All my best,
Dr Tara
Hey Dr. T,
I haven’t piped in for a few weeks, I’ve had dates with 4 different ladies over the past month, it’s been awsome!! Been receiving your posts and it breaks my heart, (Yes, even for all you guys out there!) to hear these stories, especially where children are involved. I can assure all you guys, the life you lead with your NPD/BPD is not what you want your children to witness, grow up in, and they to eventually, take on some of those egregious traits. There is no price you can place on their well being or your sanity! Once you’ve dated a few nice women, the world is a better place. I fell for one lady recently, everything was cool, and out of no where, she turned “Sybil” on me! NEXT!!
So Doc, have you watched your “Zohan” movie yet?? Best wishes to all! I’ll k.i.t.!
Good to see you hear again, melove. Nicely done with “Sybil.”
I’m afraid I haven’t watched Zohan yet. I need to be in the right mood to watch Adam Sandler and am still waiting for the necessary planets to align;-)
Happy dating!
Dr T
I am sad to say that I have unknowingly committed a few double bind situations with my current partner (especially with the dinner situation!). I’ve also been guilty of committing the same mistake when it came to playing World of Warcraft. We’ve since worked through at least one of these issues. Our solution? I go out dancing with my co-workers 2x a week and he stays home and plays games. People question us, but it works out just fine. I guess I still have a few narcissistic qualities to work on, though. I’m glad I came across this list so that I could work on my own problems and not end up a crazy bitch!
You go out Dancing 2 times per week??
This is not going to end well…..
He plays World of Warcraft 7 times a week. I think I’m entitled to a little fun on my own. 🙂 We have very open communication.
Wow:
I’ve been struggling for over a year in a battle with my ex over custody of my now 4 year old daughter.
Before that I was for many years in a terrible relationship and staying in it with the expressed purpose of building a relationship with my daughter from her birth in 2005.
In the back of my mind I always knew my daughter would be used as a pawn against me in a separation situation and hence stayed in the relationship as long as I could manage.
This article and your website has opened my eyes to the fact that I have been dealing with someone suffering from BDP, or worse.
My ex has done everything she possibly can to limit my time with my daughter in the hopes that she could damage or destroy the relationship.
Thankfully having already built a strong relationship, the limited time I have with my daughter since the split is focused, enjoyable, and brought my daughter and I closer together than ever.
My question is: Given I’ll be lucky to have my daughter at this young age more than 25% of the time how do I protect my daughter from learning this horrible behaviour from her mother??
Any ideas would be appreciated.
And thanks so much for your efforts Dr. T. on this great site!!
Hi David,
Continue to be a source of strength and healthy role model for her. When you see her begin to act in ways that remind you of your wife, nip it in the bud immediately. Get her a child therapist. Talk to your daughter about why threatening others, throwing fits, name calling, etc., isn’t acceptable. Show her that there are better ways to communicate. Get her involved in lots of extracurricular activities—especially ones that include learning how to work together as a team.
Build friendships with healthy women (platonic) and let your daughter spend time with these women. Don’t bad mouth her mother, but when you see her behaving like “mini-me” ask her where she saw/heard/learned these behaviors. Gently explain why it’s wrong and hurtful and teach her their are better ways to express herself.
Basically, you need to give her access to healthier role models and if you for one moment suspect your ex is lashing out at her, get her into therapy and have it documented.
Hope this helps,
Dr Tara
David, when I was going through a nasty divorce many years ago, I was so worried about issues of parental alienation – which my ex definitely practiced, though she did stop and we are all in a much better place today. I bring this up because people were always telling me (whether to prop me up or to not deal with my issues) “children are resilient.” By that they meant to reassure me that kids bounce back. Well, resilience is just that – bounce-back. When you drop a ball down to the ground, it does bounce back. But it never bounces back quite as high. Kids ARE resilient. And they don’t bounce as high once dropped. They certainly don’t soar as high as they do when they are elevated by those who care for them. Do everything you can to elevate your daughter ABOVE the fray. My son witnessed some ugliness from his mother, but he also witnessed me dealing with it and not flinching. Through that he was reassured that I was a fixture in his life and not just a visitor. That will be a good feeling for you as well. Make sure your daughter KNOWS you care, even when you can’t be there. Your words and actions will counter the negativity from her mother. And whatever you do, don’t take the advice of well-meaning friends who say ‘oh she’s okay,’ or ‘she’ll be fine.’ YOU make sure she is. Call her everyday. If your ex won’t allow it, go to court and have a judge permit it. Mediators and judges love a pro-active dad, because they deal with so many deadbeats. At least this is what I was told by people in the california courts system who helped me. And be creative. I found that a well-worn CD of Will Smith’s song ‘Just the Two of Us’ helped bridge the miles and worked wonders. It became our anthem. You can do it, David. And your daughter will thank you.
Kent: Thanks for the response.
Fortunately EVERYONE I know sees what my daughter and I are going through as parental alienation behaviour.
Everyone except for my lawyer and the family court system here in Ontario – which is a nightmare especially for someone as broke as I am.
My daughter is 4 and already suffering from the limited court ordered time we have together (about 15% of her life) and unfortunately is being victimized directly by her mother.
During our last time together I was told out of the blue by my daughter that ‘mom says I’m too little to talk on the phone’. I have never talked to my daughter on the phone in the last year despite at least 50 calls.
And thanks for the motivational speech.
I can see my daughter will thank me, and to some degree already does because I provide her with a fun, safe, shouting free environment to live in even if right now it is for such little time.
It’s been a little stressful the last few months when typically I have to physically pry her out of the car to give her back to her mom – but I know we will be okay and in the long run there is a very good chance she’ll decide to live with me anyway.
She’s a smart little girl – this weekend we are going to be working on learning to dial dad’s phone number and she has already been using the computer for a year so as her reading gets better email will be possible too.
Like you say – make sure she knows I am available for her!!
Hi David. OMG do I remember the prying when it was my son’s time to go back to his mom’s. And her psycho behavior when he exhibited that in front of her. It’s tough man, but you’re doing it right. Good for you!! You’re an inspiration for your daughter and for any other Dad’s who will read your posts. My situation got better over time and with lots of work. Progress was slow but definite. And right this moment my son and I are on an out of town trip having a wonderful time and bonding like crazy. It’s all worth it. Good luck, brother. (now if my fiancee would just stop competing with my son for my attention – but that’s a story for another post).
that`s so touching… as she gets older she`ll see your place as the peace haven and want to be there more….there might be some possibility that these people have a `candida albicans` problem….bless you and your little daughter.
Yes to most of the points, if not all of them. Oh boy. I still have this little glimmer that says “we can get through this,” that somehow, she can start treating me in a loving and respectful manner. It’s been 8 years. Things have improved a tiny bit, but the toll on me and my life (and my health) has been significant, and I feel like I have to fight tooth and nail just to complete a thought. I keep trying to say “that’s not fair,” and I’ve purchased books and sought counseling. Oh man, isn’t “she’s a crazy bitch” just the easy way out? Sounds really appealing right now, it’s just that I really believe in marriage, and I feel so ashamed. I also feel guilty about the behaviors and arguments I feel I’ve been “dragged” into.
Anonymous:
Just a few points…
–“I still have this little glimmer that says “we can get through this,” that somehow, she can start treating me in a loving and respectful manner. It’s been 8 years.” Yeah, I used to have that glimmer too…I’ve been married for 19 yrs, and it’s been a living hell for the past 14 yrs. With “high-functioning” BPDs, there’s an “ebb and flow” many times…there’s plenty of times that I’ll sense improvement, and then the other shoe will drop, and it’s always once you’ve let your guard down.
–“but the toll on…my health has been significant.” I think that this is one of the most undiagnosed and underrated “collateral damages” of being with a BPD wife. Sure, you might write off “minor” health issues like premature graying/balding, erectile disfunction, and others as nuisances and ignore them as “typical aging” issues; BUT, I’m sure many here have serious health problems, like high blood pressure, ulcers, and auto-immune disorders like arthritis and such.
–“isn’t “she’s a crazy bitch” just the easy way out? Sounds really appealing right now, it’s just that I really believe in marriage, and I feel so ashamed.” Buddy, it’s not the easy way out, it’s the ONLY way out! Hey, I believe in marriage and its vows, too, but ask yourself this: Has SHE fulfilled her end of the vows? If you have given your heart, your soul, your mind, and unfortunately your HEALTH, and have gotten little or nothing in return, well, there’s nothing to be ashamed of by getting out. If you are confident that you have done your best, then you must get out. I love my wife as well, but I’ve gotten to where I call it “tough love”…yeah, it’s cliched, but it’s fairly accurate.
“Tough Love” is the only thing Mine will respond to with positive results for me. Being kind to her just opens the door for increased abuse and further withholding.
Dr T.,
What if you are the crazy bitch? What can I do? I got diagnosed with Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome, which I believe was making me have things like mood swings and irritability. But even after the diagnosis and the new meds (Metformin for insulin resistance and birth control to fight the abnormal amount of testosterone), I find myself still falling into these categories. I love my husband. I want to be better. We are very open and will have been married two years next month.
I wish to God you were my wife.
God bless you for seeking help, and God bless you and your husband’s marriage.
Imagine not going, getting worse, denying anything is wrong and hurting your man over and over again, then turning it on your baby.
Your husband is more lucky than he’ll ever know for you taking that (hard) first step. Hat’s off to you.
Dear Anon Crazy Bitch –
I can’t go as far as Scott for wishing you were my wife because I’ve been through enough already, but I understand the sentiments 🙂
Even with all the problems with my wife, if she were just willing to admit that she had problems I might try to work it out. Not only are you admitting it, but you see that a problem exists. whenever I bring anything up that she said or did, she says that I’m delusional and lying about her – even if I wrote down what she said and told an independent witness when she said it.
One suggestion that I have is to please be honest with your husband and tell him the same things that you said here. Also, if you do something, no matter how bad it is, admit it and ask him to forgive you. The type of men that frequently end up with “crazy bitches” can frequently put up with a lot of things if honestly still remains. The frustration boils over when the woman insists that you are delusional and that you are the problem.
I hope it works out for you. I can tell you that even though many of us have no choice but to divorce, going through divorce is still hell. I have to continue on the path to divorce, but I have never been through anything that has been so difficult or emotionally destructive.
StudidAgain,
I’m definitely honest with my husband – sometimes to the point of hurtful. Sort of the male version of “Do I look fat in these pants?”
Is there anything you wish you and your wife had done differently? A point where there was no turning back and getting better? I worry despite apologies after the fact and a real medical condition that eventually that will not be enough.
ACB,
What do you mean you are “honest to the point of being hurtful?” Do you mean you say hurtful, but what you feel are “honest,” things to him like “wow, you’re really losing a lot of hair” or “your love handles are getting really big” or “compared to other men you don’t earn enough money?”
If so, knock it off. Even if it is true; it’s incredibly hurtful and insulting. How would you feel if he said those kinds of things to you?
You may have a legitimate medical condition, but that does NOT excuse hurtful and abusive behavior. Your apologies may very well be “heartfelt,” but they’re absolutely meaningless when you keep doing the same hurtful things over and over again.
Best,
Dr T
Dr T
Scott,
Thanks for the kind words – I’m working on my condition, but as I told StudidAgain, I can be very hurtful. Sort of the male version of “Do I look fat in these pants?”
Is there anything you wish you and your wife had done differently? A point where there was no turning back and getting better? I worry despite apologies after the fact and a real medical condition that eventually that will not be enough.
Yes,…..(I’ll answer even though you asked them)..If she had ever…ever really made me feel loved. I can take a very heated exchange as I grew up with 4 fierce brothers.
I can take a fierce exchange as along as it is balanced with “good times”. everyone can debate, but the low blows, coupled with the gaslighting, coupled with the lack of culpability……and the withdrawing of affection all adds up to “I’m done”
What’s in it for me?? I used to have this Italian Girlfriend….we fought like crazy….but we loved like crazy as well….She was fun and the Fights were actually load debates…..no cheap punches and a smile and giggling could break out at anytime during the fight…..we knew we were just “jousting”
Deal Breakers are lack of balance. Since my Mother died 5 years ago, I’ve not felt loved by and adult woman since then……..(my two daughters don’t count, they love me and it shows, but that is why I use the adjective “Adult”)
I’ve been married for 18 years. Yet I feel that I’ve been “alone” that whole time.
If you are indeed sick, yet your man feels nowhere near what I feel, If he is indeed a man, He stick with you. I heartfelt “I’m Sorry” goes a long long way. Understand…..if you save the “I’m sorry” for the moment just before he walks out the door, it will be seen as just a manipulation. He may accept it but deep in in mind, He’ll know it was empty. Too many empty apologies lead to the Deal breaker.
Hi ACB,
I didn’t know much about POS, so I did a little research. According to the Wiki encyclopedia, POS is:
“an endocrine disorder that affects approximately 5% of all women.[1] It occurs amongst all races and nationalities, is the most common hormonal disorder among women of reproductive age, and is a leading cause of infertility.[2][3]
The principal features are obesity, anovulation (resulting in irregular menstruation), acne, and excessive amounts or effects of androgenic (masculinizing) hormones. The symptoms and severity of the syndrome vary greatly among women. While the causes are unknown, insulin resistance, diabetes, and obesity are all strongly correlated with PCOS.”
I’ve read through several other sites and the only secondary mental health symptom/condition I can find are depression and scant reference to mood swings. From what I can tell the best way to treat this disorder is through a strict diet; meds alone don’t seem to be sufficient.
The drugs you list above aren’t psychopharmaceuticals and certainly aren’t mood stabilizers. If you don’t feel able to control your behavior—whether it’s an artifact of POS or a problem in its own right—I encourage you to find a cognitive behavioral therapist to work with as well as your medical doctor to tease out exactly what’s going on.
It’s great that you can acknowledge that you’re behaving in hurtful ways, but taking insulin regulators and birth control isn’t sufficient. You need to learn how not to act out when you feel out of control rather than chalking it up to POS.
Best,
Dr Tara
When I read your scoring chart I cringed. You said –
“If you answered “yes” to more than two of these questions, you may be involved with a Borderline or a Narcissist. You’re not alone. They’re everywhere.”
My wife scored 15 out of 19 and it was a strong yes on all 15. Unfortunately, if she did the quiz herself, I’m sure it would be zero instead of 15.
I’m glad that I found this site. I recently figured out what I was dealing with, but it helps to see a site dedicated specifically to men dealing with borderline women.
Hi StupidAgain,
Can we please change your name to “Getting Smarter?” Language is powerful, so please don’t put yourself down like that.
Now that you’ve figured out what you’re dealing with, you need to begin making choices about what you want to do. I encourage you to seek support throughout this process as it can be very painful and isolating on your own.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Wow!
I just ran across this article and website. It is so helpful! Been married 18 years with two wonderful kids to a woman (girl) undiagnosed BPD. She totally fits all of the above except the Lipstick. I have been in weekly counseling with a therapist (PhD) for six months and am just now regaining the sanity. Started the divorce process and cannot wait to leave. I just do not want to lose the kids! She will not work, but has skills and a BA degree. Spends money like water. Invents new problems and issues daily. Does nothing with her time. Expects the world. Elevates issues, as small as mole hills into mountains. It all fits and clicks.
Thank you Tara, for this website. You are probably helping more men, women, families and their friends that you can imagine!
Thanks LeavingHer,
And good luck with the divorce process. These women can be grasping, parasitic vultures. If she has an education and skills, ask your attorney about having her see a vocational evaluator. They can assess what her earnings would be if she she actually makes the effort and gets a job. You may be able to get the court to impute her potential earnings off of the support you pay her.
Furthermore, women seem to be having an easier time finding work in the economic downturn (a.k.a. DEPRESSION), so any excuses she clings to will be just that—excuses.
Kind Regards,
Dr T
yes thats just `it`, a new issue each day…like they thrive on problems….because they must `always` be the victim….
ok, i read the quiz, which was frightfully true, and some of the comments.. as a woman i read this with deep interest. i myself have portrayed many of these “symptoms” “attitude problems” “insecuritis” (or whatever it is you want to call it) when i was youger. people can and do change. (hold on…keep reading lol) people do change all the time…that doesn’t always mean for the better lol. my advice, if yuu are with a woman like this, leave her, or at least seperate for a lengthy amount of time to let her know yr serious…yr not her (god i hate to say this)- man/bitch. women like these will always push the limit, from something as simple as “why’d you lite yr cigarette before mine?” JUST to see how you’ll react… don’t give in. as one, it will only get worse. as horrible as this may sound, she needs time to think and feel.. when all yr thoughts and feelings are directed to or for someone else you are not giving yourself the ability to feel and be distinctively what makes you “you”. only people who know themselves and are comfortable in their own skin can have true healthy relationships….give her time alone, no matter how much she hates it. go to work, hang with friends (if you live together) get on the computer and do your thing…if it comforts her let her stare at you lol. the point is to set up boundaries and limitations, a mutal respect so to speak. maybe it’ll work maybe it wont. what a “crazy bitch” needs is time alone with her (not sure how to say it) lol- thoughts and insecurities. hopefully with the knowlege that you love her (which she may find hard to believe at first). what i’ve found works is talking about what i really want (i do this with my man) instead of saying “do you love me?” i say “i love you”, when i’m feeling insecure, instead of a thousand questions of “do you think i’m pretty?” “do you really like my haircut?” i simply say, “i’m feeling a little insecure…will you tell me my hair is pretty?” as time has gone by i find myself needing to ask for encouragement and assurance less and less. most of theee kind of women i think, don’t trust themselves and so they can’t trust you. an insecure woman incapable of trust will “need” control to feel that assurance. and that means games and questions and methods to ensare you to her always…because deep down one of her biggest fears is being alone with herself. so my advice…love and support her. set up boundaries (prepare yourself lol) and the biggest thing is to set up real (healthy) trust…talk, call her on her bullshit if necessary, and seperate for time to cool off. and listen. really listen. to what is actually bothering her that she’s hiding even from herself. do NOT feed her addiction… she feeds off you, yr attention, yr emotions, do not feed an addict. set up limititations and be consitent. with that, it may work, it may not, it depends completely on the indv.
Too David Lebrocq
Our children do wake up sooner or later to them and their dysfunctional behavior. Our children too are abuse daily by them and will resent it just as much as we did. All three of us (my two older sons and I) want nothing to do with their mother and have been in total NC for three years. But what is really sad is how she already done this to her two other children before I met her. These pathological people don’t change EVER! No doubt this is what happens whenever anyone refuses to take personal responsibility for their own actions and choices. How can anyone learn from our past if we refuse to see what part we played in it and take no blame but instead only blame everyone else? So your daughter too will in time wake up to what her mother really is and how it does effect her. So David like the old saying goes, “patience is a virtue”.
Thanks James for the words – I understand patience and am becomimg a master!!! In the mean time every minute we spend together is the best possible time I can provide.
I’ve been a reader now for about 4 months and have posted a couple times. I must say coming back to this article every so ofter really helps to regain sanity. I’ve been married 10 months now and have a wonderful 4 month old son. I always believed i could get my wife back to where she was our first two months of dating, when she was loving, sweet, caring, and quite the ballbuster. But now after things have only gotten worse, i’m on the verge of leaving and i must think this site for giving me the sight to seek help. In the last two months alone, i have gotten a second job, to take “financial stress” off my wife. And she told me about her “financial stress” while yelling at me in front of our apartment building, as she also yelled how she fucks me whenever i want it, but i do shit for her. It was very embarrassing and very false because i never ask for sex because i’m scared to have sex with my wife, since it’s been held over my head the entire time we’ve been together. Well anyways, i got this second job to bring in more income and now she gets mad because i work too much! This is also all added on top of her jealousy issues. Which she’ll admit to me she has a jealousy problem but makes a point to tell me she wouldn’t have any issues if they’re was a way she could make sure i would never mentally cheat on her. And she tells me this, when she herself as threatened to physically cheat on me! And just a couple weeks ago, she informed me with a stare that would make the devil run, that if i ever found another women good looking i deserved to be shot in the head. I was afraid to actually go to sleep that night and ever since have been making plans to get out. Sorry, i kind of rambled on there, but just typing out my experiences helps me keep in mind things are that bad and keeps me from getting pulled back in. Thanks for listening and thanks for giving me the sight.
Is it possible for a wife to begin this behavior as the result of a mid life crisis? My wife at 40 began making comments about old she is getting and how she isn’t pretty anymore because she is old. Even though after 10 years of marriage I find her beautiful and desirable, she just says all I want her for is sex, which we rarely have.
She became withdrawn and instead of looking at me and loving the things I do, over time she began to complain and tell me how miserable her life is. In the span of about a year and half we went from having what I thought was a very healthy and loving relationship to something else.
Things that used to matter where no longer a big deal, like wearing her wedding ring (if I pointed this out all hell would unleash), being affectionate with each other (kissing or saying I love You), or making love. Around the same time as these events occurred she also started staying up very late on the computer and I noticed that she was texting all the time. If I asked who she was texting or emailing she became very defensive and told me that “I didn’t trust her”.
One day I was on her computer and found a “story” titled Mid-Life Crisis and the central characters were her, I, and our son’s football coach who she talked a lot about at the time and who in this “story” she kissed after practice. When I asked her about it she became angry with me and told me that it was only a “story” and that she never should have written it with us as the central characters oh yeah, and I am over bearing and evil. With her withdrawing as she did I became jealous and wondered if all of the texting and emailing to his individual meant anything. Of course, in her eyes I am being jealous and untrusting of her.
Even as I laid out me case logically to explain how my feelings may have been generated, she just says “Oh Well” she did nothing wrong so how I feel is irrelevant. The part that bothered me the most was for many years she lifted me by her love and showered me with attention and affection. Now, that is gone and if I point it out she just tells me “she has changed” or now I have become “needy” or her favorite thing to tell me is “quite acting like an over emotional woman”.
Swaggerback,
I read your post with interest, as there are many similarities (barring the “story” on the computer) to my situation. First, before I get into anything else, has she recently had a complete workup by her doctor or obgyn? I ask this because many women can become pre-menopausal relatively early–in their mid to late 30s. Unlike us guys, who generally have a gradual decline in “virility” over a decade or two, women who experience early menopausal symptoms have their hormones get wacky fairly quickly, and we all know what PMS is like…now imagine that 24/7/365 for quite a few years. PLEASE understand that I am NOT making any sort of excuses for her behavior and actions; however, until she’s checked by a doctor, you don’t know if there’s a medical reason behind it.
That said, though, there IS a huge difference between the following:
–A woman who’s PMSing, kind of knows it, and APOLOGIZES for her behavior during/after;
–A woman who, for lack of a better word, “misbehaves”, and whether she blames PMS or “mid life crisis”, does NOT admit to it OR apologize, OR uses those reasons as an excuse.
I read your last paragraph with great interest…”mistake #1″ on your part was laying out your case logically…read here ( http://shrink4men.wordpress.com/2009/09/17/10-reasons-you-cant-communicate-with-a-narcissistic-or-borderline-woman/ ) and you’ll know why she responded with an “oh well”…been there, heard that! I’ve gotten the old “YOU have changed” thrown my way as well; again, it’s an excuse for her behavior.
What cracks me up is how when THEY do the following:
–withdraw
–complain about how miserable THEY are
–don’t wear their wedding ring (yep, seen that too)
–withdraw affection
–withdraw sex
there’s always a million excuses…sick, don’t feel good, not in the mood, tired, working too hard…there’s always something! YET, and this is the biggie, when the things THEY have done grate on us, and WE do what I’ve listed, it is ALWAYS our fault-period. And wait, there’s more…let’s say us guys decide that we’ll work on our “faults” (since after all, WE’RE always wrong, they’re always right!)…when you say or do this, we get this gem: “You are going to have to EARN back my trust/love/affection/whatever…” and of course, it’s implied that there’s NO timetable for this–things will be “OK” when and IF, and only IF, they decide so. Therefore, you could go through the whole “perfect husband” rigamarole for YEARS with no improvement or resolution…trust me man, been there, still waiting…
Fortunately (I guess!) for me, I have not had to worry about the jealousy thing, as she seems to be content to live in her own little world. But, as AnonymousT writes, you need to get some information from professionals-a lawyer and a counselor. What’s the saying? “Hope for the best, but prepare for and expect the worst.” It’s a vital mantra, so that you’re mentally prepared.
Good luck to ya!
Hi Swaggerback,
I think I just found the answer to the question I asked a couple minutes ago. My hunch is that if your wife isn’t technically having an affair she’s thinking about it.
If she won’t answer your questions, you may want to consider installing spyware on her computer as well as taking a look at her text records.
Best,
Dr T
Swaggerback, I hate to say it, but 1) quietly schedule a consult with a respected, experienced divorce lawyer in your city, and 2) schedule an individual consult with a good marriage counselor. Just to get their feedback for now, not to initiate anything yet. But listen to what they tell you. The early prognoses I got from mine were absolutely accurate, although it took me too long to accept. By then she had done a number of very destructive and scary things, and I had to play catch-up to defend myself, my children, and my finances.
There is a real pattern to these women – read as many of the articles and posts here as you can. There is a discussion here in another thread about this pattern at around age 40, and Dr. T explained succinctly that these women often figure “it’s now or never” in terms of doing better than you (at least in their minds). It happened to me.
Don’t sit there like a target – be proactive and prepare to defend yourself legally and emotionally.
Thanks for the feedback…
When things first happened a year ago I responded emotionally and it only made things worse because then she could use my response as the problem. All people change and I think that anyone in a long term relationship will have rough spots, but as adults we must be accountable for our actions. I was once told that when in midlife crisis people will act like teenagers and rebel against any and everything with no accountability. The more logical I seem to try and be the further she will fight against or she will agree and recognize the behavior, but nothing changes consistently. The best part of the whole process that I have gone through in the last year is that I have learned more about myself and about human behavior in general. I have always believed that although we not always control our emotions we must always be accountable for them.
Swaggerback:
You mention a critical word here: ACCOUNTABILITY. With NPDs, there is ZERO accountability-they’re right, you’re wrong, end of discussion. With BPDs, there’s no accountability with regard to admitting that their behavior is improper.
As I’ve mentioned before, if my wife would only “crack” a little and admit that she’s behaved badly; that she’s said horrible things; that she feels lousy and is sorry for taking it out on me, I might be inclined to give her some benefit of the doubt and stick around. But, after a decade and a half of this, I have a better chance of hitting the lottery…
Lastly, because I’ve heard this from some “hit ‘n run” BPD/NPD women who’ve posted here…they’ve used the old marriage vows line. Umm, I recall that BOTH of us had to say those words-so why do the “rules” apply now to just me? You haven’t “cherished” me, you CHOOSE not to “love” and “have and hold” me…so I would say that YOU have failed to live up to YOUR end of the vows! I’m fine with sticking by you “for better or worse”, but YOU need to do the same!
Sorry for the rant there, but the whole accountability thing just always sticks in my craw…
My wife fits the “crazy bitch” descriptions here. Frankly, she has physically abused me. BUT…she expresses willingness to change. She’s read this website. Though she is not in therapy, she is willing to give it a go. Do I ditch the bitch, or do I hold her hand while she recovers from her abusive past?
Anon:
Me personally, physical abuse is a deal-breaker…but how are you defining it? An open-handed slap or smack? A closed-fist punch? Hit with objects? Has the abuse happened a couple of times, or has there been a pattern?
“Willingness to change…willing to give therapy a go”. Well my friend, willing to do something and ACTUALLY DOING IT are two different things! Has she indeed changed her behavior without going to therapy? If not, sorry, it’s bye-bye time…if so, only YOU can decide whether therapy is actually going to help her continue to improve.
You mention that she had an abusive past…I’m not a psych or counselor, but generally speaking, recovering from those deep dark memories is gonna be difficult and take a lot of time…hell, my wife had one helluva f**ked-up childhood, and she refuses to discuss it, not even with her best friends of 40+ years, and that’s one reason (of many) that I hold no faith in therapy for her…and, there’s no guarantee that she’ll come out of therapy a better person. But again, without knowing any particulars, we really can’t say…
Hi AnonymousFather,
Physical abuse is a HUGE deal-breaker—especially if you have kids. I agree with Mike91163 100%. Document the abuse. Find a good attorney and explore your options.
Until and unless your wife actually starts attending therapy—and not with just any old therapist—she needs to see a practitioner of DBT (Dialectical Behavior Therapy) and stops the physical abuse now, she needs to do her recovery on her own without you. This is serious stuff. It’s an uphill battle that could take years, as in decades. Find a DBT therapist and speak with him or her about your wife’s prognosis, the timetable and then make an informed decision and please check back and let me know how you’re doing.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
AF,
If your wife does indeed fit a good share of the descriptions as a “crazy bitch” here’s what you need to consider, purely historical factors.
a) what percentage of your interpersonal relationship has she displayed such behavior? In other words, has she always been like this and it’s gotten worse, or was she good for the most part and recently became this way?
b) if she has been this way always(to one degree or another) then the likelyhood she is detaining you, regrouping herself for the next ploy, delaying the inevitable, then she will manipulate the situation to make you be the bad guy when you go to counseling. I can assure you, she will not reveal herself if she is indeed NPD/BPD. Especially NPD. You will end up on the pointed end of that stick!
c)I also too believe that everyone should be given the benefit of doubt and allow them a chance to prove themselves. Be reasonable and most of all, be cautious. Also, read the signs before she gets the best of you in this counseling. If she truly has NPD/BPD, she needed time,via her willingness, to figure out things, and I don’t mean she’s trying to figure out how to get better. If she’s suffering from some other condition, then you might have a chance. Question is, you know her better than anyone, so what do you TRULY believe? What has history taught you? Is she a person of her word? Can you trust her to put forth an honest effort? Does she always project blame on you where it concerns why you have relationship problems? See where I’m going with this? Remember, rely on your intellect, not your emotions! I personally don’t believe she’s had an epiphany reading this site (if she meets the BPD/NPD criteria), however, I’ve been wrong before! Best of luck my man.
To future readers NEVER show your significant other this website unless you want to pour gasoline on the fire!
You need to decide the risk versus reward and determine if it is worth it. Only you can deicide for yourself. At this point I am not ready to move on, but that doesn’t mean I cannot weigh the options and visit here frequently for support. As for the abuse physical or mental, you do not have to accept it! Next time it starts stand your ground and tell her it is unacceptable and walk away. Do not speak to her…if you have kids shower them with the love you wish you received. If you do not have kids GET OUT!
Hi swaggerback,
I agree with the advice not to show your abusive spouses/gf’s my website. First, because it’s unlikely they’ll receive it well and you may end up inflicting more harm on yourself. Second, because if you’re seriously considering breaking up/divorce, you don’t want to tip your hand. I know you want them to understand and get some validation, but you’re very unlikey to attain these things from an abusive person.
Kind Regards,
Dr T
Whoa. As an ex non-BPD partner I would like to say the following;
1) These women are not well and you have to learn to see them for what they are
2) Splitting up with them (scuse the pun) is painful and you have to learn to see their manipulation/control/distortions for what it is
3) Life gets better – once you meet a normal woman, you suddenly realise what you’re been conditioned to endure. The warmth, kindness and compassion of a normal partner feels unusual at first, but then you remember what normal relationships are all about.
Once you’ve realised that the hidden gem you’ve been trying to uncover within your BPD ex does not exist and that all the projecting and blame is not real, then you realise what a fool you’ve been and what you’ve put up with – initially it hurts and you feel used, but then you feel relief and then you see a glimmer of hope and after that your whole life’s potential unfolds and you can be yourself again,
Be strong, the withdrawal phase will pass and you will be whole again.
Heh Derek
You are right in what you say….I am currently 14 days out of the relationship with her. We lost a child some time ago, I was gutted at the time but right now I believe it to have been a blessing. I know I need to get away and stay away from her, but I find it hard sometimes and I still think about her a lot. I know 14 days is not long and can feel everyday the addiction I had to her and get angry at myself for still feeling so attached to her. She literally used me terribly the last time we were together. Was scares me the most is my general fear of women, and whether I will ever have the confidence again to go out there and try and meet new people.
Hi Simon,
You state you had an addiction to your ex. In that case, take the No Contact rule “one day at a time.” Celebrate each day you get through without contacting her or responding to her fishing expeditions. When you make it through the first month, go out and do something fun with your friends. Remind yourself of all the ways your life is better without her.
Forgive YOURSELF for being taken in by her. You may never be as initially trusting of women again, but that’s okay. There are a lot of predators in the world. Put trust in someone after she or demonstrates that they’re worthy of it.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Hi Derek,
“Uncovering the hidden gem” reminds me of a phrase by Gertrude Stein, “There’s no ‘there’ there.” If you keep looking for something or someone that doesn’t exist, you’ll only frustrate yourself even more and have greater disappointment.
No matter how sweet, sexy and wonderful she may have seemed at the beginning doesn’t matter. That person doesn’t exist. It was an illusion created to ensnare you. Searching for that role she played initially or waiting in vain for her to reappear is a waste of your time and energy.
Best,
Dr Tara
The most confusing part is that for the first 10 years of our relationship (together and then married) we were the picture of a healthy relationship. It is hard to describe how in tune we seemed to be, at least from my perspective. Over the past year she continues to tell me not to talk about the past or use it as a measuring stick against the present. It is like my wife has morphed into a different person, one that I don’t like most of the time. I made the mistake of posing the question “Do you think if you acted like this when we were first together I would have stayed with or married you?”. Needless to say the ground shook and the sky turned dark at the thought that I didn’t like her current behavior.
My favorite example of the changed behavior is when I attempt to be affectionate, she rejects me and then gets angry saying that I “set her up for failure” by attempting to be affectionate with her at the wrong time. It would be great if she had an LED or some sort of gage that indicated when it was the “right time”.
Hi swaggerback,
How old is your wife? Is she going through the change? If she did change all of a sudden after 10 years, perhaps there’s a medical reason. Otherwise, maybe she’s fallen out of love. Is it possible she’s having an affair—physical or emotional?
Best,
Dr T
Dr. T – Thanks for the reply. My wife is 41 and the change is possible, but god forbid that is discussed. We spent several sessions with a marriage counselor and when the suggestion was made to her that she might be going through the change, she dismissed it. When she started to withdraw from me about a year ago, I began monitoring her and when I questioned her about the emails and text messages with a specific individual she attempted to turn everything back on me. I am currently at a loss on how to handle the situation since she says for the most part she just isn’t in the mood 99% of the time. We are rarely affectionate and I am to the point where I am tired of being rejected. Despite, our relationship we live a very good life. I truly believe that she only stays with me because our sons would blame her if we split, our money situation is good, and she would have to work if we divorced.
It is such a relief to find out what has been happening to me all these years. I love my wife dearly but have finally made up my mind that I can no longer tolerate the abuse I have been suffering. I’m away from home at the moment the longer the better frankly, but while I’m trying to make money after a long period of unemployment. She is on holiday in the far east! Although 4000 miles away still tries to bully by txt. I dont have the support structure that you suggest that is so vital so being away is the only way I can cope with the stress. However I love my wife to pieces but the number of points I agreed to in your quiz poss 90% frightened me. Is there any treatment for individuals who suffer this condition or is it a hopeless case. Just in case I’ve started to formulate in my own mind an escape plan, but until the finance is available its just a plan.I’m so glad as not to be alone with this problem. Keep up the good work. NickJ
NickJ:
Welcome to the community, brother! I am in the EXACT same boat as you: Been laid off now for quite some time (Oct. 2008), doing what I have to do to make a few bucks as well, and YES, finances are dictating my escape plan time frame…BUT, make no mistake, once I get back on my feet, I’m gone.
Nick, I think if you polled most of the guys here, we ALL loved our wives…and I’d bet that many still do, but in a different way than a spouse…kinda like a sibling. Hell, I have 4 sisters who I love very much, but there’s no way on earth I’d be able to live with them 24/7. Once you’ve suffered through years of emotional, mental, and in some cases, physical abuse, just because you care deeply about that person doesn’t mean you love them…after all, a HEALTHY spousal relationship, a/k/a a GOOD marriage, implies a certain amount of MUTUAL respect, and RECIPROCAL love. Abuse in ANY form does not equal love, period.
Hang in there, buddy…but, do not let your finances ultimately dictate your life. I do not know of your “support structure” particulars, but if it comes down to it, do you have any family or friends who could take you in for a month or so if things got that bad?
Mike , Thanks for the advise, currently I do have friends and family that I can stay with but at the end it does not seem like a solution! My BPD/NPD wife if the diagnosis is correct has for some time belittled them. They stay in the background and have very little to do with my present circumstances. At the moment I’ve taken a job in the middle east and am hoping that I will be kept very busy until well after christmas. My wife is currently in asia Bali with friends but still manages to send vitriolic emails and texts. When I Skyped her because she was in company it was all sweetness and light. Yes in my mind she is a victim of BPD/NCD something in her past I know not what. Therefore as an unwilling victim of such a condition, with me loving her how can I possibly walk away? I realise that ultimately I might have to for my own sanity but is there in all reality no treatment for her condition. NickJ
Yes, treatment is possible. If she admits there’s a problem. And if she’s willing to go through painful therapy for years.
How can you walk away? Because of this: just because someone was mean to her does not give her the right to be mean to you.
There was a gag like that on TV, in which a character would be horribly cruel, and then when everyone was shocked and hurt she’d say “My parents were mean to me,” and they’d all relax and forgive her and tell her it was OK.
It’s “funny” because it’s true.
It’s not your job to heal her. I think you’ll find your friends and family are all waiting for you to come to your senses. They’ll help you get back on your feet.
Hi NickJ,
How can you walk away? You realize that your life, sanity and self-respect depend upon it and you just do it. So your wife belittled and pushed your family away? Now is an excellent time to reach out to them. Tell them whats going on and ask them for their support. Tell them how much pain you’re in. You will probably be surprised how quickly they open their arms to you.
Now, as for the “I’m still in love with her” thing. The relationship you describe is many things, but it’s not love. It’s part brainwashing, part Stockholm Syndrome, part fear of loss and need for approval, but it ain’t love. When you go to that place in your mind that cries out, “but I love her!” Give yourself a mental shake and begin reality testing the situation. Challenge yourself on this one.
Odds are you’re seeking her love and approval to make up for some childhood injury. However, you’re barking up the wrong tree. This kind of woman won’t heal old wounds; she re-opens them and cuts deeper.
You can do this However, you need to stop fighting for your wife and start fighting for yourself and recovering your life.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
My estranged wife meets the criterion of being a crazy bitch. I have seen two distinctly different women. I never knew which one was going to show up. One was sexy and appealing. The other withheld sex, to the point I did not know how to approach her. She told me that she wasn’t happy and felt like it was my responsibility for her happiness. She left while I was at work, not once but twice. I know that she is not good for me, but at times I still want to be with her. Its like I need to prove my value to her. Is it normal behavior on my part?
Hi Norm…
Is it normal behavior to want to be valued? Yes. It’s even normal to want the approval of someone who denies your value. However, what you need to realize, is, she’s never going to give you that approval. She’s never going to value you. There is nothing -NOTHING- you can do that will “ultimately” satisfy her. You may get lucky, and do something right, and feel valued for an afternoon, an evening, and a day or two, maybe a week if you’re lucky. Then it’ll be a whole new set of hoops to jump through, and a whole new list of demands (or more than likely, the same old demands with a few new ones tacked on).
You will fail.
Now, then. Is this failure indicative of you being a bad person?
No.
Let me repeat that – NO.
You will fail because the game is not designed for you to win. The reference is elsewhere a few times on this site, but think of Lucy and Charlie Brown, when Lucy pulls away the football. Has Lucy ever let Charlie Brown kick the football? No. You are playing with Lucy here. She sets the rules, and they will change at her whim, usually from minute to minute.
YOU CANNOT WIN.
THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT.
NOR IS IT INDICATIVE OF CHARACTER FLAWS ON YOUR PART.
You have tremendous value, for putting up with this crap as long as you have. She sees this value, and will continue to suck the life out of you, until there is nothing left.
Get out of the loop.
You will be happier. You don’t need this. You don’t deserve this. This is not love. This is not a relationship.
I don’t know how to put it any simpler than that.
Good luck, brother. Take charge. Get out. Find the life AND the love that you truly deserve.
Because this ain’t it.
Hi Kev and Norm,
Kev has given you some excellent advice. I encourage everyone to commit these sentences to memory:
YOU CANNOT WIN.
THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT.
NOR IS IT INDICATIVE OF CHARACTER FLAWS ON YOUR PART.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Perfectly said.
Hey folks, could I get another reality check?
Last night I went to hug her and I thought she was going to pinch me because of the way she reached for me, so I moved in such a way to keep her from doing so.
She got angry at me for not trusting her.
That’s crazy, right?
Also: “She sets the rules, and they will change at her whim, usually from minute to minute”
Mine even used to have a name for the ever-changing rules that applied to me and not her.
Hi Mr E,
I’ve gotta ask—what did she call the ever-changing rules that applied to you, but not her?
Cheers,
Dr T
It’s kind of a disappointing story, but they were called “[her name] rules.”
EG. I say “Wait, so you can have raw onions on your food, but I can’t?”
she said, “Yep, it’s a [her name] rule”
I once tried explaining to her that something or other was a “Mr. E Rule.” Silly Mr. E! There’s no such thing! 😉
Dr.T,
Howudoin? Been awhile!
Those “ever-changing rules” are what starts the adversity, and it will drive a man absolutely insane!!! You know, when the arguments ensued in my x-relationship, it was never about the orignal subject.What engaged me into the arguments was the rhetoric, the lack of courtesy for her to “think before she spoke”(impulsive statements), double-standards and the semantics. Her “rules” only applied at a given moment, and of course, were subject to change as it related to a given situation. I remember my X-N went so far as to say, “I want you to adopt MY way of thinking!” How bold is that!! Was this to say my opinions or perceptions would no longer have merit!? I got the double-whammy, as you may recall, my X-N was a “lawyer-litigator”, trained to argue! 11 months later and I’m still in awe about what I put up with,..WOW!
In a normal relationship, we should respect one anothers opinion, or agree to disagree and leave it at that. I don’t especially like the term “rules” as it has a connotation towards “disobedience.” This of course is certainly the mind-set of these crazy women. We as men are simply disobedient in their mind, therefore, the rules must change to fit the situation. In a normal relationship, despite the oneness a couple may have, we each have boundaries (not rules) that should be respected. We are different not only in gender, we are also different in values, perceptions, needs,etc., and normal couples learn to cope and honor those boundaries. I have to laugh when I hear couples discuss the “toilet seat” issues. This is one of the most common and most diliberated issues between a man and woman. A woman may say, “how hard is it to put the toilet seat down when you’re done.” A man may say,”how hard is it for you to put the toilet seat down before you use it.” This of course, is simple for most normal couples to initiate a resolve, however, a “crazy bitch” will never let a man live it down. He could gold-plate that toilet seat, polish it daily, and she would still bitch!
Disobedience applies to pets,children, and law breakers. In such cases, there is always a superior. She is the superior, and the man is the pet dog, the child and the law(rule) breaker. ALWAYS!! It will forever remain the same, no matter what the man does to appease her. We as men try to understand them because our logic and rationale supersedes the reality of our situation. When our logic and reality short circuit, we divert to our emotional side, and then become entrenched/entranced in what we believe is love, all because we no longer choose to follow the path of logic and rationalization. It’s not love we feel,rather, it’s a replacement for our anger and frustrations. It’s what we believe makes us feel better about ourselves and the relationship. It must be love, right!?! Instead of convincing ourselves(via logic and rationale)that we’re in a bad relationship, we create excuses for the “crazy bitch” and ourselves as well. End result, we have lost our sense of reality. She is now in full control!!
Rambling again Dr. T. Just want these guys to see it for what it really is, the epitomy of “mind-F@#King!”
Wow, Melove54…in a greeting, 3 paragraphs, and one short sentence, you have absolutely NAILED the essence of the what and why behind our relationships!
Big-time kudos and good karma to you!
Oh, one last thing…in no way would I consider your posts to be “rambling”; rather, they’re intelligent & eloquent while being very down-to-earth. I have always enjoyed reading your posts!
Mike,
I appreciate your graciousness, and likewise, your contributions to Dr. T’s site I’m sure, have opened some of our fellow victims eyes. Salud!!
This describes by soon-to-be ex-wife to the tee. When I met her in San Antonio, she was sexy etc. then she went through all of the BPD stages and totally flipped on me six months ago by filing for divorce-on our 7th wedding anniversary. At first I was sad because we have two young children but now I am actually feeling that she’s doing me a favor. I get a new start on life. She will never get better. I tried honestly everything and I did love her but this person now just seems vindictive, mean… a pure bitch/witch. She has no way to receive love or affection from my friends or family. She has no friends and isolates herself in her new apartment (she took all of the stuff out of our house by falsely accusing me of abuse my hitting herself to get a bloody nose) It has all been about control – even sex. Sex was great but she used this to punish and try to control. I hope she will get the help she needs one day but this is doubtful. She has attacked my integrity by accusing me of false abuse and completely lied in court. She has custody of our children right now and wouldn’t even allow me an extra day over New Year’s to be with them. I can’t believe I’m stuck dealing with this bitch for over 20 years. The good thing is that my daughter’s love me and I can tell that they can’t wait to see me/spend time. I know that they sense that something is wrong with this bitch. I wish I had caught this earlier before I procreated (but my daugthers are normal- more like me) She is high-functioning and an elementary teacher. She thinks her shit doesn’t stink. Does this just get worse over time with no treatment. I’ve caught her really slipping lately like forgetting to put shoes on the baby and forgetting socks for my oldest when it’s cold outside. What the hell is going on? She gives me the silent treatment and creates these drama situations (daugher has H1N1…car getting repossessed etc. when there is no emergency– we are going through a sep/divorce) I’m glad to be out of her loony world. My only comfort is that the girls are in school with normal people, I see them every midweek for dinner and every other weekend now. I also stop by their school to see them and read to them in the mornings before work.
Hi all —
I’m five months out of a painful and turbulent relationship with a woman who fits the above criteria so well, except for the lipstick, and I am still recovering. It sure takes a lot of energy out of you to do EVERYTHING wrong and to be constantly harassed for being too selfish, too independent, too concerned for everything except for her. If she’d even hear my text message chime on my cell phone once during a weekend, she’d snarl, “Who’s that, your FAN CLUB?!” Yet she herself heard from her family 15 to 20 times a day. She attempted to isolate me, degrade me, and harass me every time she was unhappy with herself–which was always. She once said, while holding me at night, “I don’t want ANYONE to be close to you but me,” as my mind flashed to that scene in MISERY where Kathy Bates breaks James Caan’s ankles to keep him in bed and beholden to his “biggest fan.” My blood ran cold. Luckily the relationship lasted less than 2 years, and I ended it last summer after our fights became too much to bear, but it still felt like an eternity. I truly feel sympathetic for everyone who has been with their girlfriends/wives for years, or who have children with them. I can’t imagine what that must be like.
Although I got out to save my own sanity, I also told her, “You’re obviously very unhappy with me, so I want you to have the chance to be happy with someone else.” It was the leverage I needed to feel like I wasn’t just abandoning her as she always feared, even if I just had to walk to the mailbox to mail bills. Even though I know that she probably will never be happy, it was impossible for her to argue and claim that she really was happy with me. So the altruistic notion of wanting her to “be happy” without me was good leverage to leave her. Nevertheless, she blames me for abandoning her and never wants to speak to me again, but as far as I am concerned, that is a gift. I occasionally have bad dreams and I occasionally need to journal and talk with someone about it, but otherwise leaving her was the healthiest thing I have done for myself in ages.
Certainly, it was painful to leave and I was depressed for a while, but the depression came from having been in the mindfuck-of-a-relationship in the first place, not in departing. The recovery process encompassed all the normal stages of grief. You really ARE grieving, for the illusions you nurtured that she would “get better” or that her positive traits would somehow balance out the emotional minefield of life with her. You’re also grieving the time and energy you wasted trying to save her instead of yourself. Even before you leave, allow yourself to grieve. It’s normal. Your own real life returns to you like blood and warmth flooding back into a frostbitten area. It’s painful, but that’s because you’re ALIVE after all, and not just some extension of her need to control your every waking (and sleeping) move. (The “hand puppet” that others have mentioned is a good metaphor here.)
In the meanwhile, do not let her fully isolate you from other people, even as she will be threatened by anything that’s valuable to you–your friendships, your family, your interests, your career, your time alone. Find ways to reach out to people who care for you, even if you’ve been off-the-map from these people for a while. My ex harassed me anytime I had contact with anyone else, but it only made me more resilient not to let these people go, because I knew that they have a more sincere concern for me than she ever would. And, quite honestly, I knew that my bond with them would outlast our relationship. So if you haven’t had the nerve to leave yet but you are strongly considering it, begin by reaching out to those you care about and who care for you. Tell them you need their love and support. True friends and family will still love and support you even if they haven’t heard from you in a long time–they’ll be glad to have you back. You’re going to need the support, especially because your self-esteem is often shot to hell after any amount of time negotiating the woman you’re with.
In my readings about borderline personality disorder, I learned that it can take years to treat, if at all, because the patient often refuses to accept that their own behaviors are what’s (predictably) pushed others away. They’ll always blame others for leaving/abandoning them, as their own jealousy-traits had always feared would happen. Their jealousy/territoriality/fear of abandonment becomes a self fulfilling prophesy, although they VERY RARELY see it this way, and often only after a LONG time in therapy. Many therapists have difficulty treating people with BPD and some even refuse to do it, because the patients won’t accept responsibility for their own behavior (and instead project back onto the therapist, and all that other stuff that you might know well from being in a relationship with her.) My readings and research made me realize that if professionals have a hard time treating these people, how can we mere mortals do it, when a therapist doesn’t have to live with a patient’s passive-aggressive suspicion 24/7, between manipulative bouts of “affection”?
I am very self-protective, so we fought like crazy. She often got angry at me when I’d get angry at her unreasonable anger towards me. (Sorry if this sounds a little like the “Who’s on first” routine.) However, as a close friend wrote me when I explained what was going on, “It is not possible to be non-reactive with someone so completely reactive! That just means you’re dominated. Shit. She does sound nuts.” I couldn’t have said it better.
And although I am taking some healthy time away from romantic relationships in order to do the creative/professional/friends-related activities that I had to sideline while I was with her, I also believe what another friend said to me. And so I will also say it to you: “You will find your true love, a love that won’t hurt you or drive you crazy. I just know it. :)”
Just a thought, how do I make sure that its not me that is the one causing all the problems? I know that all the bullying that I think I’m a victim of is real enough to me but what about the outside world. Could I be ill myself and not realise it. Is there any kind of self sanity check that can be done!?
Hi
Not sure if this is the right place to post but I need to talk to someone.
I have been with my wife for over 5 years (married 18mths). But right now I have locked myself in my office and feeling a mixture of down and battered, but also strangely positive.
You see, I have read this and other sites on abuse over the past few days and the penny seems to have dropped. Right now, I am reeling from the fact she once again wants a divorce, but this time, I think the reeling is from me realizing it is for the best, and for my sanity.
I have been suffering abuse for about 4 years, bordering to right now that the only safe place is my office where I can lock it from both ends (it’s at the far end of my house). Let me run down to what has happened recently:
1) My wife never (and I mean NEVER) leaves me alone. I work from home and I need to work. I run my own business and do well…..I work so she can look after our two children full time. Sometimes it involves excess (18+) hrs a day but I am always at home. I work hard, especially since we had children, to give them the best start in life. No one goes without, ever.
For the past 6 months I have had to help her look after the kids……fair enough, but to the point that I could not work. I could not earn a penny for 6 months so had to sell one of my assets, a 2009 mobile home on a Royal Park. I paid the bills we had here, plus also her debts (total over $10k).
The next day (new years eve) she tried to kick me out.
2) Her rages are enormous – I always try to talk to her and say you are being unfair – but then she goes into one blaming me, big time. This happens every single day. Blaming me for ruining her life (I did not want kids in the first place but love them now of course)
She gave up work, and I have had to pay over $80,000 of her debts in the past 24 months….many from before I knew here (no idea where she spent the money). She blames me for earning to much as she likes to go 50/50 on expenses and said she could not keep up.
HELLO!!!!!!!!
Am I wrong in thinking be grateful, I will give you a great life, just be my wife and look after the kids? She does not have to work, nor does she want to. I sorted her out financially, still do but its never enough.
3) I bought a big house, she wanted it, but now she hates it and wants another one, but the an hour later she wants a divorce.
4) She called my mum about 6 months ago and told her to ‘eff’ off. She told me not to speak to her as she was a ‘beey’ and I have not since. I also am selective and have one true lifelong friend. She said he tried it on with her (which I no longer believe as he has always liked rake thin girls and my wife is a little plump)…..which means I have no one to speak to.
5) She is on the phone CONSTANTLY……telling her friends how horrible I am…..yet all I do is work to support the family . I kinda hate her now so do not want to sleep with her, do not want to spend time with her, and certainly do not want to talk to her. The reason?
She talks TO me and commands me. No matter what I say it is wrong. She twists EVERYTHING.
6) She is pregnant now, and accused me of drinking the other night……yet the next day she admitted she was drinking…….and then denied she accused me of drinking!
7) She hides things and says “I told you to do that” when she definately did not. She is so clever with words, like a lawyer, but seems to use them on a mega destructive basis.
8) She is already on tamazapam, diazapam and god knows what, but is currently off them due to the pregnancy. However, she has ALWAYS been like this.
9) She yells at the kids but acts like an angel in front of others.
Now I admit I am not perfect….sometimes I get peed off and may throw something in anger….but I guess this a normal reaction to abnormal goading – its all the time!
I work like crazy but do not spend a whole lot of time with my family, but I am always at home so its not as if I am not always there. I help her (always, every 5 minutes, get this, get that…but apparantly I dont help!
I am 35 and a good man. My wife is 29 and I am desparate. She wants me out of the house yet a few hrs ago wanted a new kitchen…….I have earned over $1m in the past 2 years but am nearly broke. I am stuck in my office from her rages.
Today was for me buying her some clothes. We pulled up at the store and about to go in, then she said I was unfaithful (total load of rubbish, never have been or would dream of it…..the abuse has put me off sex anyway)………and we went home……
Then she moans she has no clothes and blames me. Had enough, totally. I am a good looking guy with a lot to give, she does not deserve it.
If this seems like a hate letter its not….I guess the ball has struck and I finally realize that divorce is right…..there comes a time but I could do with some advice / support. I have worked like crazy for my home that I about to leave, and I love my kids like mad…….its a hard road to take but does it sound like I am doing the right thing?
Do I sound like I am bad or wrong?
Or have I got stockholm syndrome?
I keep questioning myself but the abuse really is that bad, adn reading this and other sites has really woken me up to it. I cannot even have a drink or anything anymore, I just have to sit in and work.
I need a life…….comments or help anyone, I am about to go through with it!
Please read through the above letter slowly. I just re-read it and realize how desparate it sounds. I have so much to say and have not said anything in years. The letter sounds kiinda broken which I guess is what I am. I even recorded some stuff the other day, was going to put it on my website so I could get some true comments on my life, kind of big brother style, but she saw a recording and found and deleted them all.
What to do?
Hi Simon,
It doesn’t seem like a hate letter at all. It sounds like a self-realization of the reality of what you’ve been going through. I remember this time and space well. The moment when I saw the light. The moment of clarity. The realization that it’s time to get out of the situation.
After spending a year chipping away (at first) and then launching an all out nuclear war on my soul, my ex decided that it was time for us to break up. I called her bluff. At the time I was still blaming myself for everything, but I still remember my words to her: “If freedom is what you want, then I will give it to you, as it’s the only gift I have left.”
What I didn’t realize at the time, was that I was giving the gift to myself.
(Later, she insisted that if I’d “only” asked her to stay, she would have. Thankfully, I did not).
As for your situation?
It’s time to leave.
You know that. She will not “magically” get better. She will not change. You will not “win” her back, as there’s nothing you can do that will facilitate this happening. As I’ve said elsewhere on this site, THIS IS NOT BECAUSE OF AN INHERENT CHARACTER FLAW IN YOU, NOR IS IT YOUR “FAULT.”
You’ve got a bit of a tough time ahead of you. Divorce, and kids are going to complicate things. Additionally, she will try everything she can to ruin you, and to make you out to be the bad guy to everyone you know.
Stand firm.
She is lying. She is wrong. You know who you really are.
Find a good lawyer who is skilled in high-conflict divorces. Be ready. Be firm. You will survive this. You will have wounds. You will have injuries. But you WILL SURVIVE.
I’d also advice going to a therapist to help you sort through the shit that she has filled your mind with. This is essential.
You’ve got a tough road ahead of you, but you can do it. I’ve been out for just over a year. I know that what I’m saying may be difficult to believe. I know you feel beaten down. But take advantage of the clarity you’re now having. Save yourself. A year ago, I was completely unable to function – I couldn’t remember to eat, and some days I made it halfway to work before I realized that I was still wearing my pajamas. Really.
I’m still working on things, but a year later, I am writing from a place of strength. I’m not all better (maybe never will be), but I am betTER.
One thing I know. If I’d stayed, I would have died. Either by my own hand, or from the stress (actually, one of the things my ex demanded was that I “fight for the relationship or die trying”).
You’ll live through this. It’s going to be Hell, but it will only make you stronger.
Get out.
Get your life back.
Live.
Oh and another thing. I have to sell my dogs.
She wanted them against my wishes soon after we got together. I looked after them, walked them, paid for them and got to really love them.
Now they have to go. She makes them ‘live’ in the bar area and by the pool table. I have to sell them as they are dirty……they might kill the kids (?)……paranoia anyone…….jesus I am reading this site with vigour……….
I am down but definately not out (you can tell I am an optimist in my past life, and will get that back!)
I am NOT crazy, I am NOT making it up, and I AM a good man.
Sounds right, last night she woke me up screaming at me for snoring, and now she’s mad at me all day. Would showing this to her help, or just piss her off?
It will piss her off. Don’t show her this site or anything similar – she WILL use it against you.
Agreed. She may also adopt some of the language and accuse you of being the controlling abuser. It’s probably not a good idea.
I figured that. I’ve heard “You think I’m crazy, that’s just your cop out for everything” so many times is sad. Funny thing is I only use it when she blows up about the super petty stuff.
I have to say this sight has been extremely helpful. I read a lot of it before work, and while at work talked via text about the snoring. This time I wasn’t unarmed. When you’re prepared for this you can be in control, “OK that’s fine, but we need to finish this topic before we move on,” etc. The best was when she changed history because now I had it in writing. “Well you’re the one who’s pissed off, I was over it and you brought it up.” “Actually, babe, I just read what I said and I said, lets go to Macy’s on Tuesday to buy you some new shoes, and you said whatever ass hole do whatever you want.” She didn’t fight that point, but decided to act like she wasn’t mad anymore but totally hurt because this time I refused to apologize for yelling back to her. “Well I’ve made my peace, it’s up to you now”
The end is near.
The worst one was one time we were walking home from a bar, (both had been drinking) and she stops walking right in the middle of the street so she could tell me something. I told her to walk and talk as it was 2 am, cold and she was standing in the middle of the street. This set her off into one of her moods, she told me she was going to kill herself as a punishment to me. This snapped me out of my emotions and I started talking calmly to her, to get her to relax. She just kept screaming and screaming, telling me to leave her alone. How can I leave her alone after that threat? I didn’t, so she found a kitchen knife and attacked me with it. (I didn’t get hurt, she just stabbed the mattress, but still)
She’s never apologized, at least not sincerely, “I said I’m sorry, why do bring it up” but worse then that it’s my fault. “I told you to leave me alone and I didn’t know what else to to”
How do you find support for this? You can’t tell your friends and family this or they’ll just think you have this fucked up life. It’s looking like the only thing to do is leave before it gets worse, but it’s hard when her rage is a disorder. I wouldn’t leave her for being an epileptic. When she’s not “the other girl” we have a happy, healthy relationship.
Hi Rich,
Just out of curiosity does she have a lot of the symptoms of BPD or NPD? She seems from your post as she could possibly be Bipolar moreso. I was in a relationship with someone who was diagnosed by a Dr. as being bipolar who did such a similar thing, I just wondered. It is the paranoia aspect of it that made me wonder I think. Does she rage often or is it more hyper behavior or religious delusion & depression? All My Best.
I’m not sure. We both thought it was bipolar or manic depression. And this this the weird part, before we got engaged there was always the happy beginning, we’d be at a party and she would be the center of attention, dancing with other girls etc, and then the second we got home she would freak out at me. That was the knife thing. Now though, it looks more like BPD because the aren’t alcohol related. I come home and and accidentally startle her and she doesn’t like being startled so she chews me out and we sleep in different rooms until I apologize for “not respecting her privacy” because I should have known to knock first before going into my own apartment.
Sorry just had to vent there.
Anyways the answer to your question is I don’t know enough to answer that.
“It’s looking like the only thing to do is leave before it gets worse, but it’s hard when her rage is a disorder. I wouldn’t leave her for being an epileptic. When she’s not “the other girl” we have a happy, healthy relationship.”
She went after you with a knife. That is abuse – there’s no question. A loving person does NOT try to stab/threaten to stab the person they love. Get out.
Yes, she (probably) has a disorder. It doesn’t matter, because she treats you like dirt. Understand that “personality disorder” is clinical language for “raging asshole.” Don’t worry about her diagnosis – that is HER problem.
You can not help her. You do need to take care of yourself. Get out before she actually stabs you.
Regarding “when she’s not the other girl” – the girl chasing you around with a knife, standing in traffic, saying she’s going to kill herself, and screaming at you for snoring IS the real girl. The nice girl is a facade.
There is support here, and your friends and family will probably surprise you with their support.
Mr E,
You almost made me snarf my morning avocado shake:
Understand that “personality disorder” is clinical language for “raging asshole.” Thanks for my first laugh of the day.
On a more serious note, Mr E is absolutely right, Rich. A knife is physical abuse. From your description, she appears to be incredibly emotionally abusive, too.
Conditions such as epilepsy and diabetes are not the same as a charterological disorder. I think personality disorders should be renamed “characterological” disorders because people with them have very poor characters. Epileptics and diabetics suffer from medical conditions and, unless they have characterological issues, do not lash out at and abuse their loved ones. You’re living with a rattlesnake. Sure it’s her nature to strike out at you, but that doesn’t mean it’s okay or that you need to be patient and forgiving. It means that if you don’t want to live under near constant fear of when she’ll strike next, you need to stop living with and exposing yourself to a rattlesnake.
Many women like your gf seem great in the beginning. This is an act to lure you in close. Once they feel secure in your attachment the mask and the and the gloves (and in your case, the blade scabbard) come off and you see the true person underneath the false sweetness and light. People like your gf are emotional con artists and predators. Please protect yourself and get out.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Amen Dr.T and Mr.E!! Intimacy with a knife is not what I call alluring!! Take care everyone!
I’ve had a look at your quiz and was able to answer yes to most of them. the others were I don’t know”
I’m not sure if this is the correct place to let this all out,and if not, apologies.
We met 11.5 years ago, we were both married at the time.instantly the sex, the adoration, the need to be together was intense. this affair went on for a few months, until i moved interstate, i then decided i wanted to try and repair the damage i had cause to my marriage and to my wife at the time. I was doing my best and our marriage was recovering. Then one day, the woman i had the intense affair with contacted me and i told her how i was going with restoring my marriage. She told me her marriage was over, and i believed her. I felt guilty and blamed myself.
She then arrived the following week, and blew my repair work out of the water.
So we moved in together January 2000, and it began. Subtle digs at something i had no recollection of doing. Telling me i was controlling and manipulating, and it went on. Some times were just perfect, and other times i recall just looking for somewhere to hide. she left me many times, saying how horrible i was and how my issues were too deep for her to be able to handle. We went into counseling and things got better for a while. She got herself into a psychology course with a degree at the end of it. And i noticed that her attacks became deeper, more psychologically based and i found that i was being diagnosed with every trait know to the universe, and abused and blamed for it. She re-engaged with her high school sweetheart 2 years ago,as time went on, she was making calls and denying it, hiding at parks etc to call him.She denied any attachment to him, and blamed me for not trusting her.
Between April 2009 and december 2009 I noticed that her attacks were more intense more personal, and that everything i said on any subject was instantly wrong. And her version was the right one. She is never wrong.I shut every feeling down and totally disconected from her and myself. I know now it was to protect myself, because the day she left, everything started to return. I felt safe to have my own thoughts and feelings. She left Dec 3 2009, a week later she was dating, and a week after that her school sweetheart miraculously appeared and stayed with her a week. I won’t go into details, it’s not really important. She sends me text messages either abusing me and telling me it’s all my fault, or kind loving gentle messages asking me to come over and have sex with her.
But 3 things stand out like an exploded land mine.
she sent me a text message telling me i drove her into the arms of another man because i didn’t trust her. And she felt so liberated from my controlling ways
She told me it was my fault she walked all over me for all those years, because i let her.
She is now doing with this school sweetheart exactly what she did to me when we first met.
She’s away interstate for a month now with him, and i am doing as much as i can for me before she comes back.
The more i read, the more it makes sense, but is still so hard to get my head around it
She believes everything she does is right, because the universe and her angels and spirit guides tell her it is right.the cards tell her she is right in everything she does.I asked her a week ago why she sent me that message about driving her into the arms of another man.
She said “because i wanted to hurt you”
Well it worked
Hi again
Here’s something new.
As i was going in to see my therapist yesterday, i received a txt message from my SO.
She is 3000 kms away with her “new man” the txt reads “mwahhh”
I spoke about it with my therapist, and he said. She’s over there with him,and she’s rubbing your nose in it with that message. she’s showing you absolutely no respect.
Why aren’t you angry ?
I answered.. “i don’t know”
Why am i not angry about how she’s still treating me?
Can anyone offer anything here?
You are not angry because when she sent the text you realized that there is no reason to be angry.
This individual is so shallow, so pathetic, and so uncaring and incapable of simple human decency that they actually feel in some warped way justified in sending a text to ‘try to rub your nose in it’.
You’re not angry because you realize that acting out with such shallow behaviour is no way to live, and a person who is capable of acting that way isn’t someone you want affecting your life or in your life at all for that matter.
It is a shame that so many relationships end up in the trash can because of emotional immaturity. Although I would seek other professional examples of BPD or NPD before finalizing a divorce over this quiz. If you cannot find any other means of taking back your relationship [and the Pants], separation may be the only alternative. I blame most of male/female woes on feminism, the ‘acceptance’ of homosexuality as a norm, and a crippling reliance on technology at the expense of our health and brain usage. Even in college I see professors [overpaid preachers] emasculate men of all generations, masculin-izing women today and sexualizing our children on a daily basis. Men do not know how to act like men anymore and women are brainwashed into thinking they really do not need men for anything, not even sex or reproduction. Basically, you men have been usurped by a testosterone-hating sociological machine. For the women I can say that many have no clue that this has happened and end up as unhappy as today’s men. It is a twisted view of reality, but real it is. The feminine and masculine role needs to be rebalanced to THE WAY IT WAS-before all this gender equality came about. it is not about a power exchange, it is about natural male leadership in exchange for feminine admiration and compassion. Everyone has seem to have forgotten what their genitals look like!
P.S. I love to wear fire engine red lipstick. It is economical and my fiancee loves it.
Hello,
Thank God someone in your field recognizes this epidemic in America. My ex is a Jewish,Swedish,Sicillian,Athiest,Feminist who is everything you posted in that quiz. Simply put, I have been denied access to my Daughter for some 18 yrs. My Daughter is now 18. I have recordings and journals documenting all the lies,abuse etc I endured after the split. It is my word against hers as far as what happened during our time together before I started documenting everything. My question is, how might I establish a relationship with my Daughter who has been braninwahsed against me by my ex?
The most hurtful part is when they turn it all around to make you the bad guy.
I’m trying to get out of the “victim mindset” that allows these Psychopaths to do anything to us, all the while shaming us into complancency and ineffectuality.
They have decived themselves into false victimhood and think as a victim of some imagined slight, they in turn can do anything to anyone because, they are the real victim. too bad the courts block swift correction of these psychopaths.The courts are run by these victims and are a big part of the problem. bunch of wankers, every single one of them . parents most likely wankers as well.
Yesterday, before I accidentally ended up to this web page, I was bored to my wife.We have been together about 20 years and sometimes the the life seem boring.
However, noticing that my wife did not get any “bitch points” and reading what kind of hell the life could be with such bitchy women, my eyes were opened wide seeing the real value of my wife!! My love for my wife was rekindled to a flame! Sometimes man ought to see hell in order to see what he got!
Same time I feel sorry for you guys with a bad marriage. Really and honestly. I hope you all find a good solution to your marital problems.
Tommy
This is really a great commentary by you. Its easy to get stuck in your own world and join others together but your breath of fresh air really is nice to hear. Best Wishes
Wow, what a great resource this site is! I have young sons of dating age, and they are aware of what a minefield it is out there. Aubbie hit the nail on the head with the femminism connection. Femminists are so dum they don’t realize that their quest for ‘equality’ has played right into the hands of all the young testosterone filled young men wanting to sow their oats with as many partners as possible…it’s like picking fruit…there’s so much of it you gorge on it but feel sick after. This scenario has allowed the sex with no strings to become the norm as young women seem to embrace the ‘sluts r cool’ theory…the boys love the sex with no strings, but lament the fact that if and when they want to ‘settle down’ they’ll probably have to look for traditional women in the third world to find one that knows what being a ‘woman’ means. Thank you Dr. T for helping all these hurting men out there…bout time someone spoke up for the men!!!
Thanks for the support, albertagreekgirl. It’s always appreciated—especially from another woman.
Kind Regards,
Dr T
I read with interest your original article, then all the heartbreaking comments. It really piqued my interest because a few years ago, (2004) a shrink hired by the child welfare system in my province, tested me, assessed me (at great cost to the taxpayers) and concluded that my final diagnosis was BPD. I was astounded, and horrified and really didn’t think I fit the description at all. At that time I was extremely frustrated to the point of going insane, and nearly having a nervous breakdown, but that was because of the out of control living situation I was in. Not because there was something ‘wrong’ with me.
I was married in 1987 very young (age 21) to a man 7 years older than me who was looking for a ‘traditional wife’. We both attended a church promoting the ‘traditional’ family. Due to several birth control failures we ended up with 5 sons. My ex was a real conflict avoider,(preferring to ‘think’ about things for hours or days even) which nearly drove me insane, because he refused to deal with any and all issues that came up regarding the rearing and discipline of the kids, and since the first 4 sons are 4 years apart in age, (including twins) when the first one hit adolescence, the shit really hit the fan.
I was expecting my ex to be the ‘traditional’ disciplinarian, and deal with his increasingly out of control teenager with some appropriate consequences (he was skipping school, smoking weed, etc.) When my ex put his head in the sand instead of being the ‘man’, this lead to escalation between myself and the 13 year old which resulted in my hitting him in the head with my keys to protect myself form being physically attacked. He regularly called me names (the kid) and swore at me, which of course I greeted with an escalation of consequences (and a lot of yelling and swearing), and the end result was that my role as the mother and nurturer was usurped. I had become an out of control shrew…frustrated to the nth degree. Nervous breakdown was right around the corner.
After the key incident, I guess my ex figured that someone was going to end up dead if he didn’t do SOMETHING, so instead of trying to work with me, he went to a mens shelter and claimed he was being abused by me emotionally, and accused me of abusing my children physically and emotionally. Child welfare stepped in and put me under a supervision order and had me removed from my home and my youngest child then age 4 was left in the care of a bunch of weed smoking, school skipping teenagers, while I was basically turfed out onto the street to try to fend for myself with no education past grade 12, and a work history that was ‘stay home mom’ for the previous 15 years. He tried to sue me for sole custody (failed) and after I was finished jumping thru all of child welfare’s hoops (including the psych assessment) I was spit out from the system(thank you legal aid and intuitive social worker) after only 10 months, and resumed primary custody of my 2 youngest kids age 5 and 12, as well as joint custody of the other 3.
They preferred to live with dad, since there were no rules at dads house. They could smoke weed to their hearts content, drink themselves silly, skip school with nary a consequence. I was only separated from my kids for 10 months total, and I was very very happy I could keep my youngest child away from the damaging influences of his older brothers. There was weekly visitation, and my ex started paying me child support as ordered by the court.
Now fast forward 6 years. That oldest son is now nearly age 21. He has had a very difficult time in school because of his extreme weed smoking. (and other drugs) He tried to become a cocaine dealer, attracted by the fast money, and ended up crying on the phone to me last may, begging me to help him. He was sleeping in his car in the freezing cold. His dad had kicked him out of the house finally. We hadn’t lived together since he was 13. I let him move into my basement with some strict house rules and he had to get a ‘real’ job and stay employed or he’d be back into his car. That was last may, now he’s working as a plumbing apprentice, and doing well. We couldn’t live together for very long as his personal habits and messiness were nearly impossible for me to live with. He’s back at his dad’s house now, paying room and board, planning to get his own house soon. The second son who is 19 now, spent all of grade 8 high on weed every day (he confessed this to me) and dropped out of school in grade 11. He is working dead end jobs, living with dad, and paying room and board. I have had no influence in these two oldest lives since they were age 13 and 11. Their dad let them do whatever they wanted to do..including dropping out of school. They’ve realized that in order to have any relationship with me they need to get jobs, and quit the drugs.
My twins are almost 17 and are both in grade 11, drug free (for the most part) and are both planning to become apprentices and work in the trades. My youngest is age 10, and has learned ALOT from witnessing all of this drama for the last 6 years. Their father is living still in the marital home, alone, and is a functioning alcoholic. He has shown his boys EXACTLY what NOT to do as a father. My oldest son is quite an anti-femminist and directed me to the savethemales.ca site, which linked me to your article above.
While most of the mens stories above demonstrate how hard they’ve tried and are trying to make things work with a psycho woman, in some cases the psycho woman is created by the lack of leadership shown by the husband. As in my case.
I am remarried to a REAL man 8 years older than me with two 20 something sons of his own. That he took me on with all my ‘baggage’ is a miracle. He is a committed and devoted stepfather to my 10 and 17 year old sons who live with me full time. He is a traditional ‘macho’ type man (born in Greece) and I have no doubt that if we had raised children together, things would have turned out A LOT differently. My kids respect him, and are eager to please him. Believe me there is NO name calling towards me by my adolescent son, or the 10 year old.
Life is peaceful and happy. I have a great relationship with my twins, and the youngest. It is an OK relationship with the older two, who feel I treated them unfairly when they were younger. We do discuss the past, and they have a hard time acknowledging that their out of control adolescent behavior was the major catalyst that destroyed their parents marriage. My ex and I might have been able to have a happy relationship if we had had no children, or had very easy children. No I wasn’t an angel, and neither was their father but challenging children can try even the strongest of marriages, never mind one where one party can’t handle any conflict. (he never saw his parents argue) The lesson in all of this is this: GET OUT EARLY rather than late. I should have left at least a decade before I did…all the signs were there, but I ignored them, hoping and praying things would get better. Once you are on your own you can really evaluate yourself, your flaws, and your good points, and see the marriage for what it really was. Don’t think kids will make anything better….they almost ALWAYS make things worse. Conflict avoiders, don’t think you’re doing anyone any favors by your silence…DEAL WITH ISSUES WHEN THEY COME UP. If you’re with someone who won’t deal, GET OUT!!!
When I watch videos of myself with my oldest kids way back when, I’m saddened that they were deprived of the loving, kind and patient mother that I am now. THIS IS THE REAL ME!!! My 10 year old is definitely the big winner here… When I ask myself ‘why were you like that’ my answer is that living with someone who you can’t be on the same page with and who won’t deal with problems can destroy your relationship with your kids…and your sanity.
I wish you all the best.
AlbertaGreekgirl
Wow what a story. Glad to hear through all your troubles you are now the REAL YOU since you’ve found a REAL man.
I must say though that your comment “in some cases the psycho woman is created by the lack of leadership shown by the husband” is pretty out there.
In fact to a large extent that is exactly the kind of comment one would expect to hear a BPD woman make as she deflects any and all responsibility for her actions away from her and to her partner.
Pretty much everything you wrote is about you deflecting responsibility for your actions to your ex.
Sadly you go as far as admitting carrying out by every definition of the term – domestic violence – yet this is not your doing nor in your control – you picking up keys and throwing them a your child was in fact your ex’s doing???
Is your ex is Telekenetic??
Whoa there – something’s not adding up here.
To be quite blunt from what I’ve read with all THE BIG CAPS inserted you come across as being 100% BPD.
And I’m not the expert here but I can promise you none of the men who connect with this site ‘created’ their BPD or NPD partner.
Alberta-
I understand your story. You do not have any BPD or ADD or NHA or ESPN etc. What you DID have was a major role reversal. Men and women are supposed to do certain things, especially in a family setting. This is the truth and will always be the truth; lesbians, gays, and politically correct people be damned! Men are to be breadwinners, fight and compete for their living out there in the asphalt jungle. They are virile, have penises, tons of testosterone and are full of creative energy. They need to use that and have a purpose driven life. They bring back their earnings and share what they can with their wife and offspring, delighting in leading by example and the secure atmosphere only they can provide.
Children pick up on a dead-fish father or an overbearing and masculine mother. They are confused, act out, especially during hormone-rampant teen years. As you said, children can test the best of marriages. My parents have been together for 31 years. They may not be as they were during the first year, but four girls later and my father is still the blunt tough rugged marine I’ve always known. I respect that, I love him for that. He is a man’s man. If I can become half the woman my mother is, I’ll die happy.
Now anyone who says to go overseas for a wife be warned: Some of the toughest women I’ve ever met are foreign. They may wear dresses, be feminine in appearance and behavior, but they are stronger than our American counterparts simply because they have not been brainwashed like we have since birth. But do not condemn ladies here. It may take a generation or two of misery and despair but they’ll wake up someday.
If you have little girls and boys, raise them as traditional as you can. Let them believe in white picket fence America, poodle skirts and gentlemen who opens doors for ladies. Men discipline your children! Actions speak louder than words and belt does it well! Do not let your wife who is supposed to be the nurturer and sensitive side of you give all the punishment.
Know your roles. Their is a balance to be made in every situation and family is the most important place to start. In the meantime do what the movie the Boiler Room says: “Act As IF!”
I was not attempting to deflect any and all responsibility for my actions away from me and onto my ex. I took responsibility for and changed my inappropriate behaviors thru counseling and a lot of reading. Efforts which were noticed by the child welfare system, and hence my short time in their care. I didn’t want to be a crazy yelling mother, and in my struggle to understand why I became that way I realized that I was being forced into a role that I was ill suited for (to be the disciplinarian for my adolescent sons) I wanted to nurture my sons, to feed them healthy food, bake cookies, to talk to them, read them stories, guide them etc etc. Not be the only one trying to figure out how to deal with their school skipping, dope smoking and other damaging behaviors.
I feel that if I had had a supportive partner instead of someone who just became paralyzed by the sights, sounds and effects of conflict, not to mention the chaos and confusion of having 5 sons very close in age, we together, could have found ways to deal with that behavior so that it most likely wouldn’t have escalated into violence.
Violence is never ok, and it is something I loathe, and am trying to better understand why I became that way. Obviously if I had done what my gut had told me to do a decade earlier, which was end the marriage, we wouldn’t be having this conversation. Just because I say that I feel that not having a supportive partner helped escalate things into violence doesn’t mean I’m deflecting personal responsibility for my part in it! I am 100% responsible for choosing to stay with someone I couldn’t be an effective parent with!
Because I am now the type of parent I always endeavored to be, I can see the difference. Physical discipline was never something I was comfortable with, although the church my ex and I attended promoted it widely. Obviously hitting the boy with keys was 100% my doing and completely unacceptable, I have never tried to portray otherwise, and I never tried to hide my part in it. I took responsibility, got help, changed my behaviors, realized my partnership with my ex was toxic, and moved on to a more healthy paradigm. Yes he forced my hand by having me removed from my home for a period of months, but in that time I was able to attend counseling and realize how toxic the whole relationship was, and how far away from the real me I had wandered.
I guess I’m not articulate enough to get my point across effectively to you, but I’m not suggesting that the men reading your posts have ‘created’ their BPD partners. I’m saying that I feel that I was misdiagnosed, and that some of the ‘crazy yelling bitch’ behaviors were in part caused by not having a full partner to help me parent my sons, and the extreme frustration that ensued. Not only would he not discipline them ‘his way’ as I begged him to, (and I would support his way), he would leave me do it my way, then not support the consequences. For example, one consequence was taking away access to a bike because the teenager wouldn’t wear his helmet (the law in my province) Dad would later see that son who is grounded from using bike, (because of his refusal to wear a helmet), riding the bike, and would say nothing. In my opinion a supportive parent would have stopped the boy and held him accountable and made sure he took the bike back home and put it away. Being undermined when you’re trying to teach responsible behavior to teenagers is just impossible to overcome. You cannot win, the teenager will always (usually ) take the path of least resistance. I didn’t always say things had to be my way, I didn’t care who’s way it was, but it had to be SOME way because letting the kid ride his bike to and from school every day without a helmet was breaking the law, and extremely dangerous! Walking 3 kms to school wouldn’t kill the teenager, but not wearing a helmet might…
And the real me wasn’t discovered when I met a real man (I hope you were being sarcastic with that comment)…..we only married last year, after dating for a few years. I discovered the real me, the loving, patient mother, when I was a single parent for quiet a long time. With no one to undermine me, there was no confusion for the kids, and peace ensued. So much so that the teenagers want to spend time with me…and I enjoy their company immensely. My kids are all old enough now to live wherever they want to…I can’t ‘force’ them to live with me, nor would I ever do so. And if my 10 year old decides that he would rather live with his father, he has my complete blessing to do so.
My relationship with my ex is also peaceful, there is no conflict. He takes the kids whenever he wants them, they are free to come and go as they so choose. We share all major holidays We have resolved our issues, and put our toxic past behind us. He’s still a conflict avoider, and it frustrates my older sons all the time. They come complaining to me about it…and I just tell him that he is what he is and they can’t expect him to be more. I do not criticize my ex to my sons. In fact more often than not I find myself defending him, because you know 21 year olds aren’t exactly the most mature beings…
BPD is not the same as a ‘psycho yelling frustrated parent’…. Once the ‘psycho yelling parent’ disappeared, there was and is no similarity at all between myself and the classic symptoms of BPD; I’m not a black and white thinker, I don’t have a jealous bone in my body, I encouraged my ex and encourage my current husband to spend as much time with their friends as they want to. I am definitely not a clingon. I enjoy the time apart to get projects done by myself, and the reunion is fun! I wear almost no makeup, never mind red lipstick..eww. Sex is frequent and still as fun as it was in the beginning (with current hubby). There’s no rage, I get worked up about politics or injustices at times, but rage and yelling aren’t a part of my life at all. I’m not implusive, I don’t drink or smoke or gamble, I love reading, gardening…and cooking. I do not have low self esteem, I know my worth, and can be happy partnered, or alone. There is no instability in my life, emotionally or otherwise. I don’t yell, I don’t get angry, and I could go on. The fire that fueled the ‘yelling bitch’ is long dead. I can just be myself.
I’m sorry if I’m not the best communicator, it’s hard to give a complete picture with a few paragraphs. I feel that I’ve hijacked this thread, and that wasn’t what I intended to do. I apologize for that.
A very valid and enlightening perspective, Alberta. Thank you for sharing this.
Dr. T, your hypothetical case sounds like my ex-Karen. Fortunately for me, she tipped her hand early. When finally it escalated to physical abuse, strictly from her to me, the first time I simply went missing for the remainder of the evening. The second time she struck me, I calmly walked down to the building superintendent’s cubicle, wrote out a check for two months rent, and told the super I was leaving her to her own devices but with two months’ rent prepaid to cushion her fall. I was in another flat, on the other side of the city, within thirty-six hours. I thank my Gods it never got as far as marriage, though we had discussed this. She cheated me out of ten thousand dollars in six months, but other than that I got out of it with a whole skin
Hi Robert Pinkerton,
Physical violence is a deal-breaker. Period. I’m glad you’re out. Too bad you couldn’t recoup the money, but think of it as an expensive lesson. What these individuals get away with makes me so angry.
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
Hi Dr. T.
I have just been reading “Is she a crazy bitch” and the following comments and I am astounded at what some men have to go through. While I am happily married for 40 years I am however a son of one of those woman. She was married and divorced twice and I had to endure her emotions. She never got on with my wife and I was placed as a buffer between my family and her.
I can assure you that there was for the last 40 years not one Christmas or Easter or other family occasion which I didn’t dread .
This must have put a lot pressure on me because my GP diagnosed high blood pressure without being able to find a physical cause for it.
Evaluating my life and circumstances thus far I came to the conclusion that my relationship with my manipulative mother was the cause of it and so I told her straight that I will no longer be manipulated. She did not like it!
Two weeks later she accused me of stealing money from her and if I don’t give it back she will call the police which she did. I returned her keys and told her to go to hell. I felt really bad abandoning a 87 year old woman until 4 weeks later while riding my push bike I realised that this really was the best solution for me. I got her of my back and it was her fault for crossing the line by accusing me falsely.
I can report that my blood pressure is now normal and feel relieved of a giant burden. I received a cellphone call at Christmas which I didn’t accept and one of her friends phoned me a week later telling me that she is in hospital which must be a lie because the hospitals around here have my number on file as the “next of kin”.
While all of the comments here are usually about husband/wife relationships I am sure there must be other sons and daughters with ‘bitchy’ mothers.
I still wonder if I did the right thing by breaking off all contact but I feel great.
“Almost Live” was a local comedy show that aired at 11:30 on Saturdays in Seattle. If the link doesn’t work, look search “The Worst Girlfriend in the World” on Youtube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cHVfynwev4&feature=related
With what most of us have been through, we deserve a little humor.
It’s far too late now, but I recognize many traits of my ex, which I was in denial about at the time. I really didn’t want a divorce, but I thought I was losing my sanity and it affected my later relationships with women. I appreciate Henry putting this on his site.
Going on 7 years. 3 married, I thought getting married would make things better. no kids. Agree with the lipstick, no, comment but the idea your conveying is a yes, very vain. Want to die also. She won’t go. Can’t support herself/hold down a job. Threatens me with if you even try and divorce me i’ll make up such horrible stories you’ll go to jail or lose your license (I’m a doctor). I have offered her up to 100k to leave, won’t go. So I think try and make it work. She’s on a constant roller coaster of drugs. Her new doctor is pill pusher. They are constantly uping or downing a dose or changing it. She thinks she is bettter. lol. Dr T is pathological lying part of this??? I don’t want to lose my practice of 23 years and god knows if someone will take her serious and damage my reputation. Even if it’s not the truth I can’t win.
1. Get a lawyer who specializes in divorce from NPD/BPD spouses. Do not tell her yo’re doing this. Prepare your case in secret. Your lawyer will tell you what you need to do. Meanwhile…
2. Get a small digital voice recorder and carry it around with you. Record her making those threats and other abusive outbursts.
3. Get a notebook and journal her other crazy or abusive behaviors.
Hi Dr. T
thanks for this great site, an eyeopener. My partner ticks most boxes, yes the lipstick one too. We have been together for 3 years and we have been seeing a couples therapist for the past 2 years. Progress has been glacial, but then again ‘I forget the good times’… My initial response to my partner’s denigration and shouting was to ‘bottle it up’, then after 6 months’ (individual) therapy sessions I begun to ‘fight back’, to defend my actions and to shout back when I was very fed up+tired. The councillor (a woman) made it her life goal to stop me fighting back and I have spent a lot of energy modifying my behaviour so as to be firm but not get upset. 3 weeks ago my partner had another go at me during a weekend holiday trip. The reason was I had to check emails as I was expecting a really urgent response from a business partner (I explained it was really urgent and it would take 5 minutes to do). I remained calm throughout her fit etc etc, she would not have it, she was unstoppable and eventually I ended up in the bathroom, crying. So much for my ‘civil’ approach. This brought the message home though, I realised I was actually being abused by my partner. The most shocking bit for me however is that in the session that followed the therapist tried to convince me that my partner’s fits are also my fault!! She insisted that something I do is what triggers my partner off. I did repeat again and again that whatever I may have done does not warrant my partner’s response. When I said that on many occassions my partner will ‘suddenly flip’ without no reason, she asked me whether I am insinuating that my partner is crazy (I said “no, but I do think my partner has certain behaviours which are not helping her relationships with others”). When I argued that “it’s just a bloody email during a 3-day period” she told me that other people can do without email, why cannot I? I told the therapist I am angry at her victimising me and for finding excuses for my partner’s abuse, she told me that when things go wrong she “always starts from the premise that both parties have something to do with it”. Can you imagine what would have happened if a man therapist had said that to a rape victim? I am not going to go to any more sessions (I am splitting from my partner anyway) and I’ll make my point again when I call to cancel, don’t know if this will be of any use to anyone else but me though (if that). I hope however that this comment is of some use to someone who has found or will find himself in a similar situation.
I don’t know where else to go. I am so sad, all the time. It’s getting worse and worse
And to think the feminists still talk about domestic violence as if it’s a man created problem.
How about mental abuse? At least when the physical beating stops the pain goes away. These women just keep coming in waves on poor suffering guys. Where is the media, the newspapers, the sitcoms depicting this truth? Instead, they’ve taken to making men appear like buffoons undermining their position in the family (when a man exists at all).
I’ve come to the conclusion that anything that walks in high heels or wears pumps engages in rendition (torture) against men.
I could make a case for prostitution. At least, you can pay them to go away. Getting rid of one of these women is; costly, painful and almost impossible.
The real question is who so distorted relationships between men and women, and give the latter twisted expectations? Who benefited? The answer is fascinating. Start with Karl Marx’s feminist manifesto and follow the putrid trail through the 60’s womyn’s libbers and onto the present affirmative action apartheid. And finally we come to the endgame. Who benefited from the breakdown in male female relationships, marriage and the family? The answer is shocking.
As a woman who has read your article, I am sad and disturbed by what you wrote, as I see myself in much of it…however, there are circumstances within my relationship that I feel make me this way as well. I got re-involved with an old boyfriend who was a married man and in prison and we both wanted to be back together when he was released from prison. His letters to me for 5 years told of his undying love, that he was going to divorce the woman he was married to as they only had a relationship that was more sister/brother than wife/husband. He told me over and over how he only wanted to make me happy and come back to me and have a wonderful life together. I waited for over 5 years for him and when he was released he had to go back to his wife’s residence for several months before he could move into my house. He finally did this and after 6 years of living together in total hell, he is about to finally be divorced. In these past 6 years since he came out and moved in with me we have done nothing but fight. I have been angry that he spends so much time with his family members in another town leaving me for days on end even without calling me to tell me he is not coming home. I also got pregnant and now have his 2 year old child. He has several children from several different women from his past but none with the wife he was divorcing. He never tried to really make us, (me, him, and my older daughter) a family as he used to say in his letters to me…he just wanted to go spend overnights in another town with his siblings and drink. This in turn caused me to feel unloved and lonely, as I waited for him for so long and he didn’t even want to spend time with me. He does work and provides financially but I help as well. He feels this entitles him to do whatever he wants, including leaving me for days and not being accountable for this. Needless to say, this behavior of his has caused me to become the type of woman you describe in your article. I never acted like this before he made all these wonderful promises to me and then decided to basically ignore me to spend his time with his sisters and brothers getting drunk all the time. There is much much more to this situation but I just wanted to write to you to see what your comments would be regarding this situation. I unfortunately act like what you’ve described, not everything, but some things…but it was after I was set up to be let down by this man and I can’t seem to get over the hurt from it all. Does anyone get this?
Personally I never can understand anyone who makes comments like: “however, there are circumstances within my relationship that I feel make me this way ”
No one makes you do or act in a certain way – you chose to act how you act and you could have chosen to act a different way.
Check the posts from albertagreek who also spends most of her long commentary affirming she was not responsible for her behaviour either – ‘the man I was with made me do it’ is her outlook on life as well. What a cop out.
What happens to you has absolutely nothing to do with anyone but you. Start holding yourself accountable for your actions and I’m sure your life will go much better.
Ya know, there are a couple of things I learned through living with a psycho women from hell. In a way, it was all my fault. If I had done the right thing and followed the Lord’s guidance by dating a CHRISTIAN WOMEN and having NO SEX, and just courted for a while. If I had done this, number 1, I would have found out she was a psycho.#2 I would have not got in her lunatic grip by us having a baby out of wedlock. #3. I would not have gone though years of hell chasing my daughter whom will not even speak to me now. In short, while it is true she was a freaking evil bitch, I ALLOWED it to happen by NOT doing what I knew to be the right thing. The only consolation is the hope that all of this crap turns good later by Gods grace and my daughter turns from her Mothers influence, turning to the Lord. It would be too sweet if then she was able to convert her Mom. If there is one person I know who needs healing desperately, it is my ex and I sure hope one day she sees all her wrongs and quits her ways. All it is is continued pain for her, my daughter, my self and others in her life.
Ty
Lately, I can’t help but wonder: is our current culture actually creating and then promoting a narcissistic attitude amongst women growing up these days?
Case in point: Why is it that when women stand up for themselves, it’s viewed as “Female Empowerment” or “Women’s Rights”. Whereas, if a man were to exhibit the same behavior in a similar situation, he is almost invariably viewed as sexist?
Kinda always leaves men to feel like the bad guys no matter what we do.
I mean, don’t get me wrong: I’m a firm believer in equality. What I’ve been noticing these past several years however, is a movement away from equality and instead towards entitlement and domination.
It’s unsettling to say the least.
Jon:
The Canadian Family Law system is one system that perpetuates the entitlement and domination you speak of and furthers the inequality.
Not only are many women coached in preventing men access to their children by lawyers, and not only are the police more than eager to arrest the man based solely on the ‘word of the woman’ the perpetuation of inequality is built into support agencies.
I just recently had a discussion with one of the directors of the Chatham Ontario Women’s shelter who confirmed to me that the shelter does absolutely nothing to confirm or collaborate allegations of abuse when a woman comes to them in a domestic violence situation.
‘We take the woman at her word’ was what I was told over and over – no matter what the situation or scenario I suggested.
So just imagine – one is dealing with a NPD woman and one has children with this woman. She can go to a women’s shelter and get all the tax payer funded support in the world to pursue false allegations of abuse or domestic violence with absolutely nothing more than her word.
Unsettling is an understatement.
Yeppers, been there done that. I was with my ex for 15 years, married for 10 of them. We had 3 children together (great kids, could not ask for better). I went through most of what is on the list. She had me believing I was crazy, had me seeing counslers, on meds, you name it, she even mannaged to drive me to the point of being suicidal. Then things went downhill and got bad, lol. All in all, “she” ended up applying for a divorce, and she got it too. Yes it has been expensive, child support, medical on the kids, etc. But you know what? I now know I am fine, I am not crazy, I am not on meds, I am not suicidal, I have friends, I get to do the things I enjoy, I have my kids regularly bi-weekly or more. The expence is minor, the results are more than worth it. I now also know I will NEVER again in my life be married. I do not even want to live with a woman. Yeah, I date, I go out and have fun, I get lucky once in a while too. The point is, I am happy being single, and I intend to stay that way. I have yet to meet a woman that does not pitch red flags at me on a regular basis. I have 5 rules Rules for dating; #1. Do not ever expect to come before my kids. Rule #2. Dont tell me ya love me. Rule #3. Do not talk about marriage. Rule #4. Do not leave your things at my house. Rule #5. Wear a damn rubber, do not let her tell you she can not get pregnant (not a smart move at all) Or else get snipped (unless of course you have loads of cash laying around that you do not need. For the rest of you guys, get the hell out, regardless of the cost. I mean really guys, how much is your self worth, pride, and sanity worth to you. Just grow some balls, big ol hairy stinky man balls, and get the hell out.
So my wife has probably at least half of these traits, but i notice some of the things that you mention are things she says I do. Like when she tears into me over stupid stuff, i just withdraw go blank faced and don’t talk alot. You could call it pouting but it is more of a defense mechanism from her tirades in my mind. Am I just as guilty for getting sullen when she treats me like garbage, I hate pouting, and I have really tried to stop doing that stuff lately. Am I being paranoid or is this a projection thing or what? Man sometimes I swear I could seet his coming….then other times I feel totally blind sided by it.
how odd,
We all react differently to their tirades, some of us are defensive, some are withdrawn reactions. Anyway you look at it, she is engaging your behavior knowing it upsets you and to inevitably get her way. Despite the outcome, yes, we all become a bit paranoid when walking in the “mine fields” of their relentless ploys to have control of us. They know you better than you know yourself, they push those buttons intentional to engage you, to bring you to a place you don’t want to be, usually you will succumb to their desires just to maintain peace in some way, shape, or form. Unfortunately, “peace and tranquility” is not what THEY want, they want your blood, they want to suck the very life force out of you, they want you to be submissive, hence, to be in control. Don’t try to fix it, don’t think it will ever get better,.. it won’t. The only time it will get better(for you!) if SHE believes that she cannot overcome your defiance, and she makes the decision to move on herself. In other words, it has to be her idea. Remember it’s not whether we know what condition she has, i.e.,BPD, NPD, Histrionic,etc., it’s about the abuse itself, that it exists and that you realize, you’re in a no-win situation.
As for the things she says you do, Dr. T mentions a term called “reflective projection” ( believe I got that right?) whereby, the abuser mirrors their own traits and characteristics back upon you knowing full well, this is indeed a short-comimg of their own. They of course would rather die than to admit such though, so once again, she deems you as the perpetrator instead. You may indeed be doing some of this, however, yours is fixable, hers is not!!
Someone help me. This might be long so bear with me I dont know if it is me or her.
Married 18 years 4 children. I am type a personality, prior military now policeman. My marriage has been a serious roller coaster ride from day -01. My wifes mother was diagnosed bp two years ago. i watched my inlaws relationship over the years and it was horrible. he is a nice, easy going guy, doesnt really fight back with her. Im unfortunately the opposite and defend myself every time.
I will get to the point of the last few years. Three years ago jsut before Christmas my wife says she wants a divorce. This is the third time in our marriage she has done this. i was devastated and tried to do everything right for the next three months. When Feb came around I decided to go to a birthday invite by some female coworkers. (i wasnt the only guy invited) So a buddy and I go and I end up dancing with someone and we hit it off right away.
So I end up getting home late, no funny biz with the other woman but just late, i was having a good time. She meets me at the door screamin bloody murder at me accusing me of everything under the sun, so I packed up and left. moved away and two weeks later filed for the divorce.
I then did something I realize I shouldnt have but it felt good. I immediately started dating the “other girl”. I was then accused of walking out on my family by her, accused of adultery, sin etc she told everyone her version not mine or even a combination of the two.
this went on for 6 months, she would come by where i was staying and want to have sex with me. She even told me that one night she came over and had a cold sore and tried to give me herpes by giving me a blow job but it didnt work. WTF?
She hates my mother who has never been anything but nice to her.Will go into a screaming “your a lying cheating SOB tirade,” then when I say ok im outa here she begins to ball and scream through teary eyes why are you leaving me.???????????
She came to me 4 days before our court date and I accepted the terms of getting back into the marriage and making it work out. I tooka job transfer and moved 212 miles from our home where I had friends, some of whom im not allowed to talk to beacause they know the other girld and were friends. A month ago she tooka handful of valiums in front of me and the kids and I had to nearly drag her to the hospital. I got her set up with counseling and the counselor told her she was acting out looking for help and that she lives in an abusive relationship. I ahve never abused her, my kids, i dont drink doi drugs smoke etc. I get loud tho when I need or feel like i need to be heard.And going thorugh the emotional stress at times I have broke a glass or picture frame or two.
We have or did have sex about once every other month and it was only after I couldnt stand it any more and pretty much begged for it. She is filing for divorce this week and i am tore up..
I have two questions
1 Am I crazy, is it me or my actions here. I mean this isnt the first go round
2 why do i feel so badly, so down about this, so hurt? I need some help here anyone im going crazy. My parents have said let it go quit worrying. they say they dont know anyoine who wouldve gave it this much try. I feel like im losing my mind ! HHHHHHHHEEEEELP
You’ve come to the right place. The answers to these questions and more can be found on the other blogs. We’re a pretty friendly bunch and Dr T has a ton of knowledge and insight. Keep reading!
James,
Believe me you are not crazy. Much of your story mirrors mine. I was with her for 17 years. As long as I stood up to her and fought back (for 14 years) I was in the game. When I let up and did as told,she stomped me into the ground. Divorce threats happened about six times per year and were her way of exerting control. Your not perfect and neither am I but assertivenes in the face of abuse is not a character defect.
I am trying to figure out if it am crazy. Just yesterday everything was calm as it can be during this divorce issue. I talked to her on the telephone, she asked about a mechanical issue with her vehicle. Since everything was calm I said “well if you take it to the mechanic and it is exepensive then i will replace the thermostat so you can save your $.” I said I was going to visit my brother and she asked that I leave money for groceries etc for her and the kids, since she doesnt get paid until monday.
I said yes no problem. She has her own career and own bank account by the way, wont even think about a joint account never would. So taht was it. Then thirty minutes later she leaves me a nasty text on my phone????? WTF Can someone tell me if this is something that fits this BPD thing or no? I started to diagnose my self last night and was blaming my self for everything, that really puts some pressure on the heart and mind. Granted Im not perfect but its like trying to get along with jekyl and hyde.
James
Jd
your NOT crazy! She was showing her needy side, which, of course alternates with her crazy ballbustin side. By staying calm and helpful, coupled with your visiting your brother (your support system) you didn’t engage/play her game. She wanted you to refuse cash so she could play the victim and you could play the jerk. My whacko had her own career/investments/bank accounts, yet she constantly berated me for not “stepping up” and paying for things. A classic case of whats mine is mine and whats yours is mine. I would also guess that since your lady is so “special”, she secretly just cannot figure why you are not crying and squealing to call the divorce off. That you are going through with it is a tremendous blow to the inflated view of herself….the “false” self she portrays to you and the community. Not the nut job she truly feels she is.
I love your site and your stories. My mom has textbook BPD and I’ve dealt with it my whole life. My poor father (they’ve been married for almost 25 years) is only now finally speaking up to his daughters about it and trying to actually seek medical help. My mom is in with a counselor but won’t be properly diagnosed as she manipulates her counselors into only treating/talking about what she wants them to hear and never lets them have interaction with the family or even her husband to help her get correct treatment. And now sadly, my brother-in-law has fallen prey to a woman with BPD or NPD…trying to warn him but he has fallen under her attack and is recieving heavy fire. She just got him to move out of his house and in with her and has told him he is not allowed to see his family without her or her brother present. Any advice on how to help him see whats going on?
And to all the guys out there who find them with women like these…run…they can threaten all you want but for your kids and your own sanity…RUN!
Aw, I am truly, truly in trouble. She has all these qualities and I am in for a ride if/when I leave. But, it helps to know that I am not alone.
My girlfriend displays all the personalities from the questions above (except the lipstick), especially complaining about all my friends and family and stopping me from seeing or talking to any of them. She also hits me and screams all the time if i dare stand up for myself.
Well Ive been dating this woman for just over 2 years, and i have hit breaking point but i cant pull the trigger and just leave. I get sucked into feeling sorry for her when she is crying, and whenever she gets upset and goes overboard, she usually apologises and i dont take it further cuz i just want some peace and quiet. I dont know what to do, or how to mentally prepare for breaking up with her??? Any help with how to get out (or handle) this situation??
yes on ten. i work out of the country. minor argument before i left. she moved out, filed for divorce, got daddy to buy her a house, moved in it, shut me off, my family and friends, all over the course of six weeks. blames me for all of it, admits no wrong in her doing, and will not communicate with me or even sit down with me. will be final in ten days. never had a choice or a chance. wtf. anyone know?
i went thru it for 10 years. always thinking maybe it is me. stayed till the kids were able to know who i was. i always knew there was something wrong with her but after taking this quiz and answering yes to most of it, now i know. i’m deff. not an angel. she had to control everything even now she controls where and when i see the kids. they say it will get better that the kids will know for themselves but i am missing their childhood waiting and thats not fair to them of myself. at least i know i’m not alone. really thought it was all my fault. it rained in china and it was my fault. i’ve been so lost for so long and it hasn’t gotten any betterafter leaving. at least when i was there i got to be daddy to my kids now i,m just a opem wallet.
Like many here, i can relate to the questions, the stories, the pain and the drama. We recently started therapy together to work through these issues. I was pretty shocked when the therapist was overwhelmingly one-sided about my wife needing to make changes. 3 sessions and I still haven’t had any homework. I finally believe it isn’t me.
My concern is that there do not seem to be ANY examples of a female being able to change and build a successful healthy relationship. Is it really that impossible? Are there no examples with positive outcomes that weren’t a separation?
I’ve been going on, with as much patience as I can muster, just hoping there is light at the end of the tunnel. If the only option is to get out, I need to do it before kids are involved. Is my glass necessarily half-empty?
Eternal Optimist – Does your wife accept that she needs to make changes, and is she working to make those changes? If so, I don’t see why things can’t work out. Especially if that’s still true 6 months from now. Counselling does work for some couples.
Basically, if she’s a rational person who’s behaving badly/differently than you are accustomed to (think quiet midwestern folks meet explosive new yorkers), but is willing to work to make it better, you should be fine.
If, however, she thinks she’s perfect and YOU need to change, then you might consider cutting your losses.
Good luck!
I’ve been there; thinking that If I worked harder, things would get better but, it only got worse.
You need to face it; she has a personality disorder. She isn’t suffering from a treatable mental illness. The odds of her changing are practically zero.
It’s not a glass half-empty/half-full situation. It is simply accepting reality.
If she is unwilling to change you’ve got two choices: 1. Get out. 2. Spend the rest of you life walking on eggshells and being treated like dirt.
Do what is health for you.
I’m with Mr E. If she understands that she needs to work and make changes, that’s further than mine got. NPD is not, in my understanding, something you have or don’t have. There are varying degrees. If she truly cares about how her behavior affects others, maybe she can work on it successfully (don’t ask me how to tell if she really cares or is pretending to care). If you’re still in therapy and she’s actively involved, I’d see it through.
Eternal,
If you read all the articles on this site you’ll run into a couple of points repeatedly: Cluster B personality disorders are extraordinarly resistent to treatment, and they tend to get worse as the NPD/BPD ages.
So, if your wife fits this profile, the odds are against a happy ending.
Deciding whether to end a marriage is hard, and it’s easy to procrastinate making the call, especially as your desire to connect with her may distort your perceptions (in her favor) of how badly you’re being treated.
I suggest you give yourself a fixed time period, say a year from now, at the end of which you will revisit the question. In the meantime throw everything you have into the marriage, BUT equally importantly, journal every day. Then when the year is done, read the journal and see what’s changed. If there have been no real improvements you’ll know that you’ve given it enough time, and you’ll have a record of your day to day perceptions and feelings with which to strengthen your resolve should you decide to end it.
Good luck,
JP
This is Dr T’s response to a question I asked in the Feb 09 Blog on Is She a Borderline or Narcissist?
“Hi Mellaril,
I think they all have attachment issues to some degree, which explains why they’re not capable of real intimacy. They can’t make themselves vulnerable and drive others away when they get too close. It is heartbreaking, but you’re right; they do it to themselves.
The ability to form a healthy attachment begins in very early childhood. In order to repair this and a personality disorder, a trained professional has to essentially break the individual’s disordered personality structure down and then re-parent and rebuild them. This could take years, if not decades to accomplish and there’s no guarantee of a positive outcome.
Best,
Dr T”
Marion Solomon compared changing a relationship when one or both parties has a PD as “…trying to capture smoke.”
It can happen but success stories come few and far between.
I agree this is probably true. I would be careful about the diagnosis. If she’s a full blown NPD, by all means, get out. But do you automatically throw away a marraige if she has NPD tendencies? Or if she shows behaviors consistent with some of the checklist, but doesn’t do some of the other things at all?
Eternal Optimist
If she’s seeking help and accepting ownership, surely that’s making positive progress, and yep if it continues! All good.
Why is it that the over riding response is to get out & stay out? I’ve read pretty much most f the blogs and I think all the articles.
I’m currently out of an on/off 5 year relationship, I believe her to be NPD/ BPD but I also firmly believe it to be down to her up bringing, classic Parental split by the age of 4, lived with her promiscuous mother till I think 14, was sexually abused during this period, then left and lived with Dad till 16, then lived alone, she’s had 2 marriages and several failed relationships, interestingly mine is likely the longest of them all.
Whilst I should resent her & by all account be thanking my blessings and staying out, I do feel she’s the victim as well in all this, she didn’t willfully set out to emotionally abuse me.
I suppose my point is yes I’d like to help or fix her, and I know everyone says won’t happen, abandon her, save yourself.
But ask yourself this, why of all the illnesses is this incurable? Would we as a society accept the view that it’s cool to turn our back on any illness or person suffering? And what if it were family member or indeed your child !!!! What then would we cast her into life boat and push her out to sea? Don’t think so!
I accept the site & Dr T is a huge help and resource to us all, perhaps it’s on my weaker days, but I sometimes find it hard to depict these people as vampires or demons.
There was a time when the sick had to ring a bell to keep us from being infected.
If they show signs of remorse and wish to have and receive help surely that’s a massive advancement.
If she’s trying she gets my vote, but yep observe with an open mind, and good luck Eternal Optimist
@Ace – Regardless of her upbringing and her intentions; she did abuse you. It sounds like you’re willing to make excuses for her.
Its good that you don’t resent her, that says there is something in you that’s kind and forgiving but, letting her off the hook for her actions because she had a very bad childhood isn’t going change anything.
Cluster B’s don’t have mental illnesses like depression, etc. It is a personality disorder. To change that, you’d have to change there personality, which near impossible.
Further more, leaving someone who treats you badly isn’t abandonment; it’s sanity. I’m willing to bet that she made some comment about you abandoning her near the end or after the end of your relationship. Please, let me know if my guess is wrong.
FYI – I learned the hard way that no matter what I did she wasn’t going to change and it was very painful. Do I think my EX was monster or “vampire”? No, she was just a very bad person who was toxic to be around.
“But ask yourself this, why of all the illnesses is this incurable?
…
If they show signs of remorse and wish to have and receive help surely that’s a massive advancement.””
It’s a character disorder – the problme is that they have bad characters. Imagine if someone told you your left arm was really a problem for them and you needed to remove it, but you were certain your arm was just fine. You’d probably tell them off. The folks we’re discussing think they are JUST FINE, and the problem is YOU.
IF they are willing to get help is the sticking point. I don’t think any of us would abandon someone who is trying to get better. However, most of the people we’re talking about around here can’t even comprehend that the problem might be partly their fault.
I agree many have tragic histories, but there are people who’ve come through traumatic pasts without going on to abuse others. It’s not “incurable” so much as “incredibly unlikely that it will be cured.”
Quite correct Mr E, thankfully every person who’s had tragic or abusive up bringing does not become an abuser. Whilst I did rant a bit about my own feelings, thoughts and opinions, I was merely supporting (Eternal Optimist) in that if she’s seeking help, then that’s a big plus, any yes stay in by all means, but proceed with caution.
I’m still not convinced they’re all bad people; I do think there is a descending scale for sure. I’m also not saying they should or indeed could all be helped even if we wished to, many love themselves just the way they are, and why not ? it works for them 🙂 I also believe many people hide behind illness and use it as an excuse for bad behavior.
I’ve a buddy who’s married to a woman who’s been diagnosed as bi polar. She’s on medication, she’s full on, and quite honestly ticks many of the boxes of the borderline behavior discussed on here, except for the fact that it’s as though she were on steroids when she’s being abusive, she in my opinion uses the bi polar as a shield.
My point is she like the NPD /BPD chooses when to abuse, she can differentiate when and when not to abuse, she once left my house and bit the guy within 100meters of leaving my house, yet she showed no signs of frustration in my home. The guy could genuinely end up with a knife in his chest and bi polar covers it .
I had similar experience with a person who choose to ignore best practice with Diabetes, she drank heavily and basically knew best, despite best medical advise. It would be unfair to view all diabetics based on her behavior, so there in lays my point that surely every single person with behavioral disorder is not entirely the same
@BEC,
Actually every time its off it’s by her choice as is the getting back together. On the one occasion I was going to leave her she did a very good job of stopping me, she never mentioned abandoning. But yes she’s done all the mean and nasty things that everyone else on here has experienced.
The exceptions being no financial issues, very successful lady, no cheating, and no lies, though she did the gaslighting and had distorted views of reality, and yes she constantly put me down, and also my kids once they were out of ear shot. And to be honest she constantly commented on everyone to me, even complete strangers she see in the street, everything is and as an issue, Bank Q’s Security in Airports, Traffic etc etc.
The thing is I’m not making excuses or letting her off the hook, her up bringing is a fact and yes she instinctively learned from her mother and various survival tools.
I don’t believe she knowingly does everything she does, nor do I believe she enjoys it.
I do believe she does things at times that she may regret and is too stubborn or proud to retract them or apologies. She’s definitely damaged and badly at that, but as I was commenting on ( Eternal Optimists ) I would certainly give her a thumbs up if she was genuinely trying to sort herself out. Would I be prepared to give my Ex a chance to sort herself if she acknowledged her wrong doing ? absolutely ! would I have an open mind ? absolutely !
I just find we’re a bit to quick to lick our wounds and blame, we’d a part to play in the drama, yes they abused, absolutely no question about that, and yes I read all the
co- dependency pieces.
The truth is in all this reading and researching it has made me very much aware of how little we actually know of the various troubles people around us experience on a daily basis.
The thing is my ex does the whole re invent herself Madonna style every time, at this stage she’s lived in 22 different homes, including her up bringing. She’s a circular existence that she doesn’t even appreciate herself. She’s not seeing anyone else now, and she’s still carrying about all that frustration with everyday objects and people, but has no one to vent them to at the moment. Is she happy ? hell no ! she’ll give off the outward appearance of being happy, but in truth she serves her own punishment in her own head, and always will.
thanks for this post! I know know 110% that i was dating a crazy bitch and i feel better for ending it and placing the relationship in the trash bin of history.
You want to hear crazy bitch material?
My NPD ex gf used to “joke” in a sing-song voice that “If I can’t have you no one can…” and “no one’s ever going to find you”. It was funny at first, but uh…it got a little spooky. She was obsessed with some reality show on TLC or A&E or something about women who got caught for attempting to or actually murdering their husbands.
Yikes! When we first started dating, mine used to tell me she’d kill me if I ever broke her heart. But I haven’t heard that in almost 13 years now.
Super spooky about the reality shows. Sounds like you might have actually dodged a bullet!
Jeez. You have just opened up my eyes to a world of poo – and relief. Now I see what has been happening to me. I was only alerted to this because my partner labelled me with (amongst many others I had no idea about too) Narcisstic Personality Disorder. It was only when I looked into it, because I took her comments seriously, that I became aware of BPD. But, oh when I did and saw this, it was like a spy coming i nfrom the cold. finally, I have an explanation for all her behaviour that has made a mess of me and made me self critical and feel worthless. she has exhibited many of the traits described The cruelest of which is to threaten to expose our bedroom habits to all and sundry. That is the nastiest thing anyone could ever threaten I think. I’ve let her threaten me wiht this 4 times now. Now I realise what is happening.
My big question is, that once this happened, I confronted her with this and she insists it’s me not her and feel these are all my issues (projection maybe?) not here. How can I tell if maybe she is right and it is all me – or is this what happens to men in this situation – they are made to feel it’s all their fault?
“My big question is, that once this happened, I confronted her with this and she insists it’s me not her and feel these are all my issues (projection maybe?) not here. How can I tell if maybe she is right and it is all me – or is this what happens to men in this situation – they are made to feel it’s all their fault?”
The short answer is making us believe it’s our fault is common. A common tactic is to manipulate a situation that will get you to respond in a way that supports her claims. It’s insidious since you actually do what she claims but she’ll deny any responsibility for her contribution.
Read the other blogs and the forums. If you can keep enough distance while its going, you will probably get a pretty good idea of what you’re dealing with. If you really feel the need to validate your feelings, talk to a therapist with experience in Cluster Bs.
Now that the light’s coming on, you need to be more careful. If she perceives that you’re challenging her authority, things will get worse before they get better. What kind of relationship is it if your partner is emotionally blackmailing you with the threat to expose some intimate secrets?
Thank you,thank you, thank you. Your comments are really supportive and I feel like finally I can put some sense around this. Right now I sit here shaking because she’s started texting me on her phone with the excuse of exchanging worldly goods aka excuse to keep contacting me. She emailed yesterday about the same thing, but I didn’t reply straight away as I wanted to do it today when I was up to it and now I see how it’s all part of her hating the lack of attention. I’m a big bloke with lots of personality and I can’t believe the mess I have been reduced to. And you’re right – what kind of relationship is it with someone who would do that.
As part of her advice I am seeing a therapist next week. She thought I was so wrong all the time she wanted me to go see one. Now I know all this, I will be going anyway, but the emphasis has now changed, but at least they will be able to assist with this behaviour – and ultimately how I cope with it – especially at a time like this when I’m in the eye of the storm and I now there’s more to come.
Everything except the lipstick on the crazy woman checklist is a yes. I felt ill after taking this quiz because it is so revealing about the problems at home. My wife has these fits of rage and constantly reminds me of my failures and shortcomings. We have a nice home in an upscale part of town which we can barely afford on my salary since she doesn’t work even though the kids are older and independent now. No matter how much is spent on upgrades and renos it’s never good enough for her. Last night she told me that our marriage was the worst mistake she ever made, my weight disgusts her ( 6’3″, 230 lbs) and the financial stresses are all my fault. I have worked for the same business for 30 years and have always made good money and our debt is under control.
I have mentioned a trial separation to sort things out (I am not interested in pursuing any other woman) at which she went berserk and broke things in the kitchen while calling me every foul name imaginable. There is no possibility of intelligent, rational conversation with this woman and any mention of counselling makes it even worse.
Funny thing after a huge tantrum last night filled with foul language and name calling she kissed me this morning and said I love you. I am ready for the nuthouse and don’t know what to do!
Big B, What you just described will never change.
I’ve been separated from ex for four years.
A week before Father’s Day she unloaded on me in an email after I’d expressed concern to her about something affecting our girls. I was respectful, polite, assertive, and kept my remarks focused on the kids.
It didn’t matter…she had to punish me for challenging her supremacy by bringing the issue up at all.
Her reply was a psychotic, gaslighting rage attack. The worst ever, full of bizarre and cruel attacks on me, all completely off-topic of course.
I assumed we’d be entering a new low period in our interactions and I detached even more in our brief exchanges.
But a week later she brings me an expensive Father’s Day gift and has been weirdly chatty and ‘kind’ to me.
No apology of course. And in her mind there’s no incongruence. She doesn’t think like that. It’s all instinct and reaction and no introspection on their part. Don’t look for a ‘reason’. Just get away.
JP
JP,Big B
Always enjoy your comments JP,..I believe that this topic is one of Dr. T’s most popular running posts. Probably because we can all relate to “crazy bitch”, right! Big B’s comment about his wife’s demeaning act the night before, with a kisses and love in the a.m., are true crazy-making antics of such personality disordered women. The knife is in, she just wanted to twist it around a little and cause some more emotional pain.
The separation idea has probably initiated her self-preservation mode, so her wheels are turning, and that should concern BB. Dependent upon her abilities to make a living,i.e., profession, education,etc., she will figure out real quick where she stands and how she will proceed.
A word of advice Big B, you need to be one step ahead of her at all times now that you somewhat understand the nature of “her beast.” That kiss and love thing that morning may also have been her way of saying, “after our discussion last night, hmmm..I wonder, how much alimony I could receive if we were divorced?” Child support, and on and on. Trust me Big B, don’t allow her to have any room to run where it concerns the status of your marriage, process of dissolution, the kids and the financial aspects. The courts favor women even in no fault states. There is a world of resource here already, posted by contributors and Dr. T on how to prevent these crazy bitches from taking you to the “cleaners.” Believe me that a.m. kiss with love was filled with thoughts that would only serve her best interest. Take care guys.
My ex-wife would also put on the freak show…never appologize or even admit it happened. About the same time frame, she would offer to buy me something expensive or make vacation plans paid for by her. She’d rather cut off her own arm to avoid apologizing for anything!
I have to tell you that this by far one of the most confirming post I’ve ever read. my wife and I have been married for over a year she already had a son and we have a son together. Which, specifically with my step son, is the reason I’ve put up with this for so long and even married her. The fear of losing my kids is to great. however now I finally believe I’m out for good, think god, moving into my sister’s.
Almost all of the attributes discussed in this article fit her to a T, my biggest concern is that after the exposure to her and her symptoms I truly feel that I am becoming BPD and NPD. I’ve lost all friends since shortly after being with her and almost never speak to my family, who I have always been very close to. Now whenever I DO go to a public place or hang out with old friends I feel uncomfortable and locked in side my one head, often I’ll want to talk to people even to the point where I run the outcome of the conversation in my own head it’s ridiculous! I was always such an extrovert of a person before her, now I’m a recluse. I’ve quit several great jobs because of her and become a wellfare/section 8 case. what do I do?! I need more help then ever. Now that I’m not with her, the only bit of sanity I did have seems to be going quickly out the window.
Any thoughts or words of advice will things get better now that I’ve cut the cord?
Things will get better.
Different things will be imposed upon you and things will get better.
You will learn to expect the different things and things will get better again.
You will learn to desire the different things and things will get better again.
You will learn to create the different things and things will get better again.
You will learn to create your own different things and things will get better again.
You will learn to love the different things and things will get better again.
Things will get better BECAUSE they are different not DESPITE being different.
Things will be better when there is no ‘before and after the trauma’, just ‘before and after the understanding’ that things do get better.
Lighthouse
AH!!! (Delighted squeal) Love reading your posts, Lighthouse!! I hope you are putting those words down in a book of recovery poetry….will you get one published? Just put a lighthouse on the front – I’ll recognize it and pick up a copy. 🙂
Thanks for the kind words – I’m glad you find them of value.
Having visited a very dark place I have a great deal of sympathy for those who find themselves in such a position. Furthermore, I have experienced how effectively the internet can reach the very isolated and vulnerable population of people who are abused by their partners while avoiding triggering their partners into further acts of abuse.
As a result, in my spare time I try to help others by illuminating my own pathway of learning that led me back to the light while remaining immoveable in my resolve to take not one step beyond my boundaries that protect my own emotional health – analogous to a Lighthouse (hence the name).
However, the vast majority of my life is focused on living my new knowledge and enjoying the benefits of doing so with those I love most.
As a result, no book… just a life well lived.
Wishing you the same,
Lighthouse
Lighhouse,thank you for the words of wisdom, much appreciated. I’ve had more interesting developments in my situation since last I posted. Things that leave me wondering “whats the point, is there such thing as love?” I have no optimism regarding this. How can someone spend years leading you to believe that your love is accepted and returned, all the while consuming your soul. At the end of it all, leaving you with nothing and making you feel like nothing, worth nothing.
I have no hope at this point in finding love.
I had a different take at the end of my diversion. I felt that I had been left with something – a compulsion NEVER to suffer the same again. I’d argue if you’ve found this website you’re after more than ineffectual sympathy yourself !
I suggest this is a method of identifying and maintaining good boundaries so you do not suffer the same again and can find love…
Beliefs, natural laws or self-evident truths:
Rule No. 1 – by definition if love isn’t reciprocated it is adoration, not love.
Rule No. 2 – the application of good boundaries are all that stand between adoration and love.
Living the beliefs, natural laws or self-evident truths:
Learn to identify what you want (1), to listen to what is being asked of you (2), to say ‘no’ (3):
(1) What you want reflects your values, i.e. how you want to use your own knowledge, time, commitments, stuff and effort. Myself I allocate my knowledge, time, commitments, stuff and effort in proportion to my relationship priorities from myself, through partner, child, family, friends, and work colleagues all the way to strangers.
(2) What is being asked of you is measured in knowledge, time, commitments, stuff (ownership or use of) and effort.
(3) When to say ‘no’ is when your relationship with the other person historically results in them ending up with more of your knowledge, time, commitments, stuff and effort then you do theirs and you can’t think of something you want from them right now to at least have a fair transaction.
Applying the beliefs, natural laws or self-evident truths:
Learn to give a kind, respectful, compassionate ‘no’ while preserving the relationship when subject to overt (1) or covert (2) requests:
(1) A kind, respectful, compassionate ‘no’ to overt requests sounds like this “I understand you have a need for [specific knowledge, time, commitments, stuff and effort requested}, however on this occasion I do not feel comfortable providing it. Please feel free to ask again on another occasion.”
(2) A kind, respectful, compassionate ‘no’ to covert requests sounds like this “It sounds like you’re having a tough time with that. What do you plan to do about it ?”
Summary:
You will effectively love yourself after you learn to identifying and maintaining good boundaries.
You will be effectively loved after you learn to love a person that respects your ‘no’ and applies the above them self.
And as for how you find that person… now there you’re on your own !
Final thought:
While you’re seeking that person, just remember you are ALWAYS loveable even if you have not found a partner who is willing to be held accountable for behaving lovingly and where there is life there is hope.
Things will get better,
Lighthouse
Wow, this site is very empowering. I have been on here all night reading the articles and posts and I am feeling like I did the right thing ending my relationship. I finally got tired of the abuse that many of you are familiar with but I’m only in day 3 and I have broken down and had contact( less every day mind you.) I’m going to shoot for zero tomorrow!The reason she called me 20+ times and texted me horrible threats and insults initially today started out as her wanting to return a sweatshirt she had taken when we saw each other last. I have mentally said goodbye to my sweatshirt and having to deal with her anymore.I hope my resolve sticks.
One of the things that made me really get fed up enough that I haven’t seen mentioned much is women like this and how they treat people in the service industry. I used to wait tables in college so I thought I was just oversensitive to it. Every time we would go out to eat my ex would be downright rude to the perfect stranger who had the misfortune of waiting on us. I felt as though I had to be overly nice, or distract her when the server came to the table so she wouldn’t get a chance to be rude. This became frequent enough that I didn’t want to be out in public with her anymore. By seeing someone else being bullied by her I began to “wake up” from her power over me. I had been okay with being verbally abused on a daily basis, but seeing her treat almost everyone she came into contact with so uncaring an attitude I began to make steps to leave her.
After I made it clear I didn’t want her to contact me anymore I have seen an extreme escalation in her insults and threats that brought me to this blog. It really helped me in a time of weakness. I am very thankful that I have many friends that I have managed not to alienate in the 2 years I had been with my ex, and now your works of wisdom Dr.T!
You’re on the right track, Jonas. Just stick with it and in any moments of weakness repeat to yourself “she will never change”.
I often found my wife to be rather brusque with people in the service sector. Like you, I might be a bit over-sensitive to this because I spent a few of my younger years working in retail stores, etc. however, so had my wife.
The funny part was that when she was working in the retail sector and a customer spoke to her in a way she didn’t appreciate, I’d certainly be hearing about the “rude” person she’d dealt with that day.
And of course, if I said or did anything in public that she didn’t like, I’d be hearing about how I’d “embarassed” her.
You don’t have to be BPD/NPD type to be rude or insensitive however, the “it’s all about me” creed they live by no doubt helps.
Jonas,
No contact is an imperative step in the process, not just less contact, NO CONTACT! Once you have ignored her text, emails, phone calls, etc., she will get the picture and move on, she will seek a new supply. Some take a little longer than others, and despite how long you’ve ever been apart, she will always believe she has control over you. My x-npd believed that every man she has been with, all the way back to Jr. High, would come running back to her if she asked them to! She’s in her mid 40’s now! She’s probably telling her next victim that I would come back as well,..most are delusional in this way.
However long it takes, once she makes the realization you’re done, she will not view this like other normal women in a breakup, i.e. with emotions, remorse, etc., no, her view is that you have finally outlived your usefulness to her..NEXT! Despite what she says to you, and she will attempt to make you feel like shit about the whole relationship, DO NOT BELIEVE ANYTHING SHE SAYS!!! Remember this too, and despite how unique or different you believe your relationship with her was, “she never felt true love for you.” Personality disorders like NPD, BPD, Histrionic, are incapable of true intimacy and loving emotion. Each one of these conditions vary only slightly on the emotional/intimate level, however, the outcomes are abusive none-the-less, and that is the only realization you should make. They thrive on depreciating those they are close to, it maintains their defiled epicenter. No contact in essence, drains their supply pipeline to this epicenter. If you were to contact her once, say, in three months, she is not excited to hear from you, she is excited to start filling that pipeline again. And for you, that 3 month effort will have been in vain. Unless there are children, or investments involved, you have no reason to be in contact. Personal items can be replaced. Remember too, she is indeed, “a crazy bitch.”
I just found this site last night, and everything i have suffered thru for the last 3 years, without even a name to call it, has finally crystallized into something i can put my head around. “It” exhibits every single one of these behaviors. With the added bonus of physically attacking me when it gets really bad. It even Split my lip open at my freaking GRANDPARENTS house. It only shows crocodile remorse or accountability when it knows that i’m getting serious about leaving, which I have now resolved to do. It’s gonna take some time as I am recently bouncing back from a long unemployment. You have helped me to realize that trying to change “It ” is futile, and I need to get out while I still have my youth and no children. Now to maintain the ruse for the next 6-9 mos, while i construct an escape hatch. I’m very afraid of what will happen when she knows it’s for real, which is why i’m gonna have to get my shit out of the house while she’s away somehow.
Hey Don, what was her take on your long term unemployment ? guess that was your fault too, did you find that added to her personality disorder was a double wamy ! and even more difficult to deal with ?
Here’s a corker! I was once playing tennis with my Ex and she skyed the ball over wire fence. Because I asked a young lady to throw the ball back over fence my Ex gave me merry hell for rest of the day accusing me of always eyeing up other women. It was quite bizarre!
Sad thing is I started to think “hey do I flirt ALWAYS with women like she says I do.” They can get in your mind and make you start to believe their bull shit.
Exactly. You start out as your strong confident self, and by the end you can no longer rely on your own reality testing. A dangerous place to be.
JP
Thanks to this amazing site, I’m seeing red flags much sooner. Most recent experience – a woman who I’d been seeing for LESS THAN TWO WEEKS demanded that I completely exculpate and actively remove from my life in every way any female friend who I happened to have dated. Now, my NPD ex is not among these women, and I do have a couple of mature, healthy relationships with women who I’ve previously dated. This woman hadn’t seen us interact together nor was she willing to entertain the idea.
I can just imagine what would have happened if I’d agreed to the demand. A few months from now she’d be asking me to grow five inches.
Yes and my Ex even went so far as to demand I didn’t see friends that were single (males friends) because they would lead me astray!!! No dear, your unreasonable, wild and vicious behaviour is what leads me astray…Why even the Pope would be tempted if he had you in his life.
As it was I went along with this demand because the arguement was just not worth it and I would never even get my say let alone a chance of winning the arguement.
But now I can see my friends whenever I want…Isn’t life grand!
Unfortunately I could answer YES to just about all but 3 and of those three, just slightly changing some of the question details would result in a perfect score… my Ex NPD/BPD started out like the usual… dressed to kill, seductive from the first 5 minutes together, she was all over me like flies on sh*t, but since it was New Years Eve not a lot of people noticed, and normally I would be very uncomfortable with that much public PDA even with a long time gf, I kinda overlooked it, except it happened several times on our first few dates the same kind of seduction, while I would ask for some space and to have some decent conversation about my career objectives (which she slowly eradicated me from even mentioning eventually..) she told me that was ‘boring’ and just wanted to makeout… I was definitely not happy about that from the start. Little did I know this chameleon was planning and plotting from the get-go. As time went by she followed the NPD/BPD play-book perfectly… belittling me for having ‘feelings’ for her or her daughter, keeping the sex hot only as a ‘hook’ to keep me from straying as it became less and less and less frequent (I once joked I could still apply for the Priesthood and be in the near sexless relationship she had created we me), while at the same time always asking how good she was, very fearful of my silence or honest reply. The devaluing and slow descent downward was a constant battle with her, where I continued to maintain that I needed my own boundaries and would put her at arms length every so often.. and quickly I would get the cold shoulder, silent treatment.. I kept notes and tabs on her behaviors to just check myself however. I laughed sometimes at how she would try to reward me for doing things only for her and her family, while my needs, wants, desires, business meant nothing and eventually I meant nothing… she literally tried to beat me down every step of the way, gaslighting and raging, being passive-aggressive, screeching over the phone, never showing up on time for dates or visits, demanding that she be treated ‘special’, bending and ignoring any rules I had even in my own home, manipulating, lying and deliberately sabotaging…and talk about a dirty mouth.. she can make truckers look like nuns with some of the god awful stuff that she blurts out… it runs in the family. She has a nutcase Borderline mother who has rage attacks at the kids and husband in English and foreign language, and is obviously a very unhappy soul. Misery loves company. My ex qualifies as one of the angriest, nuttiest, most unstable, raging lunatic females I’ve ever met… and I didn’t really see it coming.. her persona doesn’t match her looks/body.. or the sweet/sensitive side of her you can tell is a wounded part of her..her inner child. She acts very young at times too, another dead giveaway that she has these projected identities inside of her, split off from her conscious mind (angry parent). In fact when she rolls into a rage, her eyes just go blank..dark… vacant.. she’s not really there. Some disgusting tyrant is instead, and its scary because she doesn’t seem to have an ounce of empathy or real feeling for her victims, only herself. Once after a rage, she was crying.. because her daughter was terrified and crying, but due to her sickness she couldn’t put two and two together to realize that SHE created the rage and fear and trauma for the child !!! She was crying for her inner child as well I’m sure…
Its a long list of actual events, but suffice to say, these girls are real soul-murderers… they will induce PTSD into you if you don’t know what that is like, just sit in a combat zone for a few months without sleeping, listening to gunfire and bombs going off at random… and when you’re exhausted and just want to shut it all off… listen some more until you’re about to have a nervous breakdown. Yes.. what these women do is the same thing, only its more insidious because they PRETEND to LOVE YOU when in fact they want to destroy you. At least an enemy hurtling shells at you or planting land mines is honest about his intention to kill you, and that offers your psyche some form of protection, you know that you need to be on guard/vigilante. However when you’re dating a woman who is telling you to open up, let her in, drop your guard she wants to be closer to you, its a Trojan horse filled with vile disgust and hatred that she does not want to own herself..its split off from her raging self, but its energy she cannot own and wants you to own and act out. That way she can hate YOU instead of herself, something she cannot face.
What I have done to ween myself out of the situation was to make myself an impossible target for her to control. I would ‘feign’ being under her spell, and give her the same sort of clues that I would do what pleased her.. let her relax her guard a bit, and then just lambaste her back with the same gobs of shit she hurled at me, forcing her to feel off kilter and getting her to react instead, and simply laughing in her face about it. That really sets off their rage, but since they have hit & run tactics, I learned how to just dodge it and cut her off. She is the type to just stew with anger for eternity. Eventually her not too bright self started to realize the pattern, that I was not sincerely playing along with her, and that I was a bit too smart for the child’s play and my empathy and sympathy had run dry for her. Not too surprisingly, realizing that her vampirism had run its course and there was no more blood to suck, she quickly vanished, no apologies, no remorse, no sentimentality, no signs of anything human.. just pleas, threats, rages, more pleas, negotiations to get a few of her belongings back that were still in my possession. Funny part was she would never “go out of my way” to return any of mine in the past, I’d have to make those arrangements. So remembering that, I just sat on it. Never made a move to appease her, just played around with her via txt msging… kinda funny when the Mouse turns on the Cat and mawls it for a while. I’m convinced NPD/BPD women are the most fickle, unstable, psychotic, warped fragile souls out there… but they will suck your soul dry even if you try to help them. But even when you’re dealing with their rage, as an adult, its important to realize that its NOT an adult.. its really a little child.. a scared little angry child and its FEAR they are expressing, inside out.. only their mind can’t translate it as such. You have to. You have to see just what an infantile response they consistently display, and how their minds are quite handicapped, robotic, de-sensitized, and traumatized themselves. I don’t encourage anyone to stop a runaway train-wreck however. The damage is mind boggling…
Holy crap.. that was good!
Well, what if you’re with a woman who is aware that her behavior is toxic and is self-aware enough to know that she needs to change, but for some reason always gets sucked back into old ultra-suspicious, argumentative, and jealous habits?
She tries to consciously back off a little when she is able to recognize it, but often she can’t see how she’s even at fault and she’s a genius at making her point and making me feel in the wrong. She’s wonderful otherwise, but can’t let go of my past gfs and accuses me of having feelings for them. I just feel like if I could tell her something to reassure her that she’s the only one I love, things might be different for us. She’s not completely hopeless, anyway. But still a little crazy…
“Does she exhibit stalker behaviors? This usually occurs during the courtship phase or when she senses you’re about to make a break for it. ”
YES! It has intensified in the recent few months… try to guess why! Because I have shown signs of getting better and that is a threat to her! If I get better… if I get more strength… I can get out of this! And she is afraid, VERY AFRAID! But she is also telling me sometimes that we need to break up – but it doesn’t make sense, because then she is stalking me and clearly afraid that I will actually leave ON MY OWN TERMS!
The articles here are fantastic. It’s like reading my own life from them. It helps a lot to realise that I may in fact have chance at a decent life some time in the future just as long as I can dump this CRAZY BITCH!
I’m one day into the break up and my head isn’t right. Like a lot of guys in the comments, I can’t tell which way is up/down and who’s right or wrong. I’ve been with the same girl 3 years. Beautiful, sweet, but emotionally unstable – we consistently have one bad week a month (arguing) when she gets her PMS. Jeckyl & Hyde stuff. And a lot of behaviors mentioned in the article. We’re both in our mid-late 30s with a couple crash and burn relationships (me = never married, 1 kid from old previous relationship). My girl who I just split with was married twice, and one common law marriage (10 years, and she has 3 kids from the first two marriage. All three of which she gave up to run off with the common law marriage guy. Who she left to be with me. 3 years in and one week shy of our anniversary, she say she wants to break up. That was yesterday. Throughout the relationship I made excuses for her mood swings and irritability, and lovingly tolerated it. I feel like I’ve always given 75% of the energy in the union and her 25%. I was her emotional caretaker thrgouh the whole 3 years. Nursing her through crying jags, jealousy fits, and more. I ran out of steam and tolerance for it all about 1 year ago. She moved out. But we stayed together and fought through more ups and downs. Not much changed. Then I really ran out of steam in the last 3 months, now – big surprise – she says she wants to break up. We met up. I offered to try to keep us working on the relationship and specifically herself – but she wasn’t having it. Clean break. I’m spent and tired, but still guilt tripping myself on what I could have done different as far as drawing boundaries and such. Oh, well. It’s done. I need to forget it. But I’ll take any advice you guys got. Thanks.
Ha! My ex-wife to a “T”! Alcoholic and definately a personality disorder of some sort. She uses device control of sorts too. Good thing we didn’t have children. I got out of my divorce scott free since she is a prideful woman and refused to ask for support from me though she will not let me have my court ordered personnel effects back and it has been five months now. She now wants me to give the dogs back but tough luck. She can barely take care of herself let alone another life and she has two great boys that I connected with that she will not allow me to speak to while villifying me to them. I’m trying to be brief with my experience but the “crazy train” was maxed out for the three years we were married. Her accusations and complaints got to be so absurd there was no way in hell I could force my self to believe everything was my fault like she was determined to make me believe. I have never been to the emergency room so much in my whole life!
Ty,
My wife was ultra jealous. I worked long hours as a delivery driver for a beer company where there was no time for affairs. My wife would accuse me of cheating and when I would show her my blackened by ten hours of hard work hands and ask which woman would let me touch her naked body with them it didn’t phase her. Taking her kids fishing meant I was cheating on her. Playing mens softball meant I was cheating. Working on the front yard meant I was cheating. Helping my dad paint the house meant I was cheating!
Normal, even keeled women exist. You’ll see. Be patient and enjoy your life.
I appreciate the posts and info here very much. Ive been with a girl that exhibits some of this behavior for about 8 mths. I havent been perfect, and she lets me know. She calls me the devil and a wolf in sheeps clothing when i try to do things for her, citing that im just manipulating her to play some sick game or to get back at her for something.(she gave me an std and i accepted it and forgave her, she had it from the beginning and didnt fess up till i had physical effects and i asked questions) she also had tried to get with someone else telling me later that she just wanted to see if i cared about her for real or not. and i let it go because i love her. later in the relationship i lied to her in fear of her not believeing me and thinking i was cheating, i told her i was at home when i was out with the guys to eat. i have never lived it down. I can understand her feeling betrayed but i would never cheat on her. we work together and when i walk down the halls at work at the same time as another girl,not even talking or anything, it means to her i must be doing something with that person, and several times she has broken up with me because of it. I always try sooo hard to prove my love and faithfulness to her to no avail. She has since broken up with me and has told me she doesnt know who i am and that ive been her downfall, that ive pulled her away from her family, friends and church. Yet when i try still to talk to her, she still responds back and says leave me alone i dont believe you. Everyone ive talked to about it has told me that she is controlling me and using me, but i wonder and question myself and think if i just had told her that i was with my friends or if i didnt walk down the hall at the same time as this girl or that girl, or if i wouldnt have blown her off a few times early on to go with friends(with her approval at the time, only for her to weaponize it later and say she was lieing to herself when she said she was ok with it.Am i experiencing the same thing as everyone else here? Am i to blame for some of it? I am so confused and upset i have no idea what to do, no matter how good ive been any little thing she can snowball she does until she reaches the point we have now where she says im manipulating her to control her and make her do what i want when in reality ive tried to do anything but that HELP PLEASE I DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO I LOVE HER
Well my girlfriend who most definitely has the NPD used to get upset if I would do something without her.
Of course this bullshit was exposed many times when she went out with her co-students or co-workers and sometimes she didn’t tell me what she was doing. For example when she was a student and lived in another city I only heard afterwards about some of her partying nights. This would have been okay had she not demanded me to tell her if I go out with my friends. I thought she had been as open to me as I was to her and I have to say it did hurt me when I found out she had not applied the same standard of openness to herself that she was demanding from me.
It is so obvious double standards at work – I didn’t understand it then but I understand it now.
I think when someone is trying to control you like that they are the ones who have mental health issues, not you. Why would a grown-up adult with otherwise a good life feel a need to do that? What are they so afraid of that they need to control you like that? It’s puzzling, but that’s how it is with some people unfortunately.
🙂 I know I am perfectly capable of going for a walk without my NPD gf telling me how to do it. But yet she tells me how to do it many times – or in fact basically tells me I am doing something wrong – it’s just a bit of a mystery what the ‘wrong’ part of that is. I guess she doesn’t know it very well either! 🙂
Man this is such a revealing blog post. Been married for 8 years, got 2 kids aged 6 and 4. Nearly all boxes ticked on the front literally. Spent the last 2 years wondering if I’m the batshit one. Then I recently realised she took all my friends away via alienation. Have no money – the bitch spends it all before I get a chance to do anything with it so can’t afford a lawyer. Live in rags myself with absolutely nothing. Do all the cooking, cleaning everything. She pretends theres loads of stuff wrong with her but she’s just lazy and it allows her to belittle me (apparently I do a bad job of everything despite everything being microscopically clean). She says she loves me one day, then hates me the next.
I nearly bailed after Christmas last year and hit the streets but I stayed for the kids because I love them dearly. Cardboard box under a bridge looked more like home.
Thanks for all the positive comments on here. Starting to put my life into perspective.
Me and my gf had a huge argument for the first time (i say the first time because this is the first time i said anything back.) And I said I didn’t know if we could work out and she guilt tripped me back just so I wouldn’t feel sad. Then she got mad and left. All normal so far. This is the part that made me think she had changed and I felt sooooooooo good like there was hope. She told me(email) everything was fine blah blah blah some amazing stuff. And I started off my day soooooo happy I knew things were gonna be better off from there. But there truely is no hope with these women later that day she brings it up and says that she still can’t believe I said what I said and that she would and has never been that low with me before. (OMG- she is f*cking crazy she puts me down everyday of my life) If i say something stupid she makes sure I feel like shit. Then she says that she has never done anything like that. I am two seconds away from breaking up with my love, only because she is insane, and I cannot take this abuse and selfisness from her.
WOW…I can answer yes to a number of these for my ex…but it gets better. I think I’m a magnet because i can answer yes with respect to my current with. It’s ok you can laugh, I am. I’ll probably be crying later though.
I have never in my life seen something like this – every single post looks like I could have written it myself. Yes she is a bitch! And yes – I agree with every single one of you guys – I’ve experienced ALL OF THE ABOVE
Every single relationship I’ve EVER been in has been with an abusive woman and both my mother and my older sister were abusive toward me – so that the only relationship I know is this type – I would give anything to meet a healthy woman but apparently when I do well I’m not sure but I guess they either scare the hell out of me or else I just don’t find them attractive – I don’t know what it is all I know is that every single relationship I’ve ever had with a woman has ALWAYS been like this – slight variations and some worse than others – but none the less they’ve all been nuts – every single one of them and yes I am the type of person that tends to doubt his own “reality” I’m always thinking it must be me – I must be wrong or I must have made the mistake
My ex gf was not the raging type. When she got mad she would play extremely angry and explicit rap music. She was very passive aggressive. She said she had a very abusive past full of abandonment. That should of been my cue to run but Im a rescuer and dove in. There is no saving these women. They are a bottomless pit of need. They more than not have a deep hatred and mistrust of men. You will never do enough say enough or be enough for them. They will suck all the life out of you.
10 out of 17. The sad thing is that I ended the relationship due to the abuse but I still think about her. How crazy is that???
It has been quite an eye opener to be reading some of these articles. I began reading more about BPD and have to say it sounds alot like my live in girlfriend. Here we are, a few days before xmas, and she has left yet again. She won’t pick up her phone or respond to emails. She has left numerous times and knows it really hurts me when she does so. One minute we are fine and she seems happy, and then something will happen and BOOM…I have never seen anyone get so angry, nor have I ever questioned myself so much as to what sort of person I am.
She tried to kill herself at this time last year. And I could feel something building again. Last night, she came from out of the bedroom where she had been laying all day and found me having a couple of beers after work. She hates drinking and says she was traumatized by a step mother who was an alcoholic. Last summer when she was on her anti drinking campaign I quit entirely for two months, thinking it was not worth the hell to have a beer…yet nothing changed during those two months, her focus just moved to other issues. I feel so run down in this relationship and realize I am actually afriad of her wild mood swings.
As I mentioned, she tried to kill herself last year…and when let out of the hospital, refused to take any of the medications prescribed by the psychiatrist or even see a therapist…saying she is perfectly fine. Lately, I can see the same pattern unfolding as last year…from bigger things like her explosions to small things like her stating again and again that even our pets do not really love her, they like her for food, whereas she feels they all love me for who I am…but not her.
I asked her not to leave last night, mentioning that she may not be seeing things clearly due to her deep depression and that these things can be cyclical. And I was also worried about what she would do as it is almost to the day last year when she attempted to kill herself by drowning herself in the ice cold lake by our home. She told me that I was entirely responsible for her suicide attempt last year and walked out.
To be honest, I feel so shell shocked I don’t really know up from down and cannot find my bearings. Any advice from the fine people on here would be welcome. Thanks.
I recommend you keep reading the blogs, forum and Shari Schreiber’s site http://www.sharischreiber.com/articles.html. If she’s as you describe, those resources should give you a pretty good idea of what you might be dealing with. After that, finding a therapist who understands Personality Disorder could help you sort things out. I can tell you from experience that it’s really hard to find your way out of the forest when you’re constantly dodging falling trees and branches are coming down around you.
Yeah, I got 14 out of that list. The separation was incredibly hard. I can’t remember all the times she said “If you don’t do this, you won’t see your kids” It was awful. My Doctor, after reading her e-mails to me, said she was for sure Borderline Personality Disorder along with Projective Identification. I think it is just very hard for us men to admit that we were in abusive relationships….we have to be “STRONG”.
Holy crap, I thought this was sort of a joke site til I really got into to it and started answering almost every question with yes… I’ve been in my relationship for 3 years now and its been bad at times and good a lot of the time but since I moved in and we had a kid 9 months ago its been a disaster. She constantly turns a small issue like I took a nap into major family issues. Now I know I’m no prince charming but I cannot be as bad as she makes me out to be. I love my son and I’m honestly scared to death of him growing up in this environment. I mostly feel lost and feel like what I do to appease her is never enough.
I have found my own defense mechanism. I just don’t care. I think the next step is I quit but I am trying for the children.
Why would someone keep calling and calling and calling to yell at another party over the phone? When will they realize that I’m just going to hang hp the instant it starts and then turn off the phone if it continues. Also why dose she call the work phone and want to chat for hours at a time. I’ve told her repeatedly IM WORKING. I don’t have time to chat on the phone with her. She the says I’m rude to her. It’s maddening
Thank you, thank you, thank you doctor.
Without shrink4men I don’t know how I would have coped with the last few months.
I have finally escaped, sadly without my confidence and self respect, but at least with some sanity. All of which feel more and more repairable with every page I read on your site.
I answered yes to 10 of the above questions.
Terrifying.
“I know you think I’m a crazy bitch!”, she says.
I have never once mentioned those words. But since I am always wrong, she must be right!
Good luck everyone and safe passage through the madness.
Again, thanks doc!
What breaks my heart is that she will never admit that she has a problem. Why?
Wow, my ex satisfies over 50% of that lot! We have 2 kids and she chucked me out after having a 3 days weird psycho stretch and made me loose my home, family, job, everything after 7 years together. She moved on to a new guy DAYS later (probably from before). Good luck to him!!!! Strange that I didn’t really notice how bad she was until it was all over. True how they say that love is blind……
its good you are out man… “Strange that I didn’t really notice how bad she was until it was all over” is so true. I love the fact that I dont stress over the tiny things anymore. It makes life so much more bearable. Good luck man.
Hi there
I can answer yes to so many of those.. Ive been married for a year and a few months. We have a 3 1/2 year old baby girl and another baby girl on the way in about 6 weeks. My wife is usually a loving person and I care about her dearly. I have never ever cheated on her (been together 5 1/2 years) or given her reason to think otherwise.
She has such a pissed off attitude about 80% of the time. Im a stay at home father/homemaker that always has the house spotless and all the laundry, cleaning, etc etc finished at all times. I want to work but its just not affordable because of child care. She overreacts to little stuff, alienates HERSELF from family and friends, feels that her feelings are the only ones that matter, has NO patience. (hence the webpage loading question) and Im always the target. its my fault that the computer is running slow. or its my fault that Im driving slow when its snowing for safety reasons..) its getting old and anytime I speak up about it, I get lashed out at and if I have a strong feeling about something and want to speak MY side she calls me my father (which he passed away in 2008) they butted heads but he apologized for it before he died and she still pushes that in my face. thats not right to do. Im a laid back guy and dont deserve this. She flies into a rage and throws stuff around the house and breaks things but the minute I get upset and drop my fist on the table, its like Im the antichrist. Im tired of being brow beaten and emotionally pummeled. i do EVERYTHING for this woman and Im 31 and living with this. She has a bunch of past family issues and thats fine but IM NOT THEM. Its embarassing because she hates my friends, she doesnt like my mother, she wants to judge everyone and everything. I need help. I love her but she is driving me away with this. I hate being accused of things and her assuming Im mad when I not at all and she just throws her hands up and walks away. and I dont even say anything, if you think Im mad, ASK ME. isnt that the normal thing to do? I mean last time I checked, Id can have feelings too dammit.
thanks for listening.
Hi Josh! Your wife, my wife, all these wives are the same exact person. Past family issues, learned behavior from mom, always angry and then suddenly loving, etc. They cut you off from reality (friends, family, hobbies) and once you’re isolated they keep you off balance and questioning YOUR sanity. It is going to get a lot worse, believe me. I have eight more years in my nightmare due to protecting my kids (California will bend me over and abandon my kids to this monster) but I’m documenting, getting outside counsel (without her knowing), planning my escape and am going to get video as well. Step one is to confide in someone that won’t talk to her and get your balance back. You’ve got to get perspective before you can plan an escape. Good Luck Brother!
Your wife sounds just like my X. I’ve been doing substantial reading about Personality Disorders and found that scientists in the field of Neuroscience are making some significant headway in understanding the genetic and environmental factors that result in the array of behaviors that you describe. This site provides a list of brief summaries and links to the latest research findings: http://samsnyder.com/2012/02/26/the-neuroscience-of-borderline-personality-disorder/
In answers to your key questions…Your wife’s behavior is not normal, but is sadly typical of someone with BPD (whether or not she is formally diagnosed). First, you’ll have to get past the concept that she’s your partner because she doesn’t really care about how you feel. Since you’re not a “team of highly trained psychiatrists” or providing a “Personality Disorder Community”, you should abandon hope of curing her, saving her, or fixing her. Given that, you’ll need to determine if you can live with what you have through a time-boxed life experiment. I’d suggest giving it 6-12 months because you have kids involved. You’ll need at least a couple of close friends to keep you honest with yourself. (she doesn’t need to know about these friends) The experiment includes the following changes that you’ll make in your behavior: (1) Set several personal boundaries and be extremely consistent and firm, yet unemotional about them. There are some excellent sources out there on boundary setting. (2) Make your own sacred space and time free of the kids and her at least once a week for an hour…it doesn’t matter where you go. You might want to get a dog to walk, even a neighbor’s dog will do. (3) Keep a personal journal as objectively as you can as if you were a journalist. It can be electronic and stored on a thumb drive. Don’t store it anywhere that she could find it and don’t write in it when she’s around. Especially look for patterns in her behavior. (4) Stop trying to please her by reaching for perfection. This simply makes the personality disorder worse. Instead, expect that she has a “quota” of angst, frustration, and yelling to get out. You may want to leave bread crumbs on a counter top or other small things intentionally to consume this negative energy. You have to stop being an emotional sponge for her outbursts and instead act like a Ninja, deflecting the negative energy past you. Resist laughing around her when you do this successfully. (5) Act professionally around her at all times. You’ve taken on the job of being a parent and she is simply emotionally unavailable. Anything you share with her can be seen as a sign of weakness and exploited later. Rely on friends and extended family members for your personal emotional sharing.
As a side note, you should be taking financial precautions, for the sake of your kids. You should also strongly consider getting a job, even if it costs more initially. You may need your financial independence. It’s amazingly difficult to live in a war-zone long-term and it’s not recommended.
Good luck!
WELCOME TO MY NIGHTMARE- YES TO ALL
It’s been great reading everyone’s posts…would appreciate any help here if you have time…thanks in advance!
It seems I’m feeling more and more like a shell of my self these days…I remember when I was “Mr. Positivity” and always cared (and still do) about positively influencing anyone I have an interaction with; however, my girlfriend and I fight so much I often find myself wishing I could disappear…which further complicates my already busy schedule…working 25+ hours a week, going to college-full time, amongst a myriad of other responsibilities… We’ve been living together for a year now, and have been together for 2 years…
After all of the fights that we’ve had she has never once apologized to me for anything…I always apologize, and I always feel like I absolutely cannot win…and for that matter I can probably count on both of my hands the amount of things she’s gone out of her way to do for me…
Having said that, I’ve always been a giver…throughout my entire life…even somewhat of a passive person but confident and very social and caring. I often feel like I’m walking on eggshells when were together as I’m not able to predict what type of mood she’s going to be in…the slightest slip of the tongue or memory and all hell breaks out…
To make matters worse, I’m the type of person who is all about compromise…and equality…yet when I feel she is being hypocritical(sp?) in getting so angry and screaming about something that i did or said…when she has exemplified the same exact, or nearly exact action/comment/reaction etc…yet I cannot cite these examples as she angrily responds “Oh sure, it’s all a d*ck measuring contest isn’t it?” (just the figure of speech…not literal!) or she will say “Don’t you dare compare me to you…”
On the other hand…if I’m calmly requesting her to try to merely take a step back and try and look at the situation through my perspective…she always refuses. Honestly, we argue because I refuse to be a doormat…I feel like if I defend myself in anyway it’s just adding fuel to the fire…which is fine…I’ve kind of come to grips with that…but even the most gandhi-like individual when finding themselves at the brunt of such anger and screaming will occasionally get angry too… I’m almost convinced that this is due to my innate tendency to avoid confrontation…and my inexperience with arguing…as in all of my previous relationships (with 5 years, 10 months, 2 years being the longest ones) I cannot recall more than a handful of arguments in all of those relationships combined…
When I mistakenly called her out on this fact…she then began insulting my ex’s…none of whom think ill of me…and all of them whom I respect…”She also said that this is who she is…she’s a bitch, and she tell’s it like it is…and if I don’t like it she’s sure there’s plenty of ditzy little sluts out there who will keep there mouths shut and who will ‘put out’ more”…She said this as a ‘dig’ at me because I had expressed concern over the seemingly declining intimacy…which includes sex, cuddling, kissing, etc. She also tends to blame all of this on having to wake up at 6am 4 days a week for her job…which I try to understand to a degree…which I’m sure I could do better with understanding this factor…however, she sleeps from 11pm the night before til 6pm on her off days…so we don’t spend much time together then either.
Not to mention the emotional and physical intimacy levels this relationship is very inconsistent, unpredictable, and sparingly spaced out. It was great for the first 6 months…and then it started moving downhill…and gradually to the point where it’s almost nonexistent. I actually confronted her about the decline in intimacy and referenced the fact that before the time last week it had been almost 2 months since the last time…(granted the time last week was for almost 4 hours)….
whenever we fight she blames my attitude for her anger and screaming…citing that it’s not what i say…but how I say it…and sure I have said my share of insulting things…a lot of them happened to be the truth…I actually called her the Devil once and she almost spontaneously combusted in front of me.
I did break up with her a year ago about a month after things started getting bad…as I was in a Psychopathology course and felt like I recognized a high probability of Borderline in her, and it was awful…she kept saying that I know she has issues with abandonement and that I can’t do this do her…and that she can’t live without me and that she promises that she’ll be more about me and etc etc.
I ended up caving because she said she would go to a therapist…course she has no money to do this…and because she is a one of a kind person…I just wish we could cut out the arguing..I can’t Take It Anymore!!! especially because at this point I am starting to believe that it is all my fault…she is very intelligent…and is right about a lot of things and extremely intuitive about anything not having to do with herself…she has never taken responsibility for any problems we’ve ever had…not even an I’m sorry too…or a I didn’t mean to scream at you…
Maybe she’s good at manipulating me…IDK, but I know that I’ve definitely said things once we start arguing that I probably didn’t need to or shouldn’t have said….all of which I have always owned up to…but I guess my question is…How do I crack the Code here? Am I the one who needs help?
For Instance, she flipped out at me for 3 hours when I asked her about the decline in affection…which she blamed all on her job and then started telling me that it’s “so adolescent of me and to stop acting like a child” (something she’s said probably a hundred times in response to things I say…If I talk to her in a direct manner…it’s “stop being an asshole” and if I speak to her calmly and with every word thoroughly screened before it comes out she says “alright, professor, don’t talk to me like I’m stupid, do you think I’m an idiot”)
sorry for the long post…just looking for some help here…I live with her and are lease is up in may…kind of scared to commit to another full year without being sure that I can survive it…”mentally and emotionally”
thanks
Totem
also she get’s really angry whenever I would talk about aspects of our relationship to anyone else, citing that she’s a very private person…
Yep, got that same response with my EX. She loved to tell me that she never told here friends anything bad about me.
In the end I saw two things happening:
#1. I was trying to get a reality check. Telling your problems to others you trust can give you perspective. I can’t tell you can how many times my friend have said, “Wow, that’s F@#ked up”, after I talked to them about the latest round of drama in my 7 year marriage.
#2. My EX has an external lotus of control; meaning that her sense of self worth comes from others. Because of this her life was a carefully controlled public image campaign.
BTW, about previous post, If your still living with her and your lease is up in May, keep a low profile, forget about talking to her or reasoning with her.
You’re in a position that any conflict can turn out badly for you since you’re a man and she’s a woman.
Also, read Dr.T’s article on emotional detachment, http://shrink4men.wordpress.com/2009/12/09/emotional-detachment-when-the-no-contact-rule-is-not-an-option/.
Also, I recommend going to the Shrink4Men index and work your way through the articles. It will be very educational.
Excellent advice! I wish I would have heard your advice years ago. Thank you for writing.
Nick
Sounds like you belong here. Keep reading and check out the forum. Since you already have some knowledge of Cluster Bs through you Psycopathology course, things should fall into place pretty quickly.
The only other advice it to be careful while you sort things out. Since she’s already expressed her abandonment concerns to you, if she thinks you’re contemplating leaving again, she could react in a number of unpleasant ways.
Totem,
The always-you-who-apologizes and your feeling that you can’t win will never change. Add to that the evaporating intimacy, and what do you have left with her? Not much.
You seem to have a solid analytical mind and hence a good grasp of what’s going on here. And yet you’re unsure about ending it. It seems to me that when you confront her with legitmate issues her response is basically to steamroll over you one way or another. In other words, she’s a bully. And that’s when you lose your force. Why?
My guess is you’re probably not used to being treated that way, and since there’s a whole other side to her that you care for and respect, you have a hard time accepting that the bully side is the ‘real her’. And since you tend to avoid conflict anyway you prefer to sort of throw up your hands in confusion over her erratic behavior than take the action that I suspect you know in your heart of hearts is necessary.
People have differents selves. You have to be able to live with all of them if the relationship is to work for you. She is terrific in some ways, but she also has strong BPD and narc traits and they won’t go away and you can’t fix them and you’ll never get her to see things the way you do, or get some ‘aha’ moment from her that signals the beginning of some sea change in how she operates.
She will always make you feel ‘less than’ because she always has to feel in control. No matter how you stand up for yourself–gently and compassionately, or forcefully–she will punish you for the crime of challenging her supremacy. And each time…to make things ‘right’ again, you will have eat more sh*t and give up more autonomy and self-respect. To rationalize this cycle of humiliation to yourself you will have to engage in increasingly intricate mental gymnastics that will leave you depressed and confused and with fewer and fewer resources for managing the other demands in your life like work and school.
Your self esteem has already taken a hit from this synamic and it will get worse over time.
Don’t renew that lease, my friend. It will only get worse. You need to extract yourself from her clutches sooner rather than later. Don’t be like me . . . I am married and have a son with my borderline soon-to-be-ex. I bought land, built a house, and am coworkers with the psycho bitch. I stand to lose everything (my son, my property, and my job, for starters), but I can’t stand another day of being physically assaulted and having insults and obscenities screamed into my face in my own home. Don’t be like me. Get out ASAP.
Sorry dude. That sounds like it sucks but you’re doing the right thing. Keep plugged in and let us know how you’re doing.
Nick
Totem – Hang in there and then get out of there. 99% of the posts you’ll read are about “nice guys” like us who are convinced we’re dealing with rational people. These women are monsters, and I mean that very literally. These sadists are masters at hiding who they are because their lives depend on non-exposure. Document, document and document. God Bless Brother!
Thank you Dr. Tara for helping us in this very bad situation in our lives. I can’t believe how many guys are in the same cruise ship from hell. My wife was like this before we got married. She would specialize on the catch and release theory. Be very nice and generous and then when your happy blow up on you. I married her because she got pregnant and wouldn’t have an abortion, we were broken off for 2 months and somehow the last time we were together i got her pregnant. i was 25 and stupid to think that if i did the right thing and married her she would change. was i ever wrong. Everyone that had met her including my family warned me not to get married with her i could still support my child without having to be with her. but i didn’t listen, i wanted my kid to grow up with a father at home. 3 kids later and countless times kicked out of my house in 17 years, i am completly drained of all emotion and as i’m writing this i found an apartment and signing the lease today. i haven’t said anything to her yet but this time i am gone. The examples you give here are just a tip of the iceburg. i would need 500 pages to tell my story. To sum up the book i can write, from the time we got married, she never went back to work to take care of the children, i give her anything she wants, my kids have everything under the sun including cell phones from 10 years old and i am a good provider, for that, i don’t speak with any family members anymore, have no friends outside work. She is like a pitbull, ready to attack anyone and anything in site. I wanted to ask you about one thing that i couldn’t understand all these years. During the holidays, especially christmas, i have to take out a loan for christmas gifts because she thinks christmas is once a year and anyone she knows has to get the most expensive gifts she can think of, is that part of the catch and release theory i have lived through all these years?
Thanks for being there!
yours started exactly like mine. I cant tell whether or not you ended it by your post but I really hope you get out of this situation. I did at 27 (10 years together) 2 with kid.. and it has been the best thing I have done for myself. The kids understand. My daughter took great to it and shes rediculously smart for a now going on 3 year old. My stress stopped immediately after I kicked her out. Things are so much better now. Good luck!
Well, I don’t know how to classify my current girlfriend.
I care about her and 80% of the time she is sweet, loving and caring and is a joy to be with. Then she will go crazy, perhaps probe into my past. Ask about old girlfriends from years past or my ex wife. If I refuse to answer, she will get angry. If I do answer then she gets really mad and jealous. She wont let it go and it is a no win situation.
I should have known she was a bit crazy when I met her because she has 7 cats that she “saved”, but I like cats (although having none myself) and so ignored that glaring fact.
The other day she made me burn all my old wedding photos from my previous marriage, god forbid she finds a photo of an old girlfriend. Any girl I mention in relation to anything, work, past, study…. the question comes up, did you sleep with her??? WTF!! some of the people she is suspicious of are married or twice my age… When she gets in these moods, she says that there will be no new experiences with her, as I have done it all before.
The fact that I remained on good terms with my wife drives my current gf crazy. She wants me to be mean to my ex and to make life difficult for her. That is something I don’t want to do, as I have good access to my kids and don’t want to “go to war” with my ex and spoil that.
With my gfs crazy moods, after about 3-12 hours she usually settles down and apologises and all is well again, until the next time. Which is about once a week. The thing is it can be going great one minute and then turns bad in about 2 seconds and no logic can reach her and no avoiding photos or emails will stop it, as she will always find something to go off about.
From what everybody says, I guess I should cut my losses and leave her sooner rather than later.
When she is at my flat, I am getting paranoid that she will find an old birthday card or email or letter or photo etc, etc. and go off the deep end. It makes me worry about our long term future.
The relationship now has a life of its own and I feel bad for ending it. Especially when we had been planning a future together but now I think that would be a serious mistake.
Thanks for any input
She made you burn your old wedding pictures, wants you to be mean to your ex-wife and makes you worry about what she’ll find in your apartment. Doesn’t sound promising.
The way I see it you have three options:
(1) Leave now before things get worse and don’t look back. The longer this goes on, the worse it’s likely to get.
(2) Figure out what you want, stand up for yourself, and set down firm boudaries and expectations. If she agrees and comes around, you saved the relationship. Based on the fact you did burn your old wedding pictures, it seems that you’ve ceded control to her. In her mind, she owns you. You’re going to have to fight to make it back to equal. My guess is she’ll not react well to your standing up for yourslf.
(3) Accept her for what she appears to be and live with it. As you have already figured out, it would likely be a serious mistake but it is an option.
Option 1 appears to be your best bet. Option 2 does have the possibility of a favorable outcome but it’s not likely and it carries considerable risk. Option 3 just plain stinks.
Holy Crap!! I answered YES to 14 of the above statments. Now I KNOW I did the right and kick her to the curb. I keep printed this and keep it in my coat pocket to remind me when ever I get a urge to call her. And she was talking marriage. The first 6 months were awsome, then thing began to degrade and spiral out of control rapidly.
Wow, I honestly had no idea that there were so many people in this same predicament. My ex-wife (divorced over a year) met all criteria minus the lipstick question. It is truly amazing how diabolical that they can be about making you feel like everything is your fault and how they make you feel lower than dirt. I spent 10 years with this woman and had a child with her on the 7th year. Things were always really rocky and since I am a very committed person I figured that this was something that you must just deal with. Well im here to tell you know that no matter how nice of a guy that you are or how much you feel that you can deal with it, these people will rip your world apart piece by piece until you cant even figure out which way is up. I can honestly say that when I kicked her out (infidelity on her part) that I honestly didnt even know who I was anymore. The last year of my relationship, I actually contemplated disappearing and not coming back. Problem is that I have/had a daughter with her that means the world to me. So I stayed until I couldnt bare it anymore. Im simply saying this because this article meant a lot to me and the comments that have been posted below mean even more to me. IMHO if you are even looking at this article you are already 1 step to getting away from that. Wish that I would have read it a lot earlier than last year for that matter. ALSO I will tell you that once you are out of it and start rebuilding who you were before you were caught in this tornado, you will realize that you have adapted to such horrible stress that even day to day life doesnt even bother you anyomore…i.e. finances, jobs, etc… It will make you a happier person and I never even knew what burden I was carrying until I was out. So please if you are in this situation or at least think you are, you need to get out of it asap before it destroys who you are. FYI, once you have a kid it never stops. You will never get this person 100% out of your life and furthermore, the games never stop either. The only time I am EVER uncomfortable is when I am around her. I recieved promotions upon promotions at work, triple my income, and I am a great father…Please take my advice and bail while you can and break the vicious cycle. Thanks.
So I appreciate the previous post. I think that my now ex has these issues. She was a liar who constantly claimed that she never lies. Her pet name for me was dirt squirrel. She was always angry at someone and would spend an entire day talking about that person. When she was drunk we would argue. I would leave her place. Then the text message explosion would start. I wouldn’t reply and that would just make things worse. A regular message would be that she loves me, followed by how awful I am. Tell me that I blame her for everything and that I’m overly dramatic. There were promises of sex that never happened. About 10 times in 6 months. I apologized constantly she never did. She made me feel like I was abusive. Any time I called her on anything I was being cruel. The worst part though… She came out of an abusive relationship so what could I do.
I broke up with her today. Unfortunately I still work with her. Any advice?
Thanks
sorry, meant to say that we only had sex about ten times in six months
Well, as long as you have no kids you should be free Nd clear of her. No ammo. Its not an easy road because its weird, almost like you get used to the abuse. Almost like smoking, (I smoke) ya know it’s bad but ya just keep doing it. Once you pull yourself away long enough, you will be able to tell instantly who you are. I wish you the best of luck. 1 more thing. You might as well give up on getting the last word in bc they will never let it happen. Try not to think to yourself omg I can’t believe this is happening to me and try to figure a solution. There isnt one, get it out of your head. There is no winning or losing with these people so just walk away and stay confident. Hope that helps man, good luck!
Btw mine was “drama-queen” or she would call me her father. When she was drunk she would get very violent. I had the ability to press charges on her once, I wish I would’ve.
Thank you! I have found myself feeling terrible for breaking it off with her. Guilty that I am hurting her. WTF??? Lol
Spot on….Wow
great to see I’m not alone, i ranked up 10 “yes’s” to the above set of questions. SIGH.
Hello. Im 22 and Ive been in a relationship for seven months with a girl that has admitted to having borderline personality disorder. This is the first serious relationship Ive been in and she took my virginity. I actually met her through her ex boyfriend she was living with him and off him at the the time and their relationship wasnt really going anywhere. I know not the best of circumstances to start out with. My friend told me at first, dont get involved because you will just take his spot but then he said If you really like her than do it. So things seemed great at first, she ended up leaving and moving in with me at my moms big house. She seemed to be helping my relationship with my mom but then one day she flipped claiming that my brother stole some of her stuff, I dont know for sure of he did, but she ended up calling the cops on my mom cause she overreated and tried to grab my girlfriends phone. So now my mom kicks her out, she talks me into moving out with her cause her mom wont let her stay. I agree then I realize I have no reason to move out other than to take care of her. So I decide to stay at my moms while still giving her a ride to work and to her apartment, it starts to take a toll me especially when she stops giving me gas money and I have to beg her for it. One day I just get fed up and stop answering her calls and taking her to work because I was feeling used. My brother said she was using me. I feel so ripped apart, I think im just addicted though, so I give in and I stay in contact with her and now all of a sudden she wants to talk with this church group i go to when she stopped before. She has phsycially abused me and cused me out a million times, my gut is telling me to leave but its hard, and I right? Im losing all confindence in our relationship.
Hi cb,
You’re young and you will hopefully meet someone healthier next time around. “She has physically abused me.” There’s no excuse for this. Staying in the relationship means you condone her behavior. Get some support from your family and friends and cut this woman out of your life.
Wow! 14 Yes’s, in fact the lipstick one was the only firm no.
We’ve only been married for a year but both have prior families. I have 4 kids. She has 5 kids of varying levels of disfunctionality. Luckily, we have none together and never will. I am fixed!
The smartest thing I ever did in my life was have her sign a prenup!.
I have a couple of questions. Is there any way to diffuse these people or respond when they go off?
My wife will start in on me and I will be calm and use rational arguements and she just changes the subject. She often makes derogatory comments about my dead first wife and even implied that I was having an incestual relationship with my daughter. These statements are hurtful especially since I literally watched my first wife die. It’s completely freaking insane and I always make sure doors are open or there is a second person in any room when I talk to the kids just in case!
How do I get rid of her? I have told her to leave before and she refuses. I own sole title on the house and like I said have a prenup. So I guess I just go to a lawyer? Anybody know how that process works? The thought scares me because she is abusive in that she frequently menaces me and refuses me passage from rooms. She has also thrown things. What do I do if I think she is potentially violent?
I just want her gone.
Ksechler – I’ve found that Diffusing the situation is difficult but possible. Most of the posts I’ve read about this I can concur. Avoid “feeding” her emotionally, detatched and emotionless statements like “that’s not true” and “I don’t agree” let her know that she’s not in control and that she’ll have to try a different technique to gain control. These monsters often switch tactics on the fly and are masters at wearing you down. Document, document and document. I’m getting a video camera as most of the time I can tell when my little sadist is ramping up for a tirade. Bad news, it’s going to get uglier…the good news, now you know she’s a different animal and you don’t have to internalize her abuse…you know enough to view her as sadistic species who has little capacity for any normal feelings except her desire to control and abuse. It’s a sickness and it’s contagious. Good luck Brother!
To ksechler: I think the lipstick thing can be applied to other ‘cosmetics’ – as in, does she do everything to excess? Hairspray, perfume, jewelry, just everything over the top and thinks she needs to have the best of the best?
If your partner is violent, unfortunately, the best thing for you to do it get out. Get your children out. Get yourself somewhere safe.
There is a law in MN that states if one spouse makes the home ‘inhospitable’ for the other (the case sited involved one spouse inviting someone to live there without the will or consent of the other spouse), then the offended spouse can leave the home, without it being considered abandonment. I forget the phrase, as it’s been a few years since I looked it up in our local county law library.
The essence of the law is that; If one spouse makes it so that living conditions are unbearable for the other (like abuse), the offending spouse (abuser) has effectively abandoned the home; the offended (abused) spouse can leave without it being considered abandoning their possessions or possession of the house.
I hope that makes sense. I’m a little rusty on my legal-ese.
I would check to see if there are any such laws where you live.
Wow this is spot on with my wife. If I didn’t have a daughter and step son who needed me I would be out of here so fast. I do love her but the relationship is very abusive. She now told me about something she supposedly kept from me for a year and a half only to spring it on to me when she was in the negative side of everything is my fault. It has almost ruined our family trip that we are on.
I probably answered yes to most of these questions, all but one or two to be more specific, I’m going to go out on a limb and say that like me, did most of you guys get into relationships with attractive women? or women who became more attractive post high school. It could jsut be my situation but I’m just trying to get a grasp on the sitation. everyday it’s like I fall in and out of love, spending hours thinking about wheather I should jsut leave for my own sanity, but then when i leave it will be my fault and her family will think i’m the asshole who left her high and dry, when in reality I do everything for her, worship the ground she walks on. The person who loves the most controls the least in my opinion, i’m trying not to be bitter about anything, it just sucks…..
Hi Pete! YES! I beleive you’re right about attractive wives and theories for that are endless. The first couple years I ignored extremely irractic behavior and my church condoned it as just female emotionalism (soft bigotry). By the time I had kids I was in deep and going crazy, literally. Then a friend recognized her behavior (he was a marriage counselor) and told me that if she’s as dangerous as he thinks, leaving her would leave my kids in harms way because of California family courts. I honestly thought it was just my fault and that he was srong. That is how crazy these sadists can make you feel or more accurately, that is how crazy you choose to feel with their full approval and encouragement.
Anyway, I recommend, no matter what you decide, document, document and document some more. Find someone outside your family and most friends who won’t tell anyone what you’re going through so your support won’t get back to her. The more you talk about this crap you’re in, the stronger you will get and more importantly, you’ll get your balance back. These sadists depend on the fact that you’re isolated and off balance. Exposure, to them, is like sun light to bacteria. They are terrified of one thing and one thing only, exposure. Documentation is exposure and talking with someone is corroboration and balance.
Stay safe, guard your kids and get balance. Good luck brother!
Interesting question, Peter. My ex-NPD GF was extremely attractive and knew it. She would always tell me how she “deserved to be treated”, and what I could never quite figure out was that I treated her great, but it was never enough. On an interesting note, the week before we finally broke up (12 days NC and counting!) I told her “you look beautiful”…she looked at me and said, “what do you expect me to say to that?” I said, “thank you, I suppose,” and her response was, “if a woman says thank you to that then she doesn’t really believe she is beautiful.” It was then I realized that she never said thank you when I complimented her, ever. What a peculiar thing to say, I thought. Glad to be out, though it’s not easy, it’s getting better.
The putting on a pedal stuff really shook me. I get this all the time with my girlfriend. We live together. One day she will tell me she is so blessed to have me in her life, that I mean everything to her. And the next day she will tell me that she hates me, that I am a horrible person, a complete scumbag. She has packed her things 8 or 9 times in the last three years and moved out for a few weeks, even living in her car at times or going to stay at a woman’s victim shelter. When she leaves she tells me to never contact her again (even to apologize!) and that we are completely done. She also will say just ANYTHING she can to hurt. One time she even told me that her ex-husband (whom she hates) was “right about me” and that she agrees with him that I am a loser.
I have almost started to believe that I am a terrible person as she says in her rages. Frankly, I have never in my life seen someone become so rage filled, angry and hateful. I seem to go from being someone she loves to then being her worst enemy.
She left again a few days ago. The worst thing is this: while I don’t really miss her, I feel scared and confused. I am afraid of losing her and that is an embarrassing thing to admit. I am not sure why I feel this way. A part of me wonders if I will be ok without her, or I find myself hoping she will return. I know that that is pathetic. But it is true. Anyhow, I am in the middle of it now.
Lose her. Change your locks and don’t let her back in. If she hangs around insisting that you let her in, get the police involved.
That’s what I did, and my life is so much better now. Living with an abuser is pure hell. Now is you chance; don’t put up with it any more.
17/19. The odd thing is that almost 75% of those answers came after our child was born…I “thought” all these trait’s were PPD (Postpartum Depression). I survived 4 year’s of Emotional,Physical and Sexual abuse…I stayed because I tried to shield my daughter from the abuse I knew would be placed on her if I couldn’t stand as a shield…I lasted only 5 year’s before the abuse went personal and went into betrayal…But finally she kicked me out to be with a man she had an affair with, and I was free, she had a new target that wasn’t my daughter.
I have a question about all of this…how many other men out there stayed and allowed themselves to be abused based off “Honor”…and why do we do this to ourselves?
I have a girlfriend just like this. We’ve been together for four years and I can’t take it anymore. I want to get out, however I dont know how because i love her to death on her good days ( quite the opposite on bad days) and when ever we get in fights I’m threated that she will kill or hurt herself. I can’t handle knowing her life is in my hands and that I’d be responsible for her death. We’re about to go off to different colleges and I fear that she might follow through one of these times and kill herself. She cant be alone and I think she has father issues. I need serious help. How do I get out of this one with her still living and me not going insane from all of this? I really need help.
Woah. I got shivers just reading your post. I can relate to almost every single thing you just said. I’ve known my girl for years now. Sometimes she’s the sweetest, most loving person. That’s when things are going well. But when I do something to trigger a negative emotion, things just fall apart in seconds. Somehow I never see her as a cruel person. She’s just extremely difficult to deal with. Emotional, highly-sensitive, paranoid, and the very mention of “break-up” sends her into a fit of tears or tantrums. On good days she’s very loving, very sweet, homely, and just a sweetheart. When she’s mad I just feel like I want OUT so bad. Have you found a solution for your problem? What did you do? I’m also always afraid that she’ll hurt herself if we break-up. We’ve been apart before, and it ended with days of blaming, crying, then pleading. Then things were great till the next big fight. I can’t stand knowing she’s sick or depressed thinking of me, but to be honest I really, really want to be free again. We took a two month break from each other last year and the freedom and independence it gave me was amazing. I want that, but I want her to be safe too. Too bad she’s not accepting the fact that we’re just not meant to be. Any suggestions? Anyone?
Question: How much of this is on a “spectrum” in that virtually all women exhibit some of these kinds of traits, and no matter who we are with, we will have to learn how to deal with these things because they “go with the territory” of women and being married. OR–do these traits truly represent a psychological disorder that is rare, and that the vast majority of women don’t exhibit. Since I’ve only been married to one (who exhibits over 10 of those original traits), I’m wondering!
I’ve been wondering the same thing. I’ve only been married to my current wife but have seen and talked to my friends who say their wives are identical in behavior. I’m wondering too!
I answered yes to every one of the questions… I’m havin an argument over the phone via text right now as we speak and I have no idea why.
So drop the rope. There’s no law that says you have to reply to her texts.
it gets worse if its a second marriage. She blames me for loving my kids from my first marriage more than her. When they visit, if i spend too much time with them she says shes neglected. Yet she wont hang out with us because one of my kids can be difficult.
So I answered yes to enough to be concerned, but the problem is that my wife has had medical problems that have affected her hormone levels for years. So there has always been a treatment to throw the blame on and she admits that she can’t control it and that she wants to do something about it…my fear is that the way she is when she is on the hormone treatment (because her body doesn’t produce enough estrogen to function) is the way that she will be if she actually does eventually get her system working…if it’s not and I leave now then i never gave it a chance to work…?
HK, in my experience its always SOMETHING. PMS, hormones, thyroid, menopause, etc. These women have excuses down to a science. Crazy is crazy.
I need help/advice please. i am trying to make the best of the situation. my girlfriend is 4 1/2 months pregnant, we dated for 2 months, broke up cuz of similar arguements, then she told me she was pregnant. so i stepped back in to help and hopefully form a family. and i know things can be emotional during pregnancy with hormones going in every direction, i understand that. but before she was pregnant, things werent much different. arguements about little things turn into child like tantrums to the point where she gets furious, starts yelling, swearing/calling me names (f* bombs), and blames me for her reacting the way she is. she doesnt acknowledge that we’re in public and people are staring. when i want to take a breather and go for a walk, just to pause the argument, to prevent things getting worse, it gets worse when i try to do that. it gets to a point where i get shakey listening her yell this way at me cuz she wont let me leave the car or room. i just usually sit there and try to absorb as much as i can to prevent things getting worse, but it sometimes does get worse. she gets in my face, curses at me, asks me to pack my stuff and leave, and when i try to do so, she rips my stuff/clothes out of my hands and pushes me until i’m out of the house. i really only want whats best for my child, thats why i’ve been trying to endure this madness. i care about her, but every time this happens makes me lose interest in just about everything in my life because it keeps happening. i’m really afraid that she will take control over our child and try to prevent me from seeing my lil boy. dont know what to do… i’m starting to feel like i’m going crazy
Best advice is to get out of that relationship. Raising a child with this girl is going to be hell either way but, at least you won’t be getting abused. You can still be responsible to the child without being a relationship with someone who you suspect to have a personality disorder.
Also, read the past articles on this site about co-parenting with a BPD/NPD.
AND… Be sure to get a paternity test when the baby is born. If possible to it without the mother knowing to avoid more conflict. If its not you child then you’re in the clear.
Good luck.
I answered yes to about 85%…its good to know im not alone,i have kids and its sooo hard to leave
DAM….i answered yes to almost all of them (i can’t even talk to my sister without her saying that MY OWN sister has a thing for me)
I answered yes to 15 of the above. I try and do everything for my wife, buy her clothes, take her out, rub her feet, e.t.c. but still she calls me selfish. whenever she doesnt have her way she threatens me by saying she is moving back to her moms house. she yells at me all the time and when i retaliate by yelling too she tells people im rude to her. And worst of all she honestly believes she is right when everyone else can see that she is the one abusing me. She goes to church and sings hymns everytime in the house and pretends like im a demon that the devil sent to taunt her and test her faith. im starting to feel like im the one who needs Jesus now coz of the way she treats. Before we got married she used to tell me that she wouldnt have sex with me unless we got married so its one of the reasons why i did it. And now that we are married whe always has an excuse why not to have it! the worse part is that she is 6 months pregnant and despite everything i love her with everything in me. but its no use loving someone who doesnt feel the same way about you. so despite the fact that im not divorcing her, im gonna try to focus all my love on my daughter. I hope this love i have for my wife can fade soon…
I was married to one of these crazy women. I’m much better off now with my new partner. She is sane, rational, and supportive, not to mention absolutely beautiful. Beware out there men – these types of women DO exist and they are scary!!!
Good grief I am so screwed. Been married to this woman for 12 years. Three kids. I still love her very much. I can answer Yes to so many of these. She goes out and parties almost every other night and I add an old friend from high school (woman) to my facebook and she accuses me of doing something. I only added her cause her daughters used to be in the same dance school as mine, and they moved, and I wanted to see how they were doing. My wife has even met her and loved watching her kids dance. Now all of a sudden I get accused of adding an old girlfriend. She never was my girlfriend and she is happily married now. F__k me I am the last person that would ever cheat. I have never cheated on her or even thought of cheating. And here is the funny stuff, she had a “man” friend that she hid behind my back a couple of years ago. Wanna know how I found out…my 13yr old son caught her talking to him while I was out of town working. He was in tears telling me. She is insane jealous, but she gets to party every night and I dont have to worry cause she is a “good girl”. Never mind the stress this puts on me, but my kids pick up on it too. I dont know what to do. I still love her very much. I dont want to divorce. She often tells me she is ready to divorce, but cant cause she doesnt have any money. I am so overloaded in debt for this woman, about half my salary goes to unsecured debt. She is a shopaholic. She buys a new purse and then yells at me for not having enough money for food. I tell her to eat her purse. That doenst help. Last night I got sick of her claiming I was doing something with my facebook old friend, and I got pissed and started walking home from the resturant. She picked me up halfway home and when we got in the driveway, I told her she needs to get serious about this marriage or she can pack her bags. All she heard was the “pack her bags” part so now I am in the doghouse for kicking her out of the house. Wedding ring is off her finger, I still have mine on. All I want is for her to stop claiming I am a liar. I have never lied to her ever. She knows she is a psycho. She knows she has a problem. I dont want a divorce, I still really deeply love her. I also know she loves me. She just has a terrible issue with trust. Her father was a looser and mom pretty much is too. She had a rough childhood, mine was great. I just want her to be sane. Oh, and never mind the unreasonable arguments she gets into with my son. He is a really good kid (kinda lazy but what teenager isnt), and she rides him. When they have a big blowup I have to go to his room and smooth things over with him. I make excuses for her and give him tips on how to “get along” with her. Just keep repeating “yes mam”. Anyway…Thanks for letting me share. Oh yea, after I got home from halfway walking home, I deleted my facebook. Didnt really need it anyway, I only joined so I could video chat with her while I was travelling. Anyway, thanks for listening (reading). Somehow this helped me a little bit.
All I can say is protect your kid.
I have been dealing with this for 14 years. We just finished a year in “couples” therapy which has cost of thousands of dollars we did not have. Our finances are in ruin. We have two kids, 12 and 14 years old. That is the only thing that keeps me in this nightmare. One of the things in reading all these posts is what happenes to them when I finally reach the breaking point? If I leave they will be forced to deal with her on a daily basis without me there to run interferance. Additionally, we do not have enough money to support two households. We are barely able to maintian one. I feel like I am trapped. When things are going OK which is more and more infrequent, I think…”If I can only holdout a few more years maybe the impact on my kids will not be as severe. I honestly do not know what to do…
Only a few… at first we had a great sex life (always was great)…. but within a few months she didn’t want me coming over as much then not anymore, complained I never offered to take her anywhere (but then wouldn’t have to time to) or offer to help her around the house (but then she would say I’m in the the way and don’t need help), stop calling her because it drove her crazy and bugged her (I would call or msg her saying I love her everyday), would freak out if I called her for directions to a new place to meet I never been before….
I’m like “WTF!!!” at first she would always want to talk things out if she was upset now nothing. I had to end the relationship she is just too F’d up for me.
i need advice please i said yes to all of these questions im 19 and my girlfriend is 23 i have been with my girlfriend for 4 years already and i cant take anymore… i made the mistake of moving in with her and her mom when i was 15 yeah i know stupid! my life has been hell since i met her she slept with my cousin and admitted to making out with a bunch of random guys when we were living together she controlls every move i make she even made me stop going to school… i did everything i could to avoid fights with her because she went CRAZY! after a year i decided i didnt care if she went crazy i was going to leave anyways, then threatens she will kill herself so i am forced to stay, i actually tried to leave twice once she took like 7 pills and ended up in the emergency room the next time she took 12 ambiens and crashed her car and ended up in the hospital again! i cant take this anymore she is always mad at me for the dumbest things i cant even go to school because she thinks im cheating on her i never see my family i lost all my friends and i mean all my friends!! she always would tell me to go out hang out with my friends and family and be pissed when i got home she threw a giant rock that she picked up with both hands because i wanted to go to school once.. the only reason im able to write this is because shes hanging out with my cousin right now yes the one she slept with… i cant say anything tho because it will lead into a fight wich will lead into her trying to overdose i need a way out without her hurting herslef.. she doesnt even talk to her mom or brother anymore because she hates everyone.. i am not allowed to do anything except work and whenever i say i want to do somrthing she flips out and i end up having to apologize.. i already ruined my credit by getting a house i couldnt afford so now im stuck in a studio! please i would appreciate any advice or at least someone to talk to about this..
I’ve answered yes two all. she has me falling out of love. ive been with her for 7 months and the first month was the best until all of this happened. ik im just 18 and young but i feel trapped in a box.
In April we went to the hospital because of her health problems, and when she wakes up she starts punching doctors and nurses and hitting her head on the wall, which gave her a himatoma. and from then on, all she has been doing is putting me down, making me feel worthless. her mother warned me about her and i ignored her cuz her mom is crazy too. is leaving her a good idea?
she also says that should would kill herself if i ever break up with her.
Tell her you are done, finished, gone. When she then makes the threat & she will,call the police & tell them she is suicidal. They will be forced to admit her to the mental hospital. 99.9999999% of the time it is an empty threat made solely to keep you trapped. Call her on it. The stay in the mental hospital may just fix it. Just make sure you are nowhere near when she is released. If she tracks you down call the police again. Rinse & repeat 🙂
thank you very much and i did what you said and well i feel so free. she still has her stuff in my house but the doctors say that she will be getting her stuff accompanied but 3 police office and suggests that im out of the house when she is taking her stuff and that i MUST get a restaining order. i feel so relieved thanx Ron!!!!
I answered yes to 9 of them. In fact, our one-year anniversary is in less than two months but about a month ago she left to spend 6-weeks visiting friends and family in New York (I’m in L.A.)
It was this time away from her that allowed me to see what a lunatic she is; the world was suddenly back to normal, peaceful, without her around. I actually tried to dump her twice last spring but she is a master manipulator. However, this time I’m armed to the teeth with information from sites like this one so that when she gets back she won’t be able to turn the tables on me again…thank you for that.
ugh 14 of those fit. She’s a rageaholic. It’s so weird, I’ve lived my whole life being told how abusive, violent, and just tyrannical men can be and as a result many boys are taught to control their temper. Hell if anything we learned that if we don’t hold ourselves in check we’ll get our asses beat. So how many girls just missed angermanagement 101 as kids?
Regarding my wife, I answered yes to 14 of the 19 bullets. Then I got to the bottom where it said “if you answered yes to more than 2 or 3…” I was shocked.
She also has a history of failed relationships before me (including one failed marriage).
There’s an old saying —
“Women marry men expecting them to change and they don’t.
Men marry women expecting them not to change and they do.”
From most of the comments I’ve read I would say that’s 100% true.
Women can be so fake.
My wife also shows signs of Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder (Passive-Aggressive), although I’m no expert in the variety of disorders in question. All I know is that, since we have a child, I’m sticking it out for our kid’s sake. I’m trying to be a good enough dad to sufficiently counter the insanities my wife brings into it all.
Lastly, I still love my wife (not sure why) but she doesn’t leave me much hope of a happily married future.
Consider this. Sticking it out for the child’s sake may not actually be in the child’s best interest. To have to endure all of the conflict and drama between mommy and daddy may do more harm than ending the relationship. I’m no child psychologist but it seems to me there is a lot of potential for collateral damage here.
I saw that too —its a Mark Twain quote,I think—had me laughing at the co-parenting class required before divorce.
No wonder why this piece has for so many comments, I would’ve never thought of finding a site dedicated, to men needs, specifically, the psychic ones, I’ve come to find myself, or actually to realize, or lose the “blindfold” so to speak, that I am in an abussive relationship, I’ve just been married for 2 months and I already feel, like choking to death every single day, she’s been diagnoses with BPD, and still she won’t take help from anyone, even less take any medications, and just so you all know, she and I are doctor, both of us, specialists, and in spite of it, my household, seems to be pretty close to osculantism, anyway, I’m in a point where I don’t know what’s going to happen to us, either way it is really nice and reassuring to know that there are sites, that supports us men, and provide this wonderful and so helpful information.
Thank you dearly all the way from Mèxico…
Yes, I am getting married in about a month, and she is just out of control. She gets very angry at little things, blaming me for everything. For example, we have an appointment at 8 am with our wedding dj, and I told her we need to leave by 815, I get up at 830, and she is still getting ready, I told her we wont make it on time, and she flips out on me , even though she has a clock in front of her, and says she is not marrying me and storms out of the apt in her car, and drives off. I even told her, what if I was awake at 730, would you have been ready at 815? The clock is in front of your face. But, no its my fault, and know I screw everything up. Just so sick of her blaming me for everything that she screws up.
I meant apt at 9 am and need to leave by 815
ohno …
Did you read the post on this site: Urgent Group Intervention Needed: Should this Man Marry his Abusive and Controlling Fiancee Next Week? (June 30, 2011) …
Might be interesting reading!
And you are really going to marry this woman? Are you really wanting to live this life? It only gets worse once you tie the knot. Once you say “I do” her response is “Never again you don’t unless you do it my way and only then if i feel like letting you”
Ditto on that, pal. Everyone told me I would wind up in the same place as her ex-husband, and that’s EXACTLY where I am today. The only thing more crazy than a woman like that is the guy that will marry her KNOWING what he is in for.
Hi Dr T…It’s Stefano. I haven’t been by for a while but just dropped by and I can see things are just how they always were with crazy women making life incredibly hard. I was the guy who ended up being punched and abused by my ex partner and then she reported me after I had to restrain her. Yes i was arrested but my lawyer managed to show through my evidence just how unstable she was and the Police dropped their case!
Anyway I want to thank you for all the advice you gave back then, and everything that you said would happen and every trick you said she would play came true! And the really, really sad fact is that if it wasn’t for you and the guys on here she would have sucked me back into hell as during my low times I very nearly fell for her charms again! But your words and all the evidence on here made me believe I was simply wasting my time and my life would be a disaster again.
As it is I am happy, youngish and single and don’t have to tread on egg shells around her in my home any longer.
I know it hard guys to get out and in my case I really did run the gauntlet of a rage like you would not believe…but it can be done.
Oh and yes I did answer yes to most of the points in this article but then again I knew she was a nut!
Hi Stefano,
I’m relieved you were able to get the charges dropped and got away from your toxic ex for once and for all. That is very good news.
Onwards and upwards! Dr T
I think that this forum is extremely helpful.
Thank you so much Dr. T.
I know that I have to leave her, and it breaks my heart. But nothing I have tried can get through that shell of hers. She is just so full of fear and anger. That post about the reactions to accountability and criticism hurt to read, it’s very accurate.
At any rate, I just wanted to say thank you.
My Ex: “You always wanted to provoke me!”
Me: “I never wanted to provoke you.. I just… wanted to get through to you!”
My Ex: “Why would you even want to get through to me?”
– I was speechless!
Geeze…I answered “yes” to twelve of these questions. Now I’m REALLY depressed.
I just broke up with my girlfriend. Right now i’m thanking God that I did. Reading these comments and Quiz has given me the resolution I need to realise that shouldn’t put up with any girl that fails this quiz.
Im in University and I started dating my ex towards the end of the spring semester. At the start she was fun and exciting. When we first started dating we were totally into each other; we basically hung out everyday. It was awesome, she had a car too 😀 and everyday when we hung out I could feel this real connection and energy between us.
I thought things were turning out into something great until she exposed herself as a definite mega bitch or possibly a Sucubus. Everytime we met over the last four months she was becoming someone else. She checks off the majority of the quiz questions now and it’s basically like living with the devil.
She was emotionally abusing me 75% of the time and then she would change back into the the fun and exciting girl again at a moments notice, just manipulating my feelings enough so that I would stick around and put up with all her bullshit.
So as of today I am offically single again.
Thanks so much Dr. Tara, and everone who has shared their stories. Im thanking my lucky stars that I can get out now before she ruins my life or eats my soul.
Well, twelve of the questions match my wife to the T. I have been married a year and a half, We dated for a year and a half, the hellcat started to show about two months after we got married, she was pregnant with a honeymoon baby, and I dismissed the shit as hormonal. I was warned about her, and was told to run like hell. Even her ex told me that. I thought he was just jealous. He was always talked about as an abuser, I believed her. Then one day she accused me of being like him!!! And then it all started to click. Now we have a baby together, and she has threatened to call the cops twice, I said ok and called them first. Some days are better than others, but as a whole it is getting worse. Im willing to spend the money to fight her in court, and she knows it. And that keeps her at bay, for now. The truth is we could go on like this for years… But how long till your soul starts to die? Are the kids ( step and mine ) really better served by staying together? Or is that just the crap the clergy tell you? Why was I so willing to over look the problems before? Is it best to stay, till it gets worse?
That’s part of “the game”: I too was being told all those stories of how aweful her last boyfriend was in the first weeks of the relationship. She created a “foly a deux” where it would be us (me being “the good guy”) against him on an abstract level. Mind you, we came together only two weeks after she broke up with him, so there was still some stuff to settle.
And then, about 2,5 years later? She insults me, speaks to me in a tone I’ve never heard before from her (but would get so accustomed to in the later years), and when I called her out on it, she said “that’s what “ex-boyfriend” said to me once, too! You two should get together” or sth along the lines. Making me feel guilty and ashamed of behaving like her Ex, who be both decided upon was an ass during our honeym… brainwashing-phase…
I answered yes to most of the questions. My issue is that I have stayed just for the great sex. But the whole thing is making me sick. I can not even see my daughters.
Broke up with my now ex after 7 years. I voluntarily enrolled in an anger management class because she was telling anybody that would listen to her that I have been abusing her. Fact is, she would attack me verbally and after having enough of it I would retaliate. My counselor refuses to assign blame and tells me I need to work on not getting angry about being attacked. My self esteem is too high to lie down and allow her to walk all over me. What I really want to know is: is there such a thing as a co-abusive relationship? Seems to me that “abuse” is a one way street. You have an abuser and a victim. If both parties are engaging in abusive behavior, it is not abuse, it is a fight. All fighting is abusive by nature, but it is not abuse. I really need to get this sorted out for myself before I can commit to believing what this counselor is trying to sell me. Seems like he is setting me up to be a victim.
Hi John T,
The majority of relationships in which there’s violence are bi-directional and, according to research, the majority of violence in bi-directionally abusive relationships is initiated by women.
When you write that you retaliate to your partner’s verbal abuse, what do you mean? Do you say nasty things back or do you hit her? It’s natural to want to defend yourself, but please don’t sink down to your partner’s level.
Becoming angry when attacked is a natural response. If you anger is managed respectfully and you use it draw healthy boundaries, it shouldn’t be a problem. From what you’ve written, your wife seems to be in need of treatment for the verbal abuse she initiates Why isn’t your wife getting treatment to stop attacking you? You have every right to feel angry for being verbally attacked, however, and I don’t know how you respond to your wife, you can become angry without also becoming abusive. That may be what your wife wants — to provoke you into anger and becoming abusive so she can portray herself as the victim.
Best,
Dr Tara
I answered yes to 10 of them. It’s funny just now my kids where playing wit play dough on the carpet so I yelled at the kids because it was every where. Now she’s mad because she believes the carpet doesn’t need to be clean because we have kids. It seems like she just wants to find reasons to get mad at me.
If you’d just ignored the situation, she’d likely have been mad at you for letting them mess up the carpet.
It’s lose-lose.
Okay, this may be a little different. We met at work, late one night chatting in the office she burst into tears and told me how her ex of 14 years had broken up with her but given no reason and she thought it was because of a mental break down due to work pressure as he was a civil engineer on a big project. I had to move cities and she offered me a place to stay while I got things together. I realized immediately that she had no money, so bought her some expensive appliances in lieu of rent. I come from a single parent family and have always been looking out for my mom and younger sibling and as such have a bit of a saviour complex. She called me her knight on a horse. When I moved she drove with me. I thought she’d love having her space back, but she started to text and email me several times a day. Then she ended up moving to the same city and we both work for the same company. She asked me to consider moving in with her. Thank God I said no. Not sure why either, but I refused to be friends with her on Facebook or to get involved with her physically. I made a new circle of friends who all welcomed her. She noticed every single thing about me and stupidly it went straight to my ego. I am a writer too and she told me she has a thing for writers. She said she found me fun and entertaining and I let her move in with me. I started noticing she needed to treat me like a child – she is 5 years older than me – and had a sexual hold on me second to none. She knows she is a looker and uses it to effect. Then after dinner each night with a bit of wine the abuse started. She’d pick something I’d done wrong and browbeat me into an apology. She’d also get really upset about her past break ups and I would do my commitment phobic best to comfort her. At work, my colleagues noticed how she talked down to me even though we’re in similar positions. When I finally stood up to her at first she was devastated, then there was hell to pay. Repeat. Then she’s onto me about how I can’t control my temper and twists me in clever word play. Her criticism became more and more constant. When I told her I’d had enough, she broke things off. Her anger was completely out of proportion. One of my friends called it really early and said I’d had a lucky escape. Like a fool though I wrote her a letter using all my writerly skill and bought her flowers and food when she was sick. She resumes things, but this was followed by a blow up at work, where she threatened to go to my boss over my head. We work in a tough business and there’s always conflict, but she made it personal and wore me out with pointing out my faults. When I challenged her directly she got coy and accused me of being defensive. She picked a major fight with me over nothing, then the next morning couldn’t look me in the eye. We haven’t spoken in three weeks except about work issues and when I see her my only emotion is fear. I refuse to talk to her, but I think I’m addicted to her and it’s killing me. She climbed inside me and took me to pieces.
Ya…..but you know what? You can clearly see what is going on here, and that is your advantage in this crazy game. You know what you need to do. You have to fight that emotional tug that leashes you to this despair, because you know as well as the rest of us on this blog that it will be to your detriment if you don’t. You have to think with your head and not your heart. YOU MUST override your emotions. It’s more complicated than just a personal relationship for you….your job and your livelihood is at stake here also. I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but there are protestors around the country arguing that they are the 99%. If you are not familiar with this news, please Google it and educate yourself. My point is…you have a job, and you need to do what is necessary to hold on to it and get your emotional baggage and this crazy drama out of your work. YOU MUST be rational about this situation. The way things are with her right now at work are perfect. You haven’t spoken in three weeks except about work issues and you refuse to talk to her. I suggest you keep doing that. You have to be VERY CAREFUL at work in how you deal with her. DOCUMENT what transpires between the two of you, keep a diary to protect yourself just in case. For all you know, she could be plotting to get you fired, and this is not paranoia, this is reality. These types of abusive women are like undercover snipers. Read the posts from other men and the articles on this site for confirmation on this if you need to. Hey, if it were me I’d protect myself in any way possible, not only because she may be a back stabbing saboteur, but also because the job market is for shit. Why wouldn’t you want to stay one step ahead of her if you can. If she doesn’t turn out to be like that, then what do you have to lose. You can trash all this documentation years from now once you have no contact with her. You have the knowledge here if you are willing to read it….(read all these articles in this blog by scrolling up and clicking on Index). Knowlege is power. Dr. T advises in her article Sept. 29, 2011 “How to handle the covert ones” and she suggests (BIFF = Brief, Informative, Firm and Friendly) This is the demeanor you need to have with her. Be brief, don’t tell her anything she doesn’t need to know….inform her if you need to about relevant work matters that are required..be firm when necessary, don’t allow her to steam roll you at work…and try to be friendly so that you are not pigeon holed as being rude. You can’t trust her, bottom line…so be proactive and take action by protecting yourself. If you can, transfer to another unit or seek work elsewhere. I know this seems like a step back or giving in to her behavior….but you must realize that you are most likely dealing with craziness and you must get out if possible to protect yourself.
Thanks, @Irishgirl. Good advice. I am SO careful to cover my backside. Like many of us on this blog, my head is still reeling from the transformation in a matter of months from the sweet, sexy girl that shared my bed to the Medusa I have to shield my job from daily. It’s left me wishing I’d never met her and wondering why on earth she went after me with such passion and avid seduction in the first place. It’s made me seriously think of staying single for a while. At least while I put myself back together again. I really wish I could track down her exes (all three of them, and thanks to long nights in tears I know them all by name) and ask if there’s was the same experience as mine and if they stayed just for the sex or the hope that she might change.
Your welcome Sam. Keep on covering your backside, and don’t be alone with her at work if you can..make sure you have someone there as a witness. To answer your question about why she went after you with such seduction in the first place, that can probably be found in this article:
http://shrink4men.wordpress.com/2010/03/12/abusive-women-cults-brainwashing-and-deprogramming-part-i/
Sounds like you were the target of ‘The Love Bomb’. The more you read about all of this the more you will be able to understand what happened. In a way, it is healing to read these articles and the posts from other people. As far as whether or not her ex’s had the same experience, most likely they did. Alot of guys stay hoping she will change, but the abusive ones don’t change..not without serious professional help. Forget about tracking them down…move on from her and leave it all behind. Here’s an article to read as to what Dr. T suggests you do after a breakup with one of these women:
http://shrink4men.wordpress.com/2009/08/14/10-things-you-need-to-do-after-breaking-up-with-an-emotionally-abusive-woman/
@Irishgirl, have you been through this before? Man, it feels like the loneliest place in the world. I found out this weekend she’s starting to turn my friends against me. She’s going out of her way to court my closest friends (she doesn’t really have any of her own, she made friends with my friends) who are also colleagues and she’s so good at making people believe her lies. I shudder to think what she’s telling them, but it’s obviously working. I remember some of the things she told me about other people and how goddamn gullible I was in believing them. At least one friend who’s definitely on my side commented on how drastic the switch is between how much she seemed to love me and be in love with me (even deliberate public displays of affection in the office, leaving nobody in uncertain terms how much she was into me) and now hatred as if I’m the devil incarnate. I opened my heart, my bed, my home to her. Bailed her out several times financially. She introduced me to her family and they seemed to think the world of me. What will stop her? Having my balls in a glass vial above her bed? A knife through my heart? I’m seeing your point about not being alone with her more and more. I had no choice in a meeting yesterday, and suddenly realised that I’m actually a hell of a lot more intelligent, creative and charming than she is (she’s brought me to this low level of having a high school contest). And I think like all bullies that she’s afraid of me on some level.
And that she’s taken aback that I’m not running to her door with my usual gift and apology. All I want to say is: “let me go, don’t hate me”. But losing me doesn’t seem to be enough.
In my 30 years on this planet, I’ve never met anyone so intent on my destruction. This must be insanity. I can’t rationalize it any other way. I also had a long talk last night to a psychologist friend. Dr T, would love to know if you concur, but she’s so definitely BPD.
well, I have quite a story…I have written a few things here before when I was in the middle of it…knew the truth and didn’t act…been in a relationship with a woman for last four years…she moved in with me and it began going south…she had lost her kids in a custody battle and blamed it on dirty tricks from ex ect…said she had never been depressed…well, the last three years of living together have been hell…she has gotten worse and worse and blames every single thing on me…I started feeling guilty constantly…knowing intellectually it was BS but feeling otherwise emotionally…just not there for myself…and her outbursts made me feel like I was living in a dark room, unable to see and that someone was swinging a bat…just waiting to get hit but not knowing when….her emotions were so rapidily changing that I stopped feeling good when it went ok, as I knew it was only temporary and meaningless…she tried to commit suicide last xmas…walked out into the vermont winter and threw herself in the lake to drown herself…I called 9/11 and she spent two weeks in the nuthouse…got out and promptly threw her meds away…and we went on…
I realized that she was certainly bi-polar…and began living in fear of her moods…relieved like a small dog if she came home in a good mood…she gained more weight and I soon saw that I had an angry, bi polar beast on my hands…she ran around 300…I had no idea why I was sticking with her…I would not leave a girl for weight issues…but she became flat out mean and vicious…would say anything in a fight and the idea of limits and lines that you do not cross became meaningless for her…I stopped fucking her three years ago…and had no desire to do so any longer…yet I stayed with her…afriad she might kill herself if I called it a day and too weak to leave myself…afraid of the future and stangely needy for her abuse…
without going into everything, it came to a head a month ago…during a fight she called the police and made false allegations of physical abuse…told them I had been beating her for three years…they needed no proof at all and even seemed to know her story was bs but the system is built this way they said…I spent the night in jail…was dragged into court in leg irons the next morning and released…while in jail she filed a protection order against me and I could not return to my own home…I owned it and her name was not even on a bill…th ejudge told me abuse orders trump property law…imagine that…so I couch surfed for three weeks until I was told she had thankfully vacated the house…so I moved back in…
I still have to face the domestic abuse charge and my lawyer believes it will be dismissed…if not, I will have a misdemeanor on my record as I am told I must plea of could go to jail if we go to jury as they get nasty if you go that way…
Even with that I must tell you…having her outta my life for the last month has been wonderful…no more mood surfing…no more guilt…no more HER…to put it simply…and if I do have to plea, it seems like a small price to have my life back and that psycho beast gone…
Well check yes for about 90% of these. It makes it so much worse with kids in the mix. Im about to do my second tour in afghanistan and at least 5 or six different times ive been told ” just leave already i seriously hope you get killed over there so i dont have to deal with you” then minutes later wants to talk or cuddle and gets pissed that i want nothing to do with her. These past two years have been hell and i doubt itll last much longer when i get back. for those already divorced, is it more difficult raising your child now or easier? my biggest concern is if my wife gets custody, and im sure she will considering im military and leave alot, is that my daughter will be brought up to hate me and be as disrepectful to others as her mom is. Any ideas or suggestions?
What a cruel and terrible thing to say. You are risking your life every day to feed your family and fight for your country.You should never hear those words. Keep reading this site my friend, there is alot of useful info in these articles and from the posts of others. It wouldn’t be easier raising your child divorced but it would definitely be healthier.
After reading this I answered yes to almost all of the questions. I even moved away from Georgia My home to bring her to Maine Her comfort area and I never see my people anymore. I have been married 27 years and have constantly been walking on land mines I don’t have a clue what or why she will explode (“calling me the f-word etc..) then not 20 minutes later she gets lovey until the next mine. This morning She ripped me because she wanted me to back in a parking space and i just drove in head first. Why would it matter to the passenger what direction I park in. She has two sets of rules on for her and one for me and they both change to suit her whim.
I am getting depressed, taking stress meds and never having sex unless it is 100% her way which is not fun anymore.
At my whips end and looking for a cliff to jump from.
as far as I can see, i can answer yes to most of these.. some of these are not so obvious though.. for example.. maybe not the crazy lipstick shade and smearing on the face but in other ways yes. what i don’t understand is this: I get in heated arguments with “the wife” b/c she feels some injustice and then proceeds to verbally abuse me and unless I raise my voice and stop the “runaway train” I can’t get her to shut-up and speak rationally. Once I do that though, I’m the horrible bastard who cant take criticism and lose my temper. Anyone have similar history?
Your story is my story…exactly…These women are sadists who have an insatiable appetite for your emotional pain. I find smiling like Jack Nicholson in “The Shining” usually ends the conversation.
“Heeeeeeeeere’s Johnny!” Do it while sharpening a big axe. Then go out and chop some firewood to vent your frustration.
LOL! Then HIDE the freaking axe.
Just hide period.
Fellas, I can’t comment on those who married or had kids with their monster, but life post-break up gets better. At first I spent weeks barely functioning and weekends in my dark bedoom reading reams about these BPD’s (yes, I’m also wary of amateur diagnosis, but she seems to have all the symptoms listed above, minus the lipstick), wondering what the hell I could have done to save her and save the relationship. I remember her asking me to set “Rules of Engagement” which made me feel guilty about not setting solid boundaries and being more firm and consistent as one would be with a child. But I never imagined a woman 5 years older than me to be a child. Hindsight is indeed 50/50. She asked me to be straight with her and made me pay when I wasn’t. But then she was never straight with me and broke all the rules she made for me. I don’t know if she was abused or neglected as a child, as most BPD’s seem to be, but I can remember at the beginning hearing her sob stories of her life and her exes and swearing to myself that I would never hurt her. Now I look back on the carnage she made of my life and my emotions. It is like somebody else said, a string of barbed wire being torn out of your chest, slowly removing it one hook at a time. She told me I lived a small life, so why was she the one parasitically living off me? Making friends with my friends etc. And now she’s turning some of my friends against me. So this is my answer – living well is the best revenge. I’m channeling all the energy she sucked out of me into myself and living my own life. Like a newly released prisoner, I’m savouring every second of life and making new friends that she can’t reach. You start small, and maybe a bit petty – burning her letters, sending back her stuff and writing off all the stuff you know you’re not going to be getting back from her, eating pizza at all the places she wouldn’t go with you because she hated pizza, wiping your toothpaste mouth on handtowels – you get my drift.
Then, as you disengage hook by hook, you start to realize the good and worth in yourself and how all the criticism was merely her projected insecurity. You start re-finding your own voice, your own style (she analyzed my wardrobe – granted, she’s very stylish, but a dictator), buying new furniture just for yourself and doing all the things you’ve wanted to do, even if you’re doing them without her, because you realise you’re doing them for yourself. The more you distract yourself, the more you grow away from her. And the less you lower yourself to playing by her rules, like getting to your friends via Facebook. Unfortunately, I work with my monster and she is rude and abrasive to me and does her best to bust my balls on a continual basis, but the more I disengage and build a new life, the less important she becomes. There’s hope and you get bad days, but honestly, you realise that there’s a big world out there, full of interesting things, new people, new experiences and, eventually a new, real partner.
Good Note! It’s encouraging to hear another brother moving on and rebuilding after these nightmare estrogen fests are over.
Ugh… I think I answered yes to every question… =(
I answered yes to nearly every one of those questions. I have been with her for 5 years and we just bought a place together and I thought that would have changed things but it hasn’t. I get accused of cheating if I am stuck in traffic, and I get timed on everything I do. If something takes a couple minutes more than usuall then she is down my neck wanting to know what I have been doin. She msgs me all day wanting to know what I am doing and then when I confront her it’s always my fault. My brother died in a car accident a few months ago and she uses that to her advantage saying that I’m just like this cause my brother died. then she says I need to get help, she controls every little thing I do and if i wanna buy something I have to justify it but it’s ok for her to blow 50 bucks on another cook book she will never use. Everyday I wish it was me in the car accident instead of my brother. at least he was enjoying his life. it’s not fair.
Rob
@Rob
When you start wishing you were dead, its time to get out. I used to be that way when I was with my EX. When I come to an intersection while commuting back to and from work, I’d think about what if a car ran the light and he hit me. Then I’d be done. I really didn’t want to die, I just wanted out.
Rob
I had the same exact feeling. (Still married trying to protect my kids) I can tell you that staying in a relationship when you are going to kill yourself is obviously counter productive because you wont be around if your dead…that sounded kind of stupid now that I’m looking at it but the point is when you prefer death over being with someone it’s time to get out. The scene from Night at the Roxbury when Will Ferrell is asking his dad if it’s normal to have fantasies of having your partner die and you wish they would disappear or get kidnapped and his dad just says “Ya, that’s normal” is exactly what I went through. It gets much worse if you stay, I can tell you from experience. Good luck and the sooner you realize you’re dealing with a different species the better off you are. She is a vampire and you need to treat the situation like your life depends on it…other than that, I don’t have much of an opinion. 8)
Is it normal to not be sexually interested in your gf if all you hear is complaining about how your not effectionate enough or dont show her enough attention.
Hi BoB,
Contrary to what some women seem to think, Constant criticism and nagging is NOT an aphrodisiac. Yes, being turned off by that kind of behavior is, in my opinion, normal.
Dr T
Bob I can identify with what you’re talking about. My wife would harp on me about how I wasn’t giving her enough of this, how I was failing at that, how I didn’t make her feel safe enough, how I didn’t give her enough intimacy, etc. She’d totally beat me down then expect me to have sex with her right away. She didn’t understand why I wasn’t in the mood.
This would happen almost every night and I’d even tell her that if she had a problem she wanted to discuss that we should do it long before going to bed. At least that way I could recover from it enough to consider having sex with her. Quite frankly her behavior and the way she treated me turned me right off of her. It was like she’d set the whole thing up for failure because at her core of everything all she wanted was to have sex so she could feel good about herself again. It’s like that double bind thing I read about somewhere here.
When I’d turn her down for sex she’d roll over and pull her poor me whimper session. Sometimes she’d go sleep on the couch. Sometimes she’d wake me up in the middle of the night to tell me what a bad husband I was for not taking care of her needs. Sometimes she’d wait until morning to tell me right before I had to leave for work. She’d cry and scream if I actually left for work (to be on time).
Pretty much right after getting married the sex became all about her and how she liked it and what she wanted. She really didn’t care about how I felt or what I wanted. That was another big turn off for me. It was like she was just using me for sex to make herself feel better about herself. WTF?!? I wanted the sex to be mutual where we both cared about each other. It was frustrating because I wanted frequent sex just not with her crazy ***
Too many to count.
My wife is insane. I don’t know what to do about it. She’ll yell at me for hours on end. She’ll make up reason to argue. Some nights she’ll yell at me til 4 am, when I wake up at 5 am to get ready for work. I’m the reason she’s like this…. oh and apparently I’m always cheating on her. Even though the only place I’m allowed to go without her is to work and straight home, and if I’m one minute late coming home, the harassing phone calls and texts begin. She gets violent, blocks the door so I can’t leave, and if I do make it out the door, she’ll go sit in the car or stand behind it so i can’t back out. and she’ll kill herself if I leave. Or it means I want a divorce. Really it’s I don’t want to get arrested because she’s screaming bloody murder.
I keep having to lock my cell phone because numbers that aren’t saved in my phone are my whores. I have to keep changing my email password because she finds a way into that as well. She fought with me for days because an email I wrote to a girlfriend from before I ever met her sounded like I was more in love. Girls I’m friends with that I’ve known for 15 years are now sluts and if I talk to them it’s definitive proof I’m cheating.
I used to have friends. I used to go out and have a good time. Been married one year. She refuses to make friends.
I didn’t get to finish saying everything. I had to write that while using the toilet – she monitors everything I do.
She was like this when we first got married. She’d get violent, and I’d put her in a choke hold or pin her to the ground. Sometimes I’d put her in a choke hold without her being violent. I’ve never been abusive to women until I met her. It scares me.
She got pregnant. She was great. I thought her being crazy was over. She’d fight, but never to the level it was at before. Our baby was born 3 months premature. He was doing well, progressing as he should’ve. Then he passed away after 22 days. I took a month off work, and me and my wife had never been closer. I went back to work, and it slowly started up again. Making up reasons to fight, under 24/7 watch. I’m always cheating on her. I’m the reason our son is dead. She says the most horrible things to me for hours on end. Then she’ll start crying because she misses our son, but I don’t want to go near her because I’m to blame for all her misery, then she’ll blow up again because I wasn’t comforting her when she was crying.
She’s thrown dishes at me, clawed at me, charges at me. I’ve cut my part of the violence out aside from pushing her away, but still if the cops are ever called, I’ll end up in handcuffs…. has happened with this one. No charges thank God, but still embarrassing.
She is worse than ever. If I suggest a psychiatrist, I’m the one who needs help…..
Her mother tried to tell me she’s just grieving, but she was like this before she ever got pregnant. She’s all alone, but every moment I’m not at work I’m with her.
Oh the reason I had to give up my friends is because the single ones were single, and if I hung out with them I’d hook up with sluts. My married friends wives were all bitches and sluts, so I can’t hang out with them…
What should I do? I honestly do love my wife, I just can’t live like this. Other than divorce?
Other than the bizarre fighting moves to avoid harm, there are many many men out here in you situation, The accusations, the cell phone, the violence, the 17 personalities of which most are like Charles Manson, the flipped personality from hate to love, EVERYTHING. As someone who is married but planning his escape, it gets worse and not better. Get counsel, get allies, make a plan and plan for pain because it’s going to hurt. Good luck brother.
I answered yes to more than six. I have been with my wife for 8 years. She started to change a little after we got married but everything was still good. Now we have a 17 month old daughter and I don’t know what to do. My wife blames me for everything, money troubles, our shitty marriage etc. and etc. I bust my butt at work and home but it is not appreciated. If I attempt to work extra hours, I am avoiding the family she sais. If I don’t change a diaper I am not being invoked with my daughter. If it was for my daughter I would have left. I just don’t know what to do. I love my daughter very much and I do not want her to be affected by this. Help!
Ya, my EX got exponentially worse after we got married. There were some warning flags before, but as soon as we got hitched, it started to change. Slowly at first and then faster and you’re left wonder what was going on.
Make plans to get out before it gets any worse.
The one thing that I can say is that I stayed for my daughter and even tho it was tough I rode it out and now my daughter is 18 and we have a strong relationship for it , she loves her mother but she knows her mother is nuts , if I were going to leave i would wait until at least your daughter is old enough to leave with you , If you go and leave her there she will take your place and get the brunt of your old lady’s wrath,. This is just my opinion so take it for what its worth, Just remember your daughter is what is most important right now , do what is best for her. Im no shrink but I have lived this life and this is coming from my experience.
Same with my wife. Batshit crazy until I thought I was going crazy. Believe me, it’s just a matter of time before her contempt turns into something more serious. Get your stuff together, make a plan and document everything. Also, plug into forums like this one so you can talk to someone, Dr. T is great. Dalrock is also an excellent forum. Don’t get bitter, just get out. God bless you brother.
You guys think you got it bad I moved to Alaska and brought crazy with me, I tried walking out tonight and almost died, now I am in the spare bedroom of the apartment trying to figure out WTF to do
that dose’nt sound to good, how did you nearly die ?
Reading all the comments, makes me feel better. My situation my girlfriend has always acted bat shit crazy. She does not have very many friends either. So everything i do is always followed by attacks, not good enough, blah, blah blah. She accuses me of doing stuff I dont even do. She tells me she needs help and I try to help by cooking all the meals, making breakfast, and i mean fresh ingrediants from my garden, nothing i do is ever good enough. She made deviled eggs, i boiled the eggs for her, and she complained that i boiled them wrong and they are all falling apart!!! Bullshit…we have a four year old and she talks to her the same way, cussing and yelling. But she is sick, my fault, she is stressed my fault, I am going crazy!!!
i answsered yes to 8 of them an haven’t even been married a year…
If you see this “Z” be enough of a man to be one of those guys in the therapy office. I now it can be shameful but do it. Do it for yourself! I have 3 plus years in marriage before I got help. I am sure if I went for help years ago life would be better now. There are tool you can put in place but I am scared it waited to long and it to late for me. There may be hope for you!
my wife is the most miserable bitch imaginable. She trashes absolutely everybody all the time, has absolutely no sense of humor and is the most negative person I’ve ever met. The thing is they aren’t usually like this before you marry them. Then they pull the Jekyl and Hyde on you and stay there forever. I have a 16 yr old son and do my best to teach him about females. I think he realizes just how crazy his mother is and because of this has no intention of getting married and having some crazy person run his life. I just wish I’d been so smart.
Men have few rights and if you leave them you lose any of the few rights you have plus most of your wealth. My advise to anyone out there contemplating marriage……. run don’t walk the other way.
You’re not alone! MANY of us married guys are out here and you need to know that. Keep getting plugged in and find online forums that talk about this nightmare we’ve created in marriage 2.0. I’m trying to teach my teenage sons as well and they see the exact same thing your son sees. I WISH I would have had sights like this available 20 years ago. Keep the faith brother and God Bless.
I answered yea to nine about my ex-wife.
What got me was this
“A ‘crazy bitch’ insidiously
makes you feel like the
unstable, angry person. You
soon doubt your interpretation of
events and experiences”
I spent many years thinking I was the one with the problem and trying to figure out what was wrong with me.
It wasn’t untill I went through the divorce and met a wonderful and caring woman that I began to see that (I am the first to admit Im not perfect) it was her who was the crazy one.
I seriously wish IT WAS ME who had the problem. At least then I could do something about it! I told her this once…I think it hit home for a second or two….the back to cluster b denial.
I would say I am could answer YES to at least 8 or 9 above. You need to add physical abuse to the above, nothing bruise worthier but it has happened. WhenIf we talk about it later it was my fault it happened because if I did not act the way I did I would not have happened.
(talking 5 minutes to long in a store)
I am one of those men mentioned above that has ended up in therapy. It was taken me a few months and several session to feel I am able to speak up to my wife.
The craziest thing is my wife has no idea how messed up things are and any week now, not to the day point yet I am going to leave.
“WhenIf we talk about it later it was my fault it happened because if I did not act the way I did I would not have happened … ”
The best (basically – only –) defense for these women is a good offense. Keeping the focus on you keeps you dancing/justifying/excusing/explaining etc. etc. etc. and spares her explaining herself. Of course, this is the perfect solution for someone who is pathologically unable to take responsibility for herself.
You accept to extend the benefit-of-the-doubt and taking responsibility, thinking you’ll eventually figure it out and there will be less of this in the future.
Mine loved to offer up as bogus post-tantrum post-rage post-emotional-abuse fodder that “if only I hadn’t fill-in-the-blank” … then she wouldn’t have – add outrageous/infantile/abusive/unexplainable behavior.
Took me a long time to drop my own impulse to examine my behavior and realize I was being had – big time – by this communication-charade posing as processing for the benefit of the future relationship.
Of course she can point at your behavior and say it “made her react.” It did! No News There.
Of course you’re her trigger. “Duh!” as they say. Couples trigger each other endlessly – they’re in a relationship with each other.
Here’s the real question she’s gaming you to avoid confronting: Was her reaction a reasonable, sane, adult, measured reaction to what took place?
Once I started to see it that way, the corner started to be turned.
Try getting her to explain her insane, extreme behavior & hyper-emotional reactions instead.
Trigger is one thing – Reaction is a totally separate thing. Not all reactions are equal. Laughing off something / Being Upset a bit / Digging a knife into your leg … 3 different reactions.
Put the focus on her reaction instead. Try this on for size: “You *totally* flew off the handle there! You mind explaining to me why you over-reacted so much to such a small thing! It’s not normal.”
If you can get her to attempt to explain her behavior (good luck with that), what you’ll most likely feel as she talks is “that doesn’t make sense” or “she’s switching the subject, avoiding the issue.” Yeah!
Then you discover one thing – she actually doesn’t have a reasonable, or sane explanation for her behavior, because her behavior and reactions are distorted, deformed and out of proportion to the situation.
Other troubling factors buried in her are acting on her at the same time and exaggerating her behavior in a way you’ll never be able to anticipate, understand or control.
Thinking “your behavior” is the reason for her reactions is like sitting in a Driver’s Ed car equipped with many steering wheels, and you’re in front of only one of them.
But 2, 3, 4, x other people (several of them seriously unbalanced) are all sitting in front of their own steering wheel, and everyone is yanking on their wheel at the same time – and there’s your ride.
great way to put it dude…Im 6-7 months separated/divorced and im still replaying stuff in my head….Ive tried to accept that IT WASNT ALL ME…..I wasnt perfect but at least I wasnt fully nuts…hard to still sort things out…like how the hell could I be that stupid…17 years,11 married …holy crap……my ex finally had a concious and finally dumped me…on her terms…either she finally felt guilty or ?????I really dont know……
Thanks Zibot, As main things as I here it I forget I am not alone.
I agree with much of what you said… I have tried to do some of suggestions in the past…
I did that “______” yes, but was it really necessary for you to “punch me”
I have gone through all 3 of these
Laughing off something / Being Upset a bit / (these 2 the most)
Digging a knife into your leg …( is where I am at now and rapidly becoming depressed)
Just posting anew to get re-established. Thanks so much for maintaining this site. Do not know what I would do without it.
I answered yes to pretty much all of them. I have a degree in Psych. Why couldn’t I see this coming?
Im divorced about 6 months now and as I “recover” ,Im realizing how much I was beatdown….its amazing…how the hell did it happen?I was a good guy—even was at the end of the marriage but as I progress after divorce….holy crap!….Im amazed at how much I lost myself ……not trying to make excuses but what the hell happened?……wow…
I know Del…it’s crazy what we become. I call it the “fog of war”…take a loooonnngg time to lift.
I do not think I realized how much I lost of myself until I read what I posted to blogs several month ago. When I read that stuff I realize what I have lost. Although I have never mentioned a separation or divorce to my wife (she still thinks all is great) and I just need to change or listen to hear. I do not know if there is a second alternative than to end it.
When I think about the abuse I take I feel like a loser.
I grew up in a great house with loving parents where abuse never happened. I wonder what got me in this horrible marriage, was I naive “mabye”. “I just want myself back.”
Holy crap, I just got directed here from a relationship forum (http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?t=310921) and I am dealing with 14 of these traits. I really feel like I am going crazy with self doubt, I constantly feel like I have done wrong somehow and I feel as if I am broken inside. 🙁
I answered yes to almost all of the above. I feel as if I can’t figure out a way to properly exit this bad situation that I am in. We live together and have been in a relationship for 10 years, and as you all know, its always great at the beginning of the relationship. We have struggled after the first 3 years due to mutual insecurity, and a lot of baggage that came along with dating her. I am trying not to regret any decisions that I have made, but she is one. I am a struggling business owner and when things look like they are about to pick up, she knocks me down and makes me think pesemisticallly. My friends feel bad for me, but they also poke fun at me like I am the “battered woman” in this relationship. I wish I had the extra push to just walk away from her without any concern, but I can’t seem to muster up the courage. Most people think that abuse only goes one way, man to woman… They couldn’t be more mis informed. I am not a physically abusive person and do not get mad enough to just pick up my things and move on, instead I just stick around and take more abuse thinking that things will change and she will calm down a bit. Unfortunately that theory never happens, and I commit to more insanity. She has a crazy mental hold on me and I need to find the courage to leave her. I soon hope to have a better story, where I finally leave her and go on with my life. Sadly, I do love her, but it has become a task just to be around her. I wish you all the best of luck, please wish me the same.
hey scott,
I know exactly how you feel. I’m 50 and I was with my cluster b for the better part of 17 years. Only no contact for 2 months. My record is 14 months but I got reeled back in. I set a pattern in my life with women starting way back when i was 18. They have always been stunning. They crapped on me, and I stuck around…I TAUGHT them that they could get away with it. The one I married was fairly physically abusive and over the top emotionally abusive! Took me till age 50 to walk. I have soooo much regret and shame for not leaving immediately! God, I wish I could go back. Please think more of yourself. Have more pride. Don’t accept her crap. What you will find out, on the other side, is that no longer will her moods and comments dictate how you’ll feel about any given day. She will no longer control your reality. Let me tell ya…that’s a beautiful thing. Best of luck. We are pulling for you.
AMEN! Same exact situation. Read, learn and know that you’re not alone. Hang On!
This is but one of my problems with my current girlfriend who I tried to break up with today, and haven’t heard from since.
We have been together for two years, and I recently signed up to a gym. So I asked her to come with me. She will not come with me to gym. Fair enough. She adamantly refused (abusing me to be honest) about how I want her to do things etc.
So anyway, I invited a friend to come to gym with me instead. And the switch flipped. She quickly told me that “I do not want to go to the gym with her, I want to go to the gym with anybody”
This is a bit unfair, as I invited her first. And after she rudely declined I invited a friend. Turns out that isn’t ok. It’s go alone, or do not go at all…?
Currently dreading finishing work, and getting home. She paid for my ipod to get fixed etc for christmas, I will not be suprised if she has stolen this.
Last time I was going to leave her, she destroyed my external harddrive and threw my computer.
Good old NPD bitches.
Hey Kieron,
Stick with the gym and go alone … it’s a perfect metaphor for what needs to be strengthened internally as well.
It’s all about building your strength, taking your focus off being abused, and investing in yourself. Abusive relationships have this intensifying addictive/obsessive quality about them, like a spell, where the abusive person keeps the focus on them – through whatever means possible. Raging, accusing, tantrums … ultimately it keep us off balance and keeps the focus on them – the center of attention.
To break the spell you have to shift your focus back to your self and the gym is a great way to start that process. And, working out produces great internal body chemistry. z
Thanks Zibot.
Since I talked to her about breaking up with her. She hasn’t spoken to me at all. She is probably at home with her mother, bitching about me. She has a habit of making me look like a bad guy to her mother, which has in turn led her mother to hate me. And that’s my fault, for not making enough of an effort or something. Although everytime I go over there, after a hard day work. I feel like i’m doing all the work for the family to show my appreciation for the things they do for me. Even though i’m a guest. I’m just really stressed at the moment. I do really care for her, and I don’t want it to end. But everytime I read this I do start remembering the bad parts in our relationship instead of the positives. When i’m alone I sit around and think of the positives and I dread her coming home because I think I will take her back.
I’ll keep everyone posted. As it’s only been a few days as of yet. And knowing my partner, things could get very very dramatic.
Thanks for the support, this whole forum has shown me i’m not stuck feeling like this because im broken. Which I began feeling recently. I even started considering therapy. Its how I come across this page.
You’re a university graduate, near the top of your profession, head hunted by an overseas company, own your own home etc. and you meet one of these. She makes you fall in love with her, moves into your home and then proceeds to suck the very breath out of your lungs. She threatens your job and leaves you contemplating suicide. You spent months putting yourself together, spending a fortune on therapy and exasperating the crap out of your friends. You pull her out of your life like a strand of barbed wire, until you get to the point where she can no longer touch you or hurt you. You rebuild yourself with some good virtual slaps from your mates. Then one night at work you drink too much and beg her to come back. She rejects you in public and you spend the next three weeks of holiday beating yourself up for giving in. You’re back at work, head full of plans that don’t involve her. And you get an email welcoming you back. And she doesn’t stop mailing you. And she comes into your work area, making damn sure you see her and she’s dressed in the clothes you told her you like and all you can think of is that she’s so damn gorgeous, and your brain gives way to your d**k. You think you’re moral, rational and intellectual, but she knows the biological truth that you’re a caveman, and that, as a man you’re all about the visual, and she’s going to be the best picture you’ve seen in months. I’m putting my whole self into resisting being “hoovered” back up again. She once told me “it was fun watching you struggle”. And that’s exactly what I’m doing. It’s only the harcore threats of my friends and the memories of pain that are keeping me resisting. Good luck to any poor sucker who ever finds himself in my position.
Sam … reminds me of an old episode of Seinfeld where he’s sitting at a table playing chess with different aspects of himself, the physical, the mental … at least you have the full picture in front of you.
I remember the last time my version of sex-wrapped-demon tried to hoover me back after being off 2 months chasing others. She called me from her cell while driving by my place one night. I didn’t answer but walked outside on a hunch and there she was.
Led to a conversation sitting in her car and eventually a short but tender goodnight kiss that was clearly full of options and offers. I had a choice. I told her “Yeah, I know … Goodnight” and I got out of the car.
A couple days later at a public event, while out with a female friend, by chance she was there and I walked past her within a few feet and disregarded her as if she was a total stranger. With mentally disordered people – that’s called ‘closure.’
Not all choices are easy, especially when we’re dealing with breaking our own sexual-cocaine addiction. Good luck with that.
BTW – a point on writing. I wrote an album years back and in one very personal song, all my lyrics were in the from of ‘you’ when I really meant ‘I’ … as in “You could feel the love” instead of “I could feel the love.”
While working with a voice coach before singing the final vocals, she pointed out this to me and said it was a way of distancing myself from my emotions and feelings. And it was true. I eventually sung the song in first person form.
As I was reading your post, I kept switching the pronouns to “I” and “me” … you might find it equally interesting to experience what you wrote reading it in the first person as I did when I first rewrote all my lyrics to the more personal first-person form. There’s something about “owning it” … z
Whatever the sexual attraction, you need to learn to overcome it…as these things can lead to very dangerous situations for your life. My own story, is being with a Bi polar, living together for three years led to the worst. After a serious suicide attempt by her, I felt I couldn’t leave her. I loved her and wanted to take care of her. She only got worse and worse with her abuse…and I became more and more out of touch with myself. I thought I was stronger, but she pretty much had my ticket…the one marked “the caring one”…
and without going into the story too much, it ended in the worse possible way…she made false allegations of abuse towards me, I spent the night in jail and when let out, found she had taken control of the home I own and she had no rights to as we were not married. Due to those false allegations, I wasn’t allowed near my own home, my dog…you name it…finally, after a month she thankfully moved out…and I am still in court, facing abuse charges which will hopefully be dismissed…and in the meantime, she has taken on the victim role, telling everyone who will listen in my small town what a monster I am on facebook and in person…
What I am saying is the nightmare can spin quickly out of control with a Bi polar who refuses meds…and everything you thought impossible via her actions can change quickly…and the best thing I can say about this whole ongoing nightmare, and I mean this, is that it ended her and I…her blowing it into a million little pieces by lying to the police is what I needed, sadly, to finally make me see her for what she is…and in an odd way, I am almost glad it happened as I finally have my life back and feel entirely different about the future…
I got “hoovered” back in-repeatedly-with sex. “Sexual-cocaine addiction” Zibot…what a great way of putting it!! What I should have done, each time, is first laid down the rules as to what I would NOT accept relative to her behavior……in the days following our “human dildo” blissful re-union. Had I done that, there would have been a blow-up on the spot, and NO SEX. Instead, I took my cocaine hit and kept my mouth shut. Always on edge and not wanting to rock the boat. Putting up with her nut-bag behavior until the dumping cycle was visited upon me-once again. What a moron I was.
wow hit the nail on the head with that one. Answered yes to all but four of the questions.
Wow, after all thes years finally realize the monster I have been dealing with. Been with her over 8 years, married for almost 6. Checked off almost every box. I have been seperated for about 6 months but still dealing with her bullshit almost every day.
It came to a head this weekend when we had planned a little 2 day vacation with her and my stepdaughter and friend. I was weary of the trip from the start as I felt like it was a disaster waiting to happen. So after working a long 12 hour day on Saturday, she calls me to say Jasmine(stepdaughter) and friend really want to go on this little trip. She says that she wants to stay until Tuesday morning instead of going home on Monday night. I told her my concerns of getting them to school on Tuesday and the possible tension that could happen (have seen this happen too many times before) and why don’t we just book a room for 1 night and see how we are doing and if things are going well we could always stay for an extra night.
Well, she went ape-shit on me like she always does. Sent me a bunch of hate filled, profanity laced text messages and to forget the whole fucking thing. Over something that minor? WTF? This has happened so many times in the past, it amazes me that I have stayed around to continue to take the abuse. I have been draging my feet on this divorce for fear of what it will do to my finances, but I think I can finally say I am done!
I know this may sound small, but I resisted the urge to respond to her vitrolic hate filled texts yesterday and all of today. Plan on no contact from here on out except through a lawyer. I’m a little scared at what the future holds for me but feel so much better for finding this great website. It gives me a lot of strength to know that many others are in my shoes. I feel somewhat liberated.
I really have to thank you for this. I was in a six year relationship with a woman like this. I’ll put it to you t his way, I answered “yes” to almost every question. It feels good to know that I wasn’t the one losing my mind.
Zibot, I’ve read your response and your responses on other threads on this blog. You’re a man of wisdom and I appreciate your straight speaking. To be honest, I’m a natural born fixer, although probably not the toughest of guys, to my own shame. She arrived at a time in my life when I was particularly vulnerable. I’m quite a bit younger than her, in both years and life experience and while she was moving into my life – starting a job at the same company that I worked at and living in my home – I think she drugged me with adoration while starting to shape my reality for me. While I’m successful in my profession and popular amongst my colleagues, she found a way to undermine my confidence so that I was always second guessing myself. So damn hard to admit, but I handed her my balls on a plate. I can remember sitting in a restaurant with her, where the tables are really close, where she attacked me verbally again and again, and the two guys sitting next to us just stopped their conversation to see WTF was going on. She humiliated me in front of my friends and hers, as if it were a joke. When I called her out on it she said “I only go with what you give me”. I’m South African and when she was planning to come home with me for a visit she said “I wonder what your South African friends will think when they hear the way I speak to you”. I sit now and smack my forehead for being so stupid, so gullible and so spineless. When I finally said “You can’t speak to me that way” – and I mean just “said”, no raised voice or anything, she got terribly upset and blamed it on my “anger management issues”. I lost my spine again and we reconciled, then she went after me like a boxer on the ropes. Like imagine if you will in the same conversation, her saying to me “I bore the brunt of your anger” and then screaming “How f##king dare you!”, yet I’m still the “one with the problem” while she’s the “victim of my bad temper”. When I’d finally had enough, she broke things off. We got back together, but I stood up to her over a work matter and she dragged it out into a full on fight, threatening me with reporting me to my boss.
I spent an hour explaining myself and had thought the matter closed, but in a taxi home from the office, she got stuck into me yet again, after a glass of wine with one of her team (alcohol is always a trigger with her).
I’d had a gutful of her, and while I hadn’t had a drop myself, I just started laughing at her.
Absolute hell to pay, in front of a taxi driver, then she has me apologizing. The next morning she can’t look me in the eye, then a day after that she makes like nothing had happened. I’d had it, so I went full No Contact. She suddenly realized something was wrong and she started to panic, contacting all my friends and cozying up to them. As if she might lose her relationships with them, because I was pulling away.
I managed to completely disregard her, except for professional matters. But even then she was unbelievably rude when she had to speak to me. At two meetings in front of her juniors (she’s slightly senior to me and has a team under her) she laid into me to the point that her team member reported her to senior management for inappropriate rage towards me.
She also was one of the people consulted for my performance appraisal and used that forum to further spew venom to the point where I had to explain to my boss the whole relationship-gone-sour situation, although he said he’d already ignored a lot of what she said.
So having robbed me of my self respect (admittedly, I could have done a lot more to stop her), this crazy bitch has nearly taken my sanity and my my professional reputation. And now she’s full on after my best mate. And at work, she’ll move around where I sit, determined to get me to notice her by speaking to everyone in my vicinity in as loud a voice as possible, wearing clothes she knows I liked her in, but won’t speak to me in person She also emails me with on work mail with the sort of messages we’d shared at the beginning of the relationship. On one hand I think I should try to appease her so she doesn’t get me fired, but on the other hand, if I give in and have her in my life and my bed (yes, she is damn fine and a complete sexual aggressor), the cycle will start all over again.
Apologies about the long post, but I’m a little at my wits’ end. And yes, I am doing my best to an up about it, by gyming until I collapse.
Hey Sam … If anything I write here proves helpful to someone, I’m very happy. Any wisdom earned in this domain I paid dearly for with my peace of mind, self-esteem, and self-confidence – over many years and with several of these malignant human beings.
Dr.Tara’s postings here (and the many comments) constitute a Ph.D level education for men preparing them to enter into relationships with women, compared to the paltry ‘education’ passed on to me by family and North American culture in general:
1) [women] Sugar, and Spice and All Things Nice;
2) Once a month women can get a bit emotional;
3) You can’t live with them, you can’t live without them;
4) You can never hit a woman.
“… and there you go – have a great time!”
Reading your post reminded me of the similar emotional chaos I was sucked into during my last (and last!) relationship with one of them. Thankfully I didn’t work with her – what an extra burden to deal with.
Once at an emotional-sexual-temporal distance from her, you will look back at it all (as I do now) and just shake your head in disbelief at what you somehow allowed yourself to become involved with – the insanity and emotional aberration you tried to live a normal life with.
THE CULT OF THE BORDERLINE
In a different situation, I’d do a thesis on the comparison of indoctrination into a cult with being sucked into a relationship with these near-sociopaths (and therefore what it means to be ‘deprogrammed’ from a Borderline).
This will sound very familar … (from wikipedia’s entry on Cults)
– Mind Control:
Studies have identified a number of key steps in coercive persuasion:
People are put in physical or emotionally distressing situations;
Their problems are reduced to one simple explanation, which is repeatedly emphasized; [ie. it’s all always your fault]
They receive what seems to be unconditional love, acceptance, and attention from a charismatic leader or group;
They get a new identity based on the group;
They are subject to entrapment (isolation from friends, relatives and the mainstream culture) and their access to information is severely controlled.
– Reasons for joining (3 suggested models with the last being the most accepted):
(1) deliberative model – people are said to join cults primarily because of how they view a particular group (translation: she’s ‘hot’ and ‘into me’);
(2) psychodynamic model – individuals choose to join for fulfillment of subconscious psychological needs (translation: something about one’s past is being called – google “repetition compulsion”)
(3) thought reform model – states that people do not join because of their own psychological needs, but because of the group’s influence through forms of ‘psychological manipulation’ (*)
(*) to change the perception or behavior of others through underhanded, deceptive, or even abusive tactics. (can you say Borderline?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult
So, keep on with the deprogramming dude! …
That’s a great post for the “MGTOW forum”
Hey Nick, not familiar with MGTOW … just googled up the site and clicked around a bit. I’ll have to spend some time looking at the forums.
As far as I’m concerned, feel free to link to the post or copy it, whatever … just so long as you keep the context and source … ie that it was a posted comment on Shrink4Men … off Dr T’s ‘Is She A Crazy Bitch’ post.
Leave a link here if you do post something. Cheers!
Thanks Zibot. I’m done. I just can’t anymore. She emails me constantly at work, but when she’s near me, she reacts very weirdly to my physical presence. I’m definitely a trigger for her somehow, but I have no idea how or what is going on in that mad head of hers. She gets very uncomfortable and has to keep speaking to other people in a loud voice, or she just turns her head the other way when I’m around. I guessed it was a visceral revulsion at one point, but then why the hell keep emailing me to ask me how I am? It’s like she can’t make up her mind if she likes me or she hates me. God, I wish she’d just pick one.
And so odd, she’s really cozying up to one of my really good mates, who is also a member of my team and who I sit next to and work daily with, almost as if she’s taking my friendship with him over from me (he’s gay, so it’s not a sexual thing).
She’s also made a point of trying to talk other friends of mine against me. One one hand, I know she’s not very good at making friends herself as she always used to rely on me to become friends with my friends, but on the other, I think she might be trying to isolate me the way abusers seem inclined to do, although this might be my ego talking. And like the aforementioned cult, she’s really convincing.
Yet still she seems hell bent on entrenching herself in my life one way or another. Without actually talking to me, if she can avoid it.
I emailed her to ask her why she seemed so spooked when I said hello to her (I had to talk to the person who sits next to her at work, and greeted her by way of being polite), but of course, no reply. The silent treatment is one of her favourite weapons, and she used to tell me she’d use it on her brother and her friends.
Any ideas? Any guesses from your long experience with this type of female? I only ask out of curiosity. I don’t have the energy to keep guessing and playing her mind games.
That and the fact I don’t give a s**t anymore. She’s not worth it.
read thru alot of these posts and i can say I could of wrote most of these my self, its been a long hard 18 years but now my daughter will be 18 this summer and im getting the hell out of dodge . 18 years of living this nightmare that you all have described has been pure hell, I stayed for my daughter but now it is time to get my life back and live a little, just amazing that there are so many women out there like this , what went wrong.
You guys think you got it bad? Try crazy bitch using your 6yo daughter as the catalyst to all these crazy things. Men remember don’t let 30 seconds of fun land you with a crazy bitch for 18+ years. Ouch!
Have an Irie day, remember by not participating, you keep your own sanity.
Been there ,doing that, Notice i diidnt say done yet, filed for divorce back last feb thought it was over then let her talk me in to trying it again ,ya heard all the promises about change and all the other bs and let myself be sucked back in ,another year of my life wasted ,This time when I leave I aint looking back ,got to get some sanity in my life .
I’d say she was about 80% of about 7-8 of these examples…
It kinda hurts more knowing the goodness in her is outweighed by the badness…the goodness was perfect/special the badness hell and tormenting..
lantan, could not say better myself. (But I answer yes to 10 questions or more)
“Does she place you on a pedestal one day only to tear you down the next day?”
God, I WISH I was put on a pedestal from time to time. All I get is the knocking down.
Hi after reading this i was yes to all but one
(the lipstick) i met my wife overseas a few years ago and she moved here to be with me , we have fought since the beginning and it has only gotten worse over years. She loves me one day
And hates me the next in a screaming rage hitting me , throwing things, even trying to stab me, she blames me for everything she can , says i ruined her life… She caused problems with my friends whom i dont talk to anymore.
Same with my mother who she hates and has
Threatened to kill during fights all because shes not as good as her parents back home. She screams at me when i clean the house because its not good enough for her, ( she has her own way of doing it) i cant do anything right as she says. Im in trouble if im home late from work..im a truck driver! It happens.. Its as if im a burden on her life and ive wasted all these years of her life. Yet she says she loves me and wont leave
Then theres the suicide attempts…. When we fight and i tell her how i feel she grabs a knife everytime.. She once stabbed herself in the stomach 4 times and ended up in hospital. Its her way of beating me in a fight.. She grabs a knife and i back down and beg her to put it down appologising for everything when ive done. Nothing wrong. Im a nervous wreck i have no confidence left and am watching my life slip by. Shes always depressed hates her jobs says how much she misses home but wont leave! I can only dream one day she will because if i left her or kicked out shed take her life and id feel responsible for what happened. I still care about her but dont want her in my life anymore , she lives in my house , i dream of packing my things and dissapearing , she has ruined my life i dont know what to do i just want to go back home . Please help.
Luke,
If she’s making suicide threats, call the police. What she is doing is emotional blackmail and it’s abusive. She more than likely won’t do it, but call her bluff and call 911. Give her a consequence, such as a visit from the cops and a trip to the ER for a psych eval, if she’s going to try to manipulate you with suicide threats.
I also recommend you find a good friend or a therapist whom you trust and who understands these issues to support you as you end your relationship with her.
Dr Tara
Luke , the only one that can help you is you, I know that sucks but that is the reality that I have had to come to myself . Mine is alot like yours except for the knife thing but all the rest is pretty much there except for the “I love you” Ive never heard that out of the womens mouth except when I say it first and she would reply “love u to” but not in a sincere way and that even quit after awhile. Back to the knife events ,like the Doc says you need to call 911, not only might it save one of your lives but will also start setting up good reasons for divorce in the courts eyes, make the decision to leave and stick with it , the pain will pass and you will become your self again over time . I understand the pain you are going thru, Good luck to you in whatever you decide
Jim,
One other thing. You absolutely HAVE to find a way to record her outburst for you own protection. If you read the stories here you will find a common tactic these physcos take is to make false domestic abuse complaints against their VICTIMS. The physcho ex Girlfriend I had tried to pull that one.
I proved myself innocent but it cost me thousands of dollars in bail (yes I was arrested) lawyers, private investigators etc. Lucky for me at the time she claimed I did this I was over 200 mi away playing a gig with my band in front of a LOT if people.
Still I had to cover everything because I was not prepared for this. If you use some sort of a hidden recording device (& now thanks to digital technology they make one that you can put in your pocket. It looks like a pen) you can avoid all of this. Just show it to the police. You can also use that when they show up & she denies every making such a threat.
But call the police you MUST. Just PLEASE protect yourself
Ron.
Luke, I can only tell you my own story as it is abit similar…my gf too tried a very serious suicide attept and I stayed out of guilt…she just got wors and worse, blaming me for everything…even her suicide attempt…she became a complete psychological abuser…and when I tired to go with that and deal she finally made up false charges of abuse against me…it has been a nightmare…and I NEVER thought she could pull such a think…but eventually, your will do the same…I am telling you, trust me, make her leave NOW…it is the only way with these sorts of personalities. and altho I am still facing the fake abuse charges, I am actually glad it happened in an odd way…for it finally put the nail into our coffin…something that should have been done years ago…Don’t be me Luke…get out now…
Sadly I answered yes to 11 of them, about my ex girlfriend. She left me for other guys like 5 times in 6 years, and it was always “my fault for not trying hard enough to keep her from leaving”.
Gosh, i was even tricked into giving her permission to fuck one of them. She asked me what would my reaction be if she slept one night with someone else. I said that as long as it was “by accident”, while being drunk or something, it would understand it and not get terribly upset with her. When that happened soon after i had no right to complain.
Apart from an almost non-existant sex life, continuous fights over absolutely nonsensical stuff, some hypochondria related problems, a need to always be the center of attention, and a special ability to make me feel like a fool, it was not that bad :(.
I´m think that she´s not like this on purpose, since when faced with it she usually bursts into tears. However i´m not sure this isn´t part of the play.
I pity the poor soul who falls for her. Thank god, i´m young and i´ve learned A LOT from this experience.
jose…look at what is going on…you are giving permission to sleep with another man…my god, think about that…and the hypochondria is very important…most of these women are incredibly hypochondriac…why? because it is self focused…self focused right down to the body…this is dangerous stuff…and good for you getting away…stay away!
I have just turned 30, and am finally wrapping my head around the fact that my partner of over 8 years is BPD.
I have been left with large parts of me destroyed, and i am unsure how much of it will ever heal. She just broke it off with me ( for the millionth time) about a week ago. I am only now realising that although it still hurts and part of me misses the good times we shared, prehaps this is not only for the best, but should have been done years ago.
She fits all the traits. Major ones with her were – instant mood changes over absolutely nothing, twisting words and the truth to suit her, denial of her own actions, would never accept blame, would never say sorry, would complain about things but never make an effort to resolve them, blame everyone else for everything, use sex as a weapon against me, say that things she does are my fault, prank call my work and my mobile, accuse me of things that are just ridiculous, talk about wanting to commit suicide, thinks that everyones against her, smokes pot and cigarettes heavily, is on anti depressants, the list goes on……
There were only ever 2 moods she was in. Having a nice cup of tea….or…slamming the fist down on the nuclear launch button, and you never ever knew which one you were going to come home to. I had to think so very hard about responses to questions, even what i said in general conversation to make sure i didnt trigger an angry outburst. This in turn made conversations a warzone waiting to happen, with landmines everywhere. One slip-up and next thing you know theres bullets and shrapnel flying everywhere.
I am not perfect, and possibly have some co-dependant issues, meaning i did everything i could to try make her happy, thinking if i did this, she in turn would repay the favour. I showered her in roses, gifts and poems and went out of my way to show her i loved her and that she was special. Despite this, she constantly asked me to LIST all the reasons why i loved her. But it was never enough. I gave up my own happiness to try make her happy, but alas, there was always something else to complain about. She thrived on stress and chaos, and i found it so mentally draining. I barely could enjoy the brief moments between, because i always knew another storm was on the horizon, and could possibly turn into a cyclone if condtions were right.
When we argued, i tried to be passive, and reach a solution. She had only one goal…TO WIN…at any cost. What started with me trying to explain how her innapropriate behaviour was hurting me, was soon turned around on me, that i caused it, just like that other time, and that time when i forgot to hang out the washing, and then how back in 2002 i never gave her that lift when my car was broke down. Theres no use trying to argue with someone like this, because as soon as you have a logical response to the last out burst, its to late, she’s already moved onto another topic, leaving you with no chance to reply. She was like a school of arguement fish, darting here and there, desperately trying to escape a truth shark.
In all seriousness, though, i feel i am very damaged, and still dont know if maybe i am crazy. I dont think i am, but then again, i put up with and went back to someone who treated me like dirt, like i was the enemy, when i all iwanted was my friend and lover back, to resolve things. I was even the one that approached her and said i want us to work, i want us to go to counselling because i want a healthy relationship with you. I always though that if i tried harder, i could make it work. But it is simply not the case, and it is hard to learn that love does not conquer all.
Now i am left with so much guilt and sorrow. Angry at myself, and dissapointed in her. I spent 8 years of my life desperately trying to make things work with someone that sucked the life out of me. I was stupid to think that she would change, and things would get better. Yes, i still care for her greatly, and she is always stuck in my head, even though i know she is toxic. I wish i had grown a backbone years ago and drawn strong boundries.
The vicious circle was that she was angry that i wouldnt commit, and i wouldnt commit because she was always angry….and hence the cycle continues. She always wanted a house and children, but i wasnt ready to commit 100% when she could turn into such a demon at the flip of a coin. She even tried to bully me into getting a joint bank account, and threatned to break up with me if i didnt. I guess, in a way, i dodged a bullet.
I figure it is going to take me years to heal from this, and i may never get 100% right. I dont know who i am anymore, my self worth is through the floor and i am still very hurt. Trying to see the bright side of things is hard, reading this site and these posts gives me the feeling that i am not alone, and maybe its not all my fault as she said it was.
Its not your fault and you will get your life back, she has stole enough from you don’t let her continue, use the whole situation as a learning experience and move on , Ive been married to one for 18 years be glad you only did 8. Get out and meet new people , when you do and they start talking to you like a normal human being does you will start to realize that you weren’t the one with the problem ,she was.Mine pulled much of the same crap as yours did ,everything is my fault , I cant do anything right , blah blah blah ,its what they feel about themselves that they project on you to try and make themselves feel better but it doesn’t work, they are still miserable so they keep it going to try and feel better, you are her whipping boy, I know what you mean about feeling damaged and really you are but when you wrap your healthy mind around what has been really going on you will finally realize that you are the normal one and you are going to be ok.You will get your old self back, when i left mine within a few months I started felling like I was back to who I am , that great and wonderful happy go lucky guy I was years ago before 18 years of being beat up and thrown under the bus abuse that this women can achieve thru her sickness( sometimes I really wonder if it really is a disease or possession but thats for another topic) I have since got back with mine and its started all over again so I can tell you it wont never change, be glad your out and start to work on your own happiness,I am planning my next escape and will be following my own advice here real soon, ( this chit is real messy when there are kids, houses, and businesses, involved ) Good luck brother and enjoy your new life , you deserve it.
Thanks Jim,
I appreciate your advice, especially coming from someone who has endured 18 years of this crap. Until i found this website, i never heard of anyone that had to go through this crap. I thought ” maybe i expect to much, maybe i just need to suck it up, maybe this is just how life is and this is as good as it gets…..” It was horrible to think that way as you really blame yourself for being too weak.
But now reading on here about people who have put up with over 15 years of this behaviour with houses and kids, i realise not only am i not the only one, but it gets worse.
These Women can be so selfishly horrible, but seem to have alot of us under some sort of spell. My ex was very attractive and sexy, and i am sensing that it is a common theme. I also am seeing alot of “church” people are here because to abandon went against their religion. The people that were only in these horrific relationships for a year or 2 should consider themselves lucky.
Although we made alot of good memories, the bad really did outweigh the good, and it was a horrible way too spend 8 years of my life. Half of me wishes her some kind of happiness, and the other half of me hopes the next few guys stand up to her like i didnt, and kick her ass to the kerb and give her a reality check.
Thanks for the insight. Its good to know that I was right. “I’m not crazy”. Well, I felt like I was becoming crazy. But, now I know who and what I am dealing with and I feel confident, that I’m gonna put an end to her coo coo jealousy ways. A very rude awakening is exactly what she needs.
I bet this is the reason why we are not together any more. If it wasn’t for our child, she would of been exhaust from my muffler along time ago.
Don’t know who you are or if this is just a joke, but just by reading this website information, real or not I feel a lot better. Thanks.
Good looking out.
Juan(I knew I wasn’t fucking crazy) S
I think your right about the attractive sexy part , mine is model material , I think that is part of the spell that they have along with us being normal just wanting and believing in a normal healthy relationship that one should have with their spouse, I think that has been my biggest problem with the whole thing knowing how well I have treated her and how hard I have worked to give my family everything I possibly could but it never being good enough in her eyes, I know women that would kill to have the life my wife has had with me , Im not perfect but I have tried my best and that is what any of us should and can do.As far as the last comment about the guys kicking her to the curb I understand fully but one thing I have learned is you need to forgive and move on because keeping to hurt and anger in side of you is letting her win the game and keep control of you and ya I know how hard it is to forgive and not hurt but its a struggle that we must get past in order to heal. Good luck in your future,.
Wow, this is the story of my life! Looking back this describes almost every single one of my ex-girlfriends and my ex-wife! Anyone else in the same situation? Do some of us men just attract them? I’m currently in counseling and I have talked about this very subject with my counselor. I do seem to seek out women that are broken, I feel I need to fix them! This website is good for alot of men out there without answers! Like everyone else here says, if you a have a woman like this, RUN LIKE HELL!!! She will demean you, lie to you, insult you constantly, and make you to feel as if you are the crazy one!
Sam,
I’m glad you brought up the alcohol as a trigger! With my last crazy bitch (I told my counselor they were science projects), alcohol always set her spinning! Even as little as one beer! But then again,she was sneaking beer from the back of her car! I have no idea how many she really had! Imagine that…a drunk crazy bitch!
Great website!
It took me 2 years away from my ex to actually “de-program’ myself and admit that i was not the problem. She has all but 1 of the items on the list. She would get angry, yell at me, then tell me I had an anger problem. Go figure?
Nobody believes you because society is SO slanted toward emotional abuse victims only being women. Men won’t admit it because it’s not “macho”. During our “ugly” divorce she fabricated horrible lies, used the system to file false domestic violence charges, and obtained a restraining order (kicking me out of my house). They caught her in all the lies and curiously did nothing! The restraining order actually helped me to stay away from her. My sister says I had a form of Stockholm syndrome.
I checked on her prior marriage and she did the same thing to her first husband. She effectively ruined my life and his too. Because of her I lost my job, I’m hopelessly in debt (never mind tens of thousands in legal fees), and almost my sanity. Was in therapy for 2 years. My whole story is actually much worse.
been there done that brother…mine filed false abuse charges which I am still in court over…there are so many holes in her story witnesses willing to testify of her lying ect and yet the court charges on…it is ridiculous…and I have asked myself after being apart for six months now why she keeps going forward with all of this…coming to court dates, calling the cops and lying to them that I have broken the protection order when I have not and can prove it again and again…and of course it came to me…The court crap is the only remaining tie she has to me in her sick mind…so she won’t let it go…and even if I end up with a misdemeanor on my record because of basically being forced to plea rather than go to trial where you can lose and actually go to jail…even with that, there is a good side to all this happening…she is gone and I have my life back…I see what she is now…a nightmare woman.
John – just WOW! Good luck brother. God Bless you!
Exactly right with the “church” observation! My friend was a pastor who lost his church because of his abusive wife. (long story). The church condones crazy by not dealing with these abusive women, this abusive culture of man blaming and divorcing to move on to the next guy. God Bless you!
I feel your pain John. The law is so distorted now that men don’t have a chance. We are all sitting ducks for a woman to cry domestic violence. In my case, I check and the restraining order had almost exactly the same accusations as she used for her 1st husband. They follow the same pattern over and over….. It’s like having a free ticket to shoot whoever you want…. I was doomed from the moment I met her.
I was so messed up with her that I would have burned myself down for her(not literally)….good thing she didn’t actually know that!
Thanks JS…I too had the protection order put upon me and she took my house for about three weeks even tho her name is on nothing and I own it flat out…thankfully, she then left after those three weeks and I got it back…and to give those out there a rundown on how messed up the court system is I will give a few details. When I returned to the house I found she had been researching protective orders and the things to say to trigger the system on the computer search history…this in the weeks prior to her calling the cops. She told them I had been beating her up for three years even tho never a single doctor visit, mark on her, anything. She also told a neighbor, a female, that she had lied to the police and laughed about it. My lawyer brought a expert witness into testify…this was a guy who had set up my state’s domestic violence program…he told the judge that there was no reality to her charges…that he had read thru the entire files, that only about 21 percent of abuse charges are actually true and had the studies to prove it, that this case definitely was one of false charges ect ect…that the details of the situation she gave made it impossible that she was in any danger whatsoever…at which point the judge shifted gears and said “fine, there was no “reality” but to him the only thing that matters is if she “believed” she was in danger…” …at which point I requested to submit her mental records, proof that she had spent time in the mental hospital ect ect and had deep problems…the judge said he would consider none of that…basically the judge said that the ONLY thing that matters is if she says she believed she was in danger…no other proof is needed…now the DA is offering a misdemeanor with 5 years probation…all this for a guy like myself who has never even gotten a speeding ticket! I refused the 5 year deal. My lawyer says going to jury is very risky as juries are strange…they might end up having sympathy for her via her mental problems ect ect…and then the court would get punitive for fighting it and give me jail time…altho my lawyer did say our appeal would most likely go to the state supreme court …meanwhile, court keeps going on and on, hearing after hearing…I have been six times now and each time she shows up with female friends in tow to watch the festivities…
“basically the judge said that the ONLY thing that matters is if she says she believed she was in danger”
I wish I was a lawyer sometimes – it seems to me the judge unintentionally exonerated you. What he said essentially was your behavior is not on trial, it is her perception that is on trail.
Assuming your behavior is demonstrated to be not out of the ordinary given the situations you were in, and is nothing more than what would be expected of a normal, sane person, conforming to societal norms of behavior … what more can be asked of you?
You’re not Freud, or Marsha Linehan, or a psychiatrist. Reasonable, normal behavior aside then, what are you being tried and punished for?
The judge states it is all about ‘her perception’ … the onus then becomes proving her perceptions meet the same standards of normality and sanity that your behavior was presumably held to.
According to this judge, if your Ex-Nutjob passes a neighbor in the hallway who says ‘good morning’ to her, your Ex-Nutjob can have this judge lock up the neighbor if she claims she felt in danger from this person, without any examination of her sanity to bring that claim. Clearly an untenable position and yet exactly what the judge extols.
Claiming the whole case rests on the psychological perceptions of the woman, and then refusing to examine the underlying psychology and sanity upon which these perceptions are formed, reduces the judge to sitting on a Kangaroo Court – your behavior is irrelevant, it’s all about your Ex’s perceptions, her competence in drawing these perceptions cannot be questioned.
Exactly where is your lawyer supposed to get any traction for your defense if the judge removes the road under your feet? A stunning failure on the court’s part.
True enough…but this is the state of our court system, which is I suppose why my lawyer told me if I lost at Jury trial it would surely go to the state supreme court…the judge actually stated on record “reality does not matter”…can you imagine this in any sort of other case? Let’s say I was being accused of bank robbery…and yet the bank hadn’t been robbed…the crazy teller told the police I robbed their bank…but no money is gone, no robbery occurred…that I have proof that I was not even in the bank…and the judge said it all came down to the teller’s feelings and perception…but, quite honestly, this is the state of our courts when it comes to domestic abuse charges…and I never would have believed it if I were not going thru it…
The same goes for protection orders…they issue these things on a woman’s word with no evidence…and you can lose your house, you can lose everything…with no jury, no recourse…it can take years fighting those things from what I have heard and read…
What is going on is the court is feeding these sick womens’ illnesses…period…they go along with it wholeheartedly…
Zibot…if you go read the statutes via domestic violence…in pretty much every state…what they have written into law is this: “or if the victim felt in imminent danger”…they always put this after a semicolon of actual abuse occurring…flatly said, a victim feeling as-if she were in danger is the same as actual abuse…legally, this has so many loopholes you can, as you pointed out, drive a truck full of NPD’s thru it…yet courts in this nation are acting on those guidelines…and they always prey upon fear of jail…to get you to plea…I appreciate your response…thanks…John
Hey John …
I thank God when I navigated out of a marriage in NH, to what I suspect was a garden-variety low-voltage BPD/NPD’d ex pushing for divorce, she never stooped to the level of false accusations of DV. So, I never had to deal with this.
Honestly, after getting to the point of divorcing one of these deranged creatures, the mental burden of dealing with a legal system equally deranged is impossible for me to imagine. It would turn a good man.
It’s one thing to respect a woman’s right to act on the perception of ‘imminent danger’ – it’s another however to legislate the rubber stamping of ‘perception’ with unquestioned veracity, turning a blind eye to evidence of mental instability and other motives, while singing with one’s hands on one’s ears and feeling good about one’s self for the great job they’re doing.
That’s simply disgusting and defines the system by the self-righteous ineptitude of individuals.
I wish you the best getting through it and hope you have the moral support of good friends around you – who live in this reality! Take extra care of your self – it will be over and in the past one day. z
thanks Zibot…no, don’t have much support…but surely I will get thru it…live in the state next to you…guess which one via liberalism and these stupid laws…anyhow, my one salve is she is gone…and that means a heluva lot to me…far more than this court system…thanks tho for support!
I have a wife like this, it is just embarrassing. Now she has started to put me down in front of my friends and when I tell her it is out of order she says I shouldn;t be so sensitive and learn to take a joke. Yet if I do the same she absolutely BLASTS me when I get home.
I had a good set of friends I used to regularly hang out with and they were always polite to her. But she started turning me against them for instance, one of them gave her an evil look once. Also one a couple of them forgot to reply to one of her emails and since then she absolutely HATES them.
SHe is always saying I am useless even though I earn a good wage, travel 2 hours each way to work to pay our mortgage and because she is at home she says I have taken away her independence and ruined her life. The reason she stopped working is because she used to work for her brothers business and they had a massive argument so she just walked out. I said I would support her which I did and helped her set up a business to run on her own. I may not be the most gifted when it comes to DIY yet EVERY weekend there is some major building project to do on the house and she is CONSTANTLY criticising me saying I am usless/lazy etc. We have been married 18 months and she cant conceive but I am not bothered now as I am getting the feeling it might not be good to have kids with this woman!
Get out now , it wont get any better, ive been with mine 18 years so i can tell you it only gets worse, no kids to hold you there, RUN!!!
I’m having a difficult time with no contact! She keeps calling with stupid excuses to try to get me to come see her. I tell her no, I’m not coming to help her, so she calls me back and tells me she’s going for a motorcyle ride wih some guy. She would never get on the back of my motorcycle wih me! She definitley knows how to hurt someone! I’m still finding it very difficult at times! I have MDD (major depressive disorder) this is extremely hard for me! I feel like I’m still under her spell! Why? I know she’s a nut-case! please give me some coping advice! Someone, anyone???
Mike mine wouldnt ride on my bike either but she said she would ride with sombody else if she had the chance , she is just trying to hurt you, I would look at it this way , be glad she is moving on then soon she will not contact you , also get out and meet other women ,dont stop at just one go meet them talk to them take them out to diner and you will forget about your ex , im not saying sleep with them just find some companionship to help you get thru , the more you meet the more you forget and it will build self esteem, thats what worked for me and has helped me alot to break “the spell”, that would be my best advice based on my situation
Mike…I don’t mean this harshly…not at all…as it took me so long to get to where I am…which is out and FREE…but there comes a time to get over fear and look at reality…my old bpd girlfriend used to say “if you don’t do what I want…you do realize there are so many men who will, who are dying to f#ck me?” …and I was finally able to say this: “tell them to stand in line with their d#cks out…have ’em going around the corner waiting…line em up…I don’t care…”
My point is that they will try anything to demean you to get their way…they make out of order children look simple…they will try ANYTHING…so grow a set and tell them to just go hop on that bike with some other guy…tell her to go riding with an entire gang of motorcycle guys for all you care…and cut off ALL contact…then send the mofo a condolence card a few months after he is into the war…I am serious…
It hasn’t been spoken about on this site or in many places, but my personal feeling, and I did my PhD on Freud and still have failed hugely and in so many ways even with some so called knowledge is that most of us men here most likely had very odd relationships with our own Mothers…I will only speak for myself…but my Mom was a pretty bad one…not abusive, but incredibly self absorbed…and I found myself from a young age doing my best to please her…to get her love…most men who fall for BPD or whatever the diagnosis is given in this spectrum of narcissism are very moral, try to do the right thing, are overly caring…we try to take care of those we love…and the sad thing is it leaves us incredibly vulnerable to these ill women…who have their own f#cked up things they are trying to replay…and they will do so by hook or by crook…and ultimately, it has nothing at all to do with us…other than our own repetitions….break that, and you break everything and move forward…good luck my friend and be hard on yourself abit…don’t listen to how you have been conditioned…ignore thyself is my rule…
OK, check this out! OMG, here comes the whole truth! Once upon a time, I was a happily married man to a pretty “normal” bi-polar woman. We were happy (she was BPD also). I had a successful career as an Indusrial Elecronics Repair Specialist for a fortune 500 Co. So what! She, was on disability for diagnosed bi-polar disorder, and had a great disability income! Things were all normal, until one morning I started waking up with severe abdominal pain. Long story short, was a major birth defect, had surgery, still have pain every morning! Now disabled. I was still sick after a failed operation, in my opinion, at the time! My brother, who was a long-time para-palegic, died 2 months after my surgery. 3 days later, my wife wants a divorve! Needless to say I was already in depression and this was like being nuked! I still have a huge fear of abandoment, but realizing to seperate when a seperation is absolutely neccessary, I accepted it, with lots of cocaine and alcohol! Which I got over by the way! I come from a long life with these kind of women! One day you are irreplacale, the next, you’re trash, satan, whatever the bitch wants to call you at the time! The abuse will never end! BUT, as us men who care, you think maybe you can somehow let them know their behavior is unacceptable and maybe they will receive…Not with one of these! I think God may have blessed me by making me not able to have children. I went through a custody battle over a child I thought was mine, turned out…NOT! Nevertheless, I raised him for 3 years thinking he was mine. When it came down to it, I lost! I hAVE not seen him since, that was 20 years ago! I hate to say I’m glad I didn’t have kids, because I love all of the children in my family. Maybe someone was looking out for me! If you are young with no children and you are with one of these women, please take my advice and RUN! Don’t look back, and don’t settle for a bitch! Yeah, they may be pretty to look at, but they will make your life hell! Move on, find out why you are attracting these women! Fix It! I’m 42, no kids and somehow still attract these women. It comes down to my need to try to fix them. (Co-dependency) I’m getting there, but I’ve wasted alot of my life! I’m glad I found this site, don’t feel quite as stupid anyway! Guys, if you are young and have no kids, get the hell out of this situation YESTERDAY!!!
I have had a professional counselor for 2 years now and still haven’t been able to undo what 20 years of abuse from these type of women has done to me! I’m not proud of it, I have other issues as well I have not mentioned, but the most devastating, is being addicted to unstable women! I guess if you were a womanizer and a don’t GAF kind of person, these women wouldn’t get to you! I just can’t be that way! I was raised with morals and values, I try not to compromise! These women are my kryptonite!!! I feel as if my time is running out to find a decent woman! Don’t know if it’s even possible! I don’t think I can ever get the bitterness out of me! These women can leave behind many life-long scars as well! Hell, I still wonder if i’m alright! My counselor assures me I am, if that means anything! lmao
I have been with my GF for almost four years. THere is a child involved, not biologically mine. But I consider myself her father. I have answered yes to more than half the questions. My girlfriend will be fine one day and then the next she “flys off the handle” she yells and fights with my over trivial issues, in front of the child. She swears at my in front of the child, some very vulger stuff. I love her, but I am seeing more and more how unhealthy this relationship is for all of us. I do not know what to do. Or how to do it.
You need to leave. Being abused in front of a child is good for neither you or the child.
Here’s what to do, first read Dr. T’s articles on this site about ending the relationship and going no-contact.
Important: DO NOT TELL HER YOU ARE PLANNING TO LEAVE.
Practical advise: Find a new place to live and then move. Don’t talk to her, if you feel the need for closure, write a good-bye letter. After that, reconnect with your friends and family and then rebuild your life.
Its hard, but you can do it. If you need more support or advise go to the forum (http://shrink4menforum.com/) and your can post and discuss your issue in greater depth.
just like to say im dyslexic so sorry for the many mistakes
I dont no where to start i have answerd yes to many of the questions and the one that shocks me to be in common with this realationship is the bottom one, the one about being a stalker, im 22 and i met my girlfreind when i was 19, the first 4 months were amazing the sex was brilliant she was stunning, i thought i hit jackpot but then all of a sudden she change, she shouts at me makes me feel so low, she say to me go to the pub with u friends and she will make me feel guilty about leaving her, she gets jelous of me because i get home early from work she makes out i done something wrong, there been time were i tried to leave her for Texting X boyfriend or my brother inappropriate messages she hit me countless times and tries to blame me, but after she knows im serious about the whole ordeal she will no stop ring me i have about 20 miss calls a day,, she leaves voice mails every time of different mood swings of her crying on one message, next saying she will kill me if i touch anyone eles, next saying she wants her stuff back, then back to deeply crying on the phone how sorry she is, but it gets worse because i don’t answer my phone or message her back she will stalk me in her lunch hour at work she will see if my car at home if it is she will shout throw the letter box and slam the door, until i open it or she will get her friends to message my friends to see where i am, she was waiting outside the gym i was at but every time i feel guilty and take her back and she says she change and has got a problem but she hasnt to this day i feel really trapped.
I remember when the day i was really excited i was getting a new van for work. i went down to the bank and draw out the money where i met one of my fiends from school who works there (my friend was a girl) i didnt really want to speak to her as i left my car running with my mate inside i just wanted to be in and out, anyways get to my girlfriend house and she ask me did i speak to her and i said yes, well as soon i said that i never seen someone go so crazy for about 2 hours we argue for till she said sorry and that she will change next day all back to her crazy ways
there so many more stories, i could go on and on.
im starting to lose friends who cant stand her and keep telling me she putting me down.
i distance my self from my family she says my mum doesn’t show her enough attention, and everytime we go to my mum she says i leave her alone but when i get there she tells me to fuck off and leave her alone ???????? cant do right from wrong my mum can see that she putting me down,
the thing is iv always got ties to her, like last time we split up we book a trip to Jamaica so i had to see to sort it out (wish i didnt) cos it never about the holiday, i just dont no how im gonna get rid of her she a phyco, the reason i came on her today becasue i woke up this morning went to work and she sent me a wonderful message, saying how much she love u unreal i replied saying love u too babe, anyways met her at her parents house soon as i got throw the door she starts shouting at me and putting me down her mum and dad can see it there defiantly something wrong.
the thing is im losing in touch with my self im sort of becoming her i have to shout, and swear to get my self understood with her i dont no what to do i got to get out of this relationship before it is too late like many of your comments have said.
thank you for the support
Argh! Tried breaking up with her or at least ending what contact we have this morning, saying it’s time to move on. I sent an email, as my physical presence seems to have a strange effect on her. It feels really cowardly to send an email, but I’ve tried to get her to talk to me and she won’t.
In fact, she’s been completely ignoring me for the past few days. I tried to greet her once or twice, but she looked right through me. Which means things are peaceful at least, but I’m done with the silent treatment and with her.
But as soon as I sent the mail, I obviously got her attention and a reply. She told me in effect that I don’t mean it, and that somehow I wrote the mail ages ago, but never meant to send it.
Holy Moses, she’s done this before and when I said “I meant every bit of it” she turned my world upside down. And as we work in the same company and she’s senior to me, that meant making my life absolute hell. And she’s got her claws into my work team mate, which makes me feel like I’ve got my back against the wall.
My apologies to the fellas here who are facing hard core lawsuits and prolonged, soul destroying custody battles. If what I’m going through is a small measure of your experiences, I wish you all strength, light and prayer. But thank you for sharing that I’m not the only one in this kind of predicament and also giving me a space to express my hurt and exasperation.
Knowing you should get out is one thing. Getting out is a whole different story.
Sam if she is senior to you at work & causes you problems because of a break up that is a violation of federal law. It falls within the sexual harrasment guidelines. You should first address this with her superior & if nothing is done there you have one hell of a lawsuit on your hands. Even her dating you is more than likely a violation of company policy & she can & should be fired because of it. Then she couldn’t bother you at work. Problem solved…..lol Well solved as far as work goes. We know they dont handle rejection very well.
Best of Luck
Ron
Hey Ron,
Much appreciate that advice, but I live in Australia, so it’s unlikely to help. My boss knows and disregarded a lot of her feedback on my performance appraisal. I don’t know that he’s got my back, so I’m really careful. And she has more influence than I do, and I hate to say it, but I think my boss is a little bit of a sucker for a pretty face. And she is a black belt in flirting and seduction. One of her juniors also spoke up to senior management on my behalf at her incessant rage against me. I also think it’s a question of my being an amateur up against a serious professional when it comes to lies and manipulation. I think what she is looking for is to see if I’m still emotionally available to her, and hopefully nothing else. I sent her a mail in reply today, laying out some terms and conditions that I know she won’t like. My best guess is that will make her feel like she still has a hold over me, but that she’ll “punish” me by not responding and telling everyone about it. At least that will keep her away from me and hopefully off my back. I’ve already been through a pretty bad smear campaign.
My only worry is that she has her claws in one of my young team mates, who is a super guy and a good friend, but a bit of a sieve when it comes to secrets or anything else for that matter. And given that he sits right next to me, will be a very effective spy for her to keep tabs on me. And she’s also pretty handy at turning people against me, including one of her team who looks at me with daggers every time I pass her in the office. And this young girl has never even said a word to me!
There was a time when her presence actually made me shake with fear and lose sleep with paranoia. But I think that’s over.
I’m actually finally reaching the indifference that I’ve been aiming for for so long.
Bingo! She hasn’t replied. Lay down some boundaries and ground rules and she’s history. Months ago, I’d think “how disrespectful”. Now I think “thank God, get out of jail free”. Every time I see her (which is way too often for my liking) or think about her, I replace her name with the word “Heroine”.
She’s still zeroing in on my friends, but hell, easy enough to make some new ones, right? And bizarrely, I think she’s now afraid of me instead of vice versa. It was my best friend’s comment: “You’re stronger than her” that got me back on track.
I’ve had to put my head down at the office to prove to my boss that everything she said about me was wrong, but in a way, I’m working so hard and so well that it’s started to give me my confidence back. And I’m also working to forgive everything she’s done to me. Forgive, not forget. Forgive, so that I can let go and move on, but not forget so that I stop what Zibot refers to as “repetition compulsion” and break the cycle.
As a female who has watched too many male friends and family members have the relationship with their children destroyed, their finances ruined and their health decline due to these ‘crazies’…get out NOW! The relationship will not get better. She will NOT change. If she gets a hint that you might be leaving she will either try to beat you to the punch or else accuse you of abuse. Just quietly leave and don’t look back. If you are married with or without children, quietly start talking with a lawyer and put some money away where she can’t find it. These people are evil.
I am 22 my girlfriend is 20 it is a terrible scary abusive emotionally distraught relationship… She is all but the lipstick one violent jealous..
Holds sex for negotiation… Blames everything on me and is flip
Floppy… One day I’m amazing the next I’m the devil without doing anything… My sanity is destroyed nd my confidence is shot everything I worry about she knows and destroys… It’s a war zone not a relationship…I don’t know how to
Get out it’s literally ruined my life
Nice to know that I am not alone. ( Misery loves company, haha ! ) My wife is sometime of borderline sociopath, and she is seeking counseling to deal with childhood issues, not our failing marriage. The only reason she hasn’t left me, coming from her, is she doesn’t have any money. I am miserable, and can’t summon the courage to leave and face the guilt of leaving her financially destitute, because we barely scrape by on my salary. Pray for me.
Your wife would probably cry foul no matter what state you leave her in. My wife was running around telling everyone I abandoned her yet I was still paying all the household bills and buying her groceries. She gave me the same story about the only reason she stayed was because she didn’t have the money to leave. They’re all mind games even though your wife probably (like mine) believes the crap that comes out of her mouth.
I got 12 of them. She’s also a pack rat and it’s supposed my fault because I want to throw things away.
I answered yes to 14 of these I love my girl more than nething in this world i don’t fight w her about bills or ne thing like that she tells me how wonderful I am but tells me she don’t want to be with me when I accidentally brake a glass washing dishes then gos on to say other stuff about how I’m not a man bc I didn’t imideatly say I’m sorry but she don’t realize it pisses me off a little bit that it got broke too I hate how she complains how the house is a mess but sum how it’s my responsibility to clean up after her and her daughter I have distanced my self from my friends she even convinced me to quit my job even tho i didn’t really like my boss I loved work now I’m scrubbing carpets in cars for 25 bucks a pop when I was making almost double that at my old job I just don’t know what to do her daughter is 4 and a half and talks back like shed 14 and my girl gets mad at me bc I say u need to smack her in the mouth she will let her say stuff like shut up n get in your face and scream at u just smack her in the mouth I would say and I get all u just want me to beat the shit out of my kid no but if her kid pees the bed she will beat her ass compleatly ass backwards I am stuck I love these girls but I feel I should go but can’t find it in my hart
I got 15. Uhooo
After taking the quiz, I can honestly answer “yes” to every question except for the red lipstick one. It feels great to know that I am not alone in my situation, but disheartening at the same time to see/hear so many suffer as I have and still currently do.
My wife and I have been together 11 years (dating 5/married 6) and things were not always so complicated. Our relationship started off very strong and we were almost inseparable, especially in regards to our living/work/school situation. We only saw each other on weekends for the first 5 years of our relationship because we attended different colleges and she was in a very time consuming and demanding undergrad and graduate degree program. We couldn’t wait to see each other, especially after we were engaged and making wedding plans, and everything seemed great. Soon we were married and we fell into our normal routines. She seemed normal for the first part of our relationship besides the occasionally outburst or tantrum, but I disregarded that as “PMS” or stress, especially given the fact that her school/course was very demanding and she has a type A personality.
I learned to live with these outbursts, even as they progressively got worse, and I would just write them off as one of her quarks or flaws, especially her pessimistic nature. But soon her mother started making excuses for her behavior, which I thought was strange given the fact that my mother-in-law and I had become my wife’s verbal and emotional punching bag. Shortly after we were married something in my wife changed, a switch was flipped or a cord clipped. Her mental stability started to rapidly decline and all her “quarks” were amplified ten fold. Soon arguments became more frequent and she appeared to start or pick fights for no apparent reason. To top things off, her self-esteem dropped to an all-time low. She became threatened by any women that she thought was prettier than she was (even ones that she had never met – i.e. movies, tv, etc.) and she criticized every aspect of her physical appearance.
Unfortunately, this behavior continued for the next several years which slowly drained the life out of me and created a rift in my personal relationships. I saw my family and friends less and not because of lack of desire, but because she bitched and complained that we were spending to much time with my family/friends. My connection with my best friend slowly diminished and barely flickers to this date. I found myself alone and severely depressed only after a year of marriage. She also became a control freak, influencing and affecting how and when we made love, what I ate, who I was friends with, where I went and how long I was gone. I soon found it was easier to give into her wants, desires, demands and conditions than to hear her constant bitching and complaining, which by the way she is the queen of. How did the women I fell in love with turn into a ill-tempered, spoiled, selfish, self-centered individual?
I just don’t understand how she thinks or how she views her life with me. Almost on a daily basis she’ll say “F*&^ my life!” as she is getting out of bed (and she’s not being funny or sarcastic – she doesn’t know how to be either of those), but what I don’t understand is what is wrong with your life?! She has a husband that loves her and will do anything and everything for her (which I do already), a great family on both sides, loving pets, a beautiful home, a functional car, a job that pays over 100K a year…..I mean come on! Why can’t you just be happy? with me? with life? You have everything, but your still a miserable bitch! And to add to this already lovely predicament I have to live with, she is changing her mind about wanting children (which we discussed before getting married). I want children, plan and simple…..and I do mean plural. She maybe wants one (several years from now) and it has to be a girl or she won’t be happy. Honestly, I don’t even know if I want her to be the mother my children anymore. You have to be selfless and caring to be a parent and I don’t know if she can come out of her own little world to be the parent that every child desires.
My life has been delayed or hindered for so long because we have been following her path that it is hard to see my life any other way. I have developed a certain level of comfort because of my wife’s newly acquired income and my overly generous in-laws (which I still believe is a bribe to stay with their daughter and not leave her) that it would be hard to leave. I deserve happiness, I deserve a wife that puts my thoughts and desires before her own on occasion. But I made a commitment before God and my family to love her through the worst of times and the best of times, through sickness (though it may be mental) and in health……..and God help me I still love her!
I hear you mate. Been married for 26 years. Kids grown and moved on. Fortunately have good relationship with them. Things changed and unhappiness settled in once the kids left the nest. Been separated now for 10 months. I put the foot down and had enough. I’ve had the anxiety and Depression, waiting to see what would happen.When I made the call to end it, WOW, no way! She went to pieces and is going out of her way to convince me she loves me, and I’m the man she wants.She has found new friends in the past couple of months and loves spending time with them. Had a holiday booked with them some time ago. At this point, I felt,(Along with agreement from friends and professionals), that if she was serious, she would put off the holiday to continue rebuilding us. Trying to convince myself that the time apart will be good? Been told following your “gut” is good indication. Guess I fight that too. And yeah, still love her……..What the hell to do?
Turn up the heat! Take a holiday yourself….you have “pole position” right now….your the lead race horse roundin the corner….if you try to get her to stick around and not take her vacation…well, your back under her control…your then the needy one. Don’t do it Mr. M. Stay on top of this thing. Grab one of your buddies and do something…maybe a trip to New York! Piss on the cost..just do it. These goofy women only respect what’s hard to hang on to. They crap all over the stable and predictable ones. FYI i’m 51 this month, and know what I’m talking about.
Mr.M, I agree with Abner. It’s time for you to focus on you and make your yourself happy. Get away, do something you enjoy. If she wanted to save your relationship she would make the effort and not go on her vacation.
Thanks for the input guys. Man do I appreciate it! Having anxiety makes it a whole lot harder to step up and take control.Good to have men that have been there and understand. Women can be hard###*** work!Getting away and doing my own thing can even be hard……Dam it!
Mr. M. I hear ya because I had to force it. She had me hiding in my house…I forced myself to go to Honolulu. I was in so much emotional pain..but lo and behold, the fog lifted while I was over there! I realized once again what a big and beautiful world this is. She called me on my cell and when I told her my location, she about shit a brick! Priceless. Ultimately, we divorced because she was an abusive nut and it was never going to work….but that day on waikiki…I regained my balls, and she knew it.
“From dwagner0402″ I think this is really quite a biast article. c’mon now… I think the lady who wrote this has some daddy issues, and really wants to be liked by men. A HEALTHY relationship requires TWO parts. two sides that both care, give input and output, and want to HELP EACHOTHER. Not bash, and make one sided excuses for failure. seriously, all this article does is encourage ignorance and listeneing to people like this, is never going to do any good, except make you feel better for an hour, or a day. … use your head people. its common sense.”
Yes dwagner0402 the relationship does takes 2 sides and that is the problem.
These people crazy woman in our lives NEVER looks at both sides and that is the problem. They are not healthy relationships, we(at least I), do not bash or blame the other side. I only blame myself.
Unless you have personal experiences shut up… You lose common sense when you are abused. After weeks, months, years of abuse you are so sunk so far into the situation you lose a since of reality.
What about or just one example… At first you suck it up as PMS, then hormones may be off for a few weeks, then stress at work. We do love these people so you let it slide at first and then you are trapped. You start to believe everything you hear from there mouth. Things build over time you have a mortgage and built a life together. At first you decided think I get help her, couple years later you blame yourself
Examples
Rage of trivial matters…. You load the dishwasher and forget on glass in the other room. You are called a failer, loser, etc. The first time you are like fine I will get that, you do. The second, third, you start to believe you are a failure because you forgot a simple task. You fixed the problem but still receive text messages, emails of stories for distrust because you forgot one glass.
Escape Goat… You have you arm around them at 6am when the alarm goes off, they hit the snooze, they get up 10 minutes later than planned. Its your fault and they hate you for.
Drama Queen… A friend places a incorrect middle initial on a wedding invite, so they send the friend a letter on proper etiquette on wedding invitations. You include 3 examples and doing it properly.
I will save everyone else from my pathetic life of examples my story.
WOW! MGTOW.COM! Read. It’ll save your freaking life. These stories are very close to the average experience of most guys. It was for me. MGTOW.COM and READ.
Sorry for double posts above, I don’t know what happened there. Nick thumbs up, on the mgtow. I tell many about shrink4men here, I know there is much wisdom and care here.
Wow, my ex-girlfriend screamed at me for not loading the dishwasher her way, after that I stop loading the dishwasher, it didn’t long for her to scream at me later that I don’t help with the dishes and she feels like a slave. I could not win?!! Now that she is gone guess what everyone? I now load the dishwasher my way and although it’s a small victory, it’s still a victory never the less!!! One more thing that has happened since she left, I loss a lot of weight, I have never looked so good before in my life and I am 47 years old!!
“The second, third, you start to believe you are a failure because you forgot a simple task.” OMG this hits home with me on so many levels. Unbelievable now, or fpr anybody else who’s never been in the situation. You really believe you are an idiot/failure because he forgot a glass, dropped something or can’t figure the kids’ new buggy out immediatley.
Reads like my story, expect I didn’t get to put my arm around her for the last 4 years of the relationship…..
Back to Abner and G19. Us guys talk about “the balls” to do things that show strength. Hate that. My balls are fine. OK. She’s controlled me, and I’ve controlled her. She’s convincing me she’ll help and look after me. Anxiety still there, and want it gone. Told her it was over, and now it seems new love is persuing because I rocked her world. Want to work at it but just have to not display neediness. If it still ends up all turning to crap, Have to be able to go on, regain motivation and keep living! Hope this makes sense.
I guess “balls” is not the best way to put what I regained…better term is my “self-respect” whi
ch was prett much gone. Journal all crazy things she says and does. I know this has helped me keep her in perspective. I had a tendency to forget the bad…which was why I kept being sucked back in.
I can answer yes to 16 of the above 17. Makes me think maybe I am the crazy person because I love her and try to stay with her. 🙁
OH oh, I counted off about ten yes’s to this list. The saddest part is that after 2 years I could probably count some of them in my own behavior. The biggest one is that as soon as we make up, she is straight back to the same tricks, only the time between episodes varies. One week seems to be the limit between a huge fight.today was less than 24 hours after her begging me not to dump her. It always starts with her having an issue , and pushing it till I reach breaking point, at which it becomes my fault that we are fighting at all, and nothing I say will be heard or acknowledged.
I honestly feel like my head is going to implode. I’m terrified every girl out there is going to be like this, even though in my mind I know that none of previous relationships were anywhere near this bad. I got angry at old gf’s, and they got angry at me, but never for this long or this often, and certainly not at the scale that this is at. Previous GF’s didn’t start a world war over every little thing. I had spent years addressing all my anger issues from my teenage years to where I felt I was a calm and balanced individual, and now I have become this ball of tension and anger and negativity again. How can she bring out the worst in my so well? I’ve reached the point where I’m scared to leave her but scared to stay.
I have been divorced now from a woman like this for over two years. I am now in a serious relationship with my gf and we live together. I have two kids that I see all the time. The horrible thing is that my GF is 7 yeses She is physically abusive and flies off the handle with everything. My family is still close to my ex and has her come to birthdays and holidays( Especially since we have kids) and my Gf cant handle it. she goes into fits of rage to me all the time wants to compromise but will not follow up on the compromise. Blames me for yelling after she has been yelling and cursing at me for 15 minutes because I raised my voice. I love her but I am actually making my self sick due to the stress.She has some great qualities and a good heart most of the time but she snaps out of the blue and all hell breaks loose. I actually pray for death so I don’t have to deal with it anymore. I dont know what to do. I know we should break up. I am 40 and she is 25 and i am her first serious boyfriend and also the one who took away her virginity.I find myself looking forward to seeing her everyday when i get home from work but when i see her i am not happy, cause she always looks angry.
My 15 yr old daughter loves her as a person but thinks that she is not right for me. My daughter says that I show her so much affection when we are together (my GF) but it seems like one minute she likes it the next minute im annoying her. I believe that my GF suffers from a mild case of Bi Polar disorder but when I mentioned that she flipped out and started throwing things at me. I know I should not be in this relationship but its hard when you have a one bedroom apartment together. PLEASE HELP
Connor some food for thought. By staying with this abusive woman (& the is NO OTHER word for it. She IS an abuser) you are teaching your 15yr old daughter that this is how you treat the man in your life. Kids have a mind like a sponge & a mouth like a parrot.
Read the many post here & you will see that you are not alone. If she throws things that is physical ABUSE. Say that to yourself 1000 times. I am being abused. Further my daughter is learing how to be an abuser. After doing that how attractive does she look now? Best of luck. You are in goofd company here
Ron
I answered yes to all…except one….thank you for writing this…I feel a weight lifted and have an idea of what I need to do…..
So wow… did I land on the ultimate jackpot of a website! I have to say, up to this point, I was still on the fence about whether or not my recent breakup with my ex was a smart move or not. And I must say… boy was I right! Thank heavens I never actually ended up getting married. 🙂 My post will be rather long-winded I’m afraid. But I feel it is excellent information to young guys dating women with characteristics as mentioned in the good Doctor’s post.
Just to give you guys some backstory into what I experienced as a man, for nearly 22 years of my life (up until the beginning of January 2011), I never had a girlfriend and was kind of willing to do anything to get my first girlfriend. Well, around December 2010, I started getting all chatty with this one girl on Facebook who used to attend my alma mater in Ohio. At that point, she had since moved to Seattle Washington to take up a job as a programmer at Boeing shortly after she had graduated. Not going to lie, but she was pretty well off and had gotten far luckier than most new college grads in this rather crappy economy. Of course, she has been an extremely privileged young lady all of her life, with a mom and dad that satisfied her every whim. She got to travel all over the world, since her dad was a upper level executive big-wig at many companies, got far more opportunities as a kid, and just pretty much had anything she could desire. Heck, I later found out that she was fluent in Italian and that she was part of a royal family based in Italy (of course their ruling class died out a few hundred years ago and they no longer own the estate they once had). Still, this is all pretty interesting stuff for a young lady!
When I first met her and we started talking, I really thought we clicked and we were meant for something more. We were both the nerdy type, always talking and discussing computers and technology. She was also very religious, and got me back into my prayer life during the time we dated. I got to say, for the first few months or so, it was sheer bliss. I didn’t care that the relationship was long distance (I was from the Pittsburgh area, so it was a considerable endeavor to fly out to see her, or visa-versa) and even my mother at first had a high opinion of her for a while, going so far as to say she could have been “hand picked” for me.
Well… after a few months rolled by, that’s when the shit started hitting the fan. Around this time, I found out a part of her that, although she masked it well for the most part, was starting to become more and more apparent as the relationship marched on. She revealed that she had some strange form of clinical depression, and she was hyped up on some pretty nasty medications (Zoloft and Welbutrin XL). With that knowledge in hand, I, being the fixer that I am as a man, insisted that she get off the medication and try going cold turkey. Although she was quite reluctant to do so at first, she eventually agreed to try it. I honestly thought I was helping her by injecting myself into the equation, thus canceling out the effects brought about by the drugs/ Of course, she should have consulted her psychiatrist regarding her dosage changes, because when she deviated even by the slightest, things could get very ugly.
I was at work one evening crunching for a project that was due to be completed by the next business day when I got a Skype message from her saying she wanted to talk. Well needless to say, she was in an incredibly foul mood over getting a $1.30 library fine as well as the traffic coming home from work. She was insufferable. I ended up having to put my work on hold to put her on a video call so that I could talk her down from her raging rants. She got rather pissy with me if I even alluded to something that was not “helping her cause”, which was pretty much anything and everything I said. It took me all of two hours to finally calm her down and get her to sleep, by then I was bushed and I had a boss who wasn’t too happy with the fact that I was way behind on my project.
During the times that she would be down in Pittsburgh to visit me, sometimes for as long as a week or more, she and I would usually just get all super cuddly, engage in passionate kissing and caressing, and other stuff that I am not really willing to discuss here on this public forum. At one point during one of her long visits to the area, we were on a walk to the park and she turned to me and said, “I’m getting kinda tired of you right now. I think I will need to hide out somewhere and read for a bit.” Of course, I did realize that she was more of an introvert by nature, so I complied with her request without making a scene out of it. However, the very next evening, I was looking at some old family photos I had not seen in ages, and I asked my girlfriend at the time to wait outside by the campfire for a few minutes while I finished up. Once I get outside, lo and behold, she is all pouty and miffed that I denied her ten whole minutes of time to be with her while I was inside. She complained and pouted and it got rather annoying. She reeked of that sense of entitlement that, when she wanted something and if she was ever refused, she would make me pay for my transgression through belligerence.
Phew! Hang on readers, if you have gotten this far, I just want to say I’m almost done here :P. Anyway, there were also times where I was a bit embarrassed to be with her in public, particularly in church. Here she would start using tons of body language to show everyone else how holy she was, and acting rather conceited and sanctimonious. After a bit of this, I started to wonder if she was just insecure and wanted to let herself out in order to be validated by everyone, of if it was just something she felt was OK to do.
Needless to say, she also pushed marriage on me like nobody’s business. She kept mentioning wedding rings and gowns, how her dad was going to go lavish on our future wedding, inviting the whole royal family and making a big stink out of it. Meanwhile, here I am starting to legitimately worry about it all. I was starting to become turned off to her attitude and controlling behavior.
Finally, after more than eight months with her (a record for my ex, considering all of her previous boyfriends never could last her more than three months on average), I decided to put my foot down and call it off. And oh boy, did she let the cat out of the bag. I have never seen a woman go so ballistic before. She was not happy and she clearly was hoping she could pull the sheep’s wool over my eyes, get me married before I realized what I was doing and then start a large family (despite her mother mentioning how she was not really all that good with children). Well thank God I finally dumped her butt. After the initial phases of withdrawal and pining I did, I finally realized my freedom as a man, started taking up hobbies with new free time normally spent either talking on the phone with the ex or constant emailing back and forth.
So…….. now to wrap this up, I will say this. Don’t even think for one minute that a clinically depressed girlfriend will bother changing for you just because you want to marry her. It’s just a ruse to get you to tie the knot, so that she can harass you and pull the strings on the relationship whenever she feels like it. Believe me… I saved myself and I am super thankful that I followed my gut on that one. She already found a new boyfriend merely a few weeks after we broke up (with a rumor that got to me that she supposedly was seeing this guy long before I called it quits with her). I wonder if he will even see the problems I saw in her? Or will he be gullible enough to fall for her wiles? Who knows, only time will tell.
TLDR: If you know what’s good for you, find yourself a woman who not only isn’t emotionally high maintenance, but isn’t depressed on top of that.
Oh as an addendum to my comment from last night, I’d also like to mention how pushy the parents were about getting me to marry their daughter, even to the point of bribing and egging me on. Usually, when the in-laws start acting like this, it’s usually a sign that they want to try and pass their daughter’s problems off to someone else so that they don’t have to deal with her. I do feel that some of my ex’s behavioral problems were as a result of her super cushy upbringing, which more or less spoiled her rotten.
Surprisingly, when I first started dating her, I actually found her to prefer the simple life and save money instead of blowing it on fancy purses and designer clothing. Despite her frugal habits though, that didn’t stop her from being emotionally high maintenance and burning me out in the long run.
Moral of the story kids, when your gut starts telling you something about this girl that you don’t like or she starts putting up tons of emotional red flags, seriously don’t consider rushing into a lifelong commitment with her unless you know what you’re doing. There are *very* few men in the world that can put up with emotionally draining women like my ex. Even my ex’s father, who’s wife happens to also suffer from clinical depression, tends to go out on extended business trips whenever he can, just so that he can get his space from her. Once, he even plain walked out of a Christmas party, rented a hotel, and stayed away from his wife for several days, because she couldn’t just chill the heck out. Yeah… I wish I had picked up on that behavior a lot sooner. I could have saved myself the heartache and scarring I picked up.
So yeah, final post I swear…
Pro-tip: If you want an idea about how your girlfriend is going to act in the married life and as the years roll on, just take a look at her mother and how she acts. That should be pretty revealing, especially in the case of hereditary depression.
Wow–I can answer yes to almost all of the descriptive characteristics–what’s more my marriage of 23 years was a text book description of this! There was nothing I could do to make things better–and by God I tried! lucky I got out without a heart attack–just barely–now out and I have my health back–by staying I would not be writing this today!
I’m not even really in a “relationship” with the BPD girl I see! But the danger is real, as she is so alluring and seductive that she is irresistible, but the volcanic eruptions of verbal/emotional abuse are pretty bad. It is like trying to give up some kind of powerful drug.
Ok. I scored yes on 14
Thank goodness I filed for divorce 3weeks ago after 14months of marriage!
I have to say, I found this site because I did a search for “my wife is a complete bitch, what do I do?”. The page that came up was astonishing! I cannot believe it! I am not the only one. I feel like crying right now, partially from relief, and partially because I have two boys with her, and I do not want to abandon them to her craziness…
She has few friends, and none that are local “girlfriends”. She has all the marks but the lipstick, and the sex issues, though they seem to be starting now.
I am so relieved to know that it’s not JUST me being an asshole, but that the responsibility is at least partially shared. I admit, she had an abusive childhood that I cannot get into, but still, it’s hard to deal with on a regular basis. The problem I have is that I can’t get work where we are, and I live in a state that will rape me financially if I leave. I feel so screwed. I’m sad, frustrated, and feel like I am in a corner with nowhere to go, and no one to turn to…
Stuck.
It’s hopeless for me. She has every symptom just as described. If I split she will destroy me financially and at my age (65) that would be too much to take after a lifetime of effort. It just comes down to who dies first. I try to take care of my self in hopes that I’ll have a few years of freedom from this insanity. Guys, think real, real hard about who you marry. Better yet, I’m convinced that marriage is no longer a gamble worth taking. I’m certain there must be some normal women out there but they are few and far between. I’ve always feared being alone but no longer. It even says in the bible ” it’s better to live alone in the desert than with a nagging wife”. Obviously this is nothing new.
I’ve been married 15 years to a woman I have long been convinced is borderline. I’ve read books (e.g., “Stop Walking on Eggshells,” “Sometimes I Act Crazy,” “I Love You, Don’t Hate Me”), talked with PsyDs and counselors and have researched this illness (having read the DSM IV criteria for BPD), and everything that men have shared here is real and true. In one sense it is good to know that others have experienced the same emotional-mental trauma, and that I am neither alone nor losing my mind. I am also reminded by Scripture, which says, “No temptation has seized you except what is common to man…” (1 Cor 10:13), that this trial I am enduring is not an utterly unique trial; others endure the same. I’ve often thought I was losing my mind. I turned to men for help, and the more I reached out for help, the more irate my wife would become at me. To her it was a matter of allegiance, and my turning to others for help was tantamount to treason. I reached out to pastors and men in our church; I did not go to bars. We’ve slept in different rooms for most of our marriage, and despite rarely having any relations, I have never cheated on her. But to talk to a counselor or pastor or friend or family member was, in her eyes, worse than adultery. You see, a borderline cannot stand to have the lights turned on and her secret life laid bare. Her weak self-image cannot tolerate that. I’ve endured all kinds of manipulation. My wife once came to my place of work one night and if I did not do what she wanted me to do in that moment (erase incriminating voicemails she left me), she threatened to take off her clothing and walk around my office in the nude until a coworker or the security guards came. And, do you know what? She did just that, and I caved in to her and erased the messages. I could cite hundreds of examples. I’ve been called Satan in front of the kids (her children from a prior marriage). We have a daughter together (11). I filed for divorce in December. I just could not take anymore. I would have found my own place to live but money is tight and I’m not sure of my financial future. We are in dispute over custody and I am not sure how that will play out. She is worried the court will take our daughter from us. When we’ve been to counseling, she’s played the martyr and I found the counselor siding with her. She can cause the tears to flow at will, and I warned my attorney to be weary of her tactics and to read up on BPD. He told me his job is the law and not psychology. I’ve given him a huge retainer, but I know when we step into court he will not be prepared for her ability to manipulate. I want psychological evaluations to take place but I was told I would have to pay for them since I filed for dissolution of the marriage. I have prayed for my marriage. I’ve gone to the wisest men I know: pastors, deacons, marriage counselors. The truth is, without her WANTING to change, there is no hope. Divorce is an ugly process, but I know if I stay in this marriage I will die a young man (I am 48, and my body feels like I am 70, and I’ve been to the ER multiple times with chest pains). My MD told me I will have a heart attack if I stay longer in this marriage. One of her kids (her daughter, who is 27) seems to have 7 of the 9 DSM IV criteria for BPD, while my wife has 6 of the 9. I am worried about our daughter if my wife gets custody. She will badmouth me and try to turn her heart away from me. I have begged her to return to marriage counseling with me. But she will not give it another try. She is infuriated that I would file for divorce and she cannot forgive me for that. We will be in court in a couple of months, and my lawyer is not braced for the show she will put on. She will villify me in open court, and will make me out to be a monster. I once read that if a spouse remains in a long-term relationship with a borderline, he or she will eventually lose all sense of self-identity. I reached that point two years ago. I would literally look at myself in the mirror and wonder who I was. I wondered if I was the monster she told me that I was. It brings a man perilously close to despairing of life. I know not every man here is religious or spiritual, but if you do not find your ultimate peace and comfort in Jesus Christ, then please surround yourself with good friends, with family members who love you, and if you have children, let them see that you love them and that you are a good man, no matter what they may hear from your wife. Be strong for your kids. And know that you are not losing your mind, but also know that this is a battle you cannot go through alone. I wish all you guys and your families the best in a very difficult situation.
I forgot to add, I answered yes to 12 of the questions above.
God bless you Mike! Unfortunately, most churches set men up to get screwed and ignore women’s responsibility. It was with mine. Stay in touch and keep reading brother.
I answered yes to 10 and maybe to 3 additional. It was amazing to read some of the stories of other victims. We are 20 years into marriage with 4 boys. Marriage is over. Just need to get the divorce. I am still love this woman for some reason.
I lost contact with the last of my highschool friends 15 years ago and rarely do anything with my siblings due the drama that leads up to and follows the event. I have skipped current good friends weddings for same reason. I think the worst part is it is impossible to have a conversation with this woman. If an alternate view on anything, no matter how trivial, is even hinted at, there is a huff and that conversation is over. Another bad part is I have been always been affectionate since I loved this woman. Very little affection was ever returned. The more special the event, like an anniversary for example, the less likely there would any sex that night. the whole experience feels like a bad drug addiction to me right now. I could go on and on. I just want to have a mature satisfying relationship with a sane woman…
What now I answered yes to all but the stalker question and I married her only to see the change afterwards now what do I do HELP!!!
If you don’t have kids, often the best thing to do is just get out.
wish it was that easy to go, but I’m in no position to split now
You definitely want to watch out about pregnancy. Condoms are your friend. Be 110% sure about someone you decide to start a family with … that’s ‘start’ … as in commit for many years to come, or dedicate your income to for the next 20 years of your life even if you decide to leave.
Imagine getting out of a bad relationship, it’s 5 years later, and you’re still paying 1/2 your salary to a women you feel tricked you, while you know she’s living with another guy and poisioning your child to hate you …
A mistake I think is common is to want to believe in ‘silver bullets’ … like, everything will get better and she’ll be sane and nice and normal again if we _________ (move in together, actually get married, actually buy a place together, move to a nicer place, actually have a child, buy a better car, get faster internet service, whatever) … the magic bullet that will solve all the psychological/emotional problems … file that thinking under ‘FAIL’.
I’ve seen myself get sucked into ‘silver bullet’ thinking – and it doesn’t work. I actually thought once that by moving to a better neighbourhood, the relationship problems would be solved because we lived in such a down-scale area – FAIL.
So, if you’re looking at ‘yes’ to all the above, and the changes showed up after marriage, don’t be a sucker! She played you figuring marriage was the cell door closing behind you. Consider it null and void, misrepresentation is what you got … if you’d known before, would you have said “I Do”? … I’d consider it ‘out of the box’ thinking – it’s big but, yeah, you can change your mind.
While not grounds for legal annullment unfortunately, still no shame in thinking for yourself and changing your decision (which sounds like it was based on lies she presented you with).
Definitely not easy now, but a piece of cake in comparison to when you’ve become a withered shadow of yourself in a couple of years of abuse, had children that are being exposed to their mother’s tantrums, abuse, instability …
In 6 months it will all be behind you and you’ll be looking forward, older and wiser! I wouldn’t let social pressure, peer pressure, or embarrassment stop me – The time to correct a bad decision is as soon as you realize it’s a bad decision!
If you really are with the sort of mentally disordered women we’re talking about here, this is not kids play, this is your life … seriously, keep all options on the table.
Thanks for the advise. Not to worry, kids are not on the menu she does not want, and were both over 40 so at least 1 less issue. As for the rest i am well aware that there is no magic bullet. its a day to day existence. I guess its just how long I can stand it and what to do when I cant take it any more, its a financial mess for me. She’ll actually be better off than me if we split, just the engagement ring alone will keep her for a year with little working needed its a tough road there are good days and i look forward to those but the psycho outbursts are never far behind and I know it, so its eggshell living for now, its weird I do feel bad for her she had a tough time and her family are a wonderful group of narcissists so i have some sympathy for her but still its a mental illness and i just wish i could treat it.
Thanks again
Ive been involved in my
Current relationship for a bout 2 months now but we’ve been together before.. I answered yes to seven of your questions and I was pretty sure she was a manipulative bitch before I searche the web I try to talk about our life together and I get snappy replies of Satan!! It’s just like she doesn’t care about me or our future which I know I shouldn’t want but do, the sex is just too damn good I need help but can’t afford it as she has taken my life savings to fuel her alcohol addiction and has on more than one occasion abandoned me and our eleven children for weeks of non stop drug abuse
Wow, I knew I could not be the only one dealing with this lunacy. My wife has a buch of these issues and will go from “I love you and your the best” to “Your worthless and don’t care about me or the kids and everything is your fault” I can’t even keep things she blows up about strait anymore. It is never her fault, everyone elses but not her. She has no friends or hobbies and she makes me out to be satan for doing anything with a friend or family member. The following situation is the defination of Crazy and a headlind for the type of crap I’ve dealt with for 10 years: We are sitting at our church for an awards presentation for our kids and I’m sitting by her and she says we should put the youngest between us so we do. The next day she is in crazy mode and tries to bring up me not sitting right beside her as proof that I am a bad husband who does not treat her well. I say ‘hey, it was your idea to have our kid sit between us” and she then says “I had her sit there on purpose because I don’t like you.” Crazy in a nutshell.
My wife has recently had health problems which triggered her to cut her self. While in the hospital they diagnosed her with BPD. I found this page when looking for what that means. Pretty much right on. Now she is going to be placed in a residential treatment program for 12 months that will cost me over $300,000. This will ruin us (me) financially. I told her she needs to find a free treatment center. Her mother is a meddler and blames me for all the problems. My Wife fills her in on all of our personal conversations we have that go south (ie. thoughts of divorce, if I still love her) I try to not let BPD affect my life by calling her out on her behavior and just walking away when she does the things from the article. Any advice on how to deal with a bat shit crazy mother in-law of a personality disorder wife? Also I’m 29 no children am I ruining my life by sticking around?
If you have no children/hostages with her, I would encourage you to consider getting out. Also, why are you on the hook for a $300,000 treatment facility? You didn’t break her, why are you obligated to pay to “fix” her? Do they give you an iron clad guarantee that she will get better? Will they return the money if she doesn’t? I wouldn’t pay and neither would I stay.
I feel stuck, I’m her husband and people say I need to view this like cancer treatment. No one will ever guarantee a cure. They don’t guarantee you to be full after eating at burgerking either. I don’t understand how these places stay open with that big of a price tag. I’m afraid that I will have all of this debt and still be left with a ruined life.
This is NOT like cancer treatment. Comparing a PD to a physical illness like cancer or diabetes is like comparing apples to lug nuts. Cancer doesn’t cause one to manipulate, exploit and abuse others. So what if you’re her husband. Did you cause her to be the way she is? No, you have not.
Places like that stay open because there are lots of desperate husbands and families trying to make the craziness and abusiveness stop. Have they shown you any metrics regarding outcomes? Successes? How many patients come back for another $300,000 course of treatment?
Let her do DBT outpatient. Residential can seem to be effective and an individual might appear to make progress. Then they leave the highly controlled environment of residential treatment, go back to their regular environment, have to deal with the daily stress of life and you’re right back to where you started — minus $300,000.
You don’t have to be stuck. Insist on outpatient DBT. $300,000 is an exorbitant and ridiculous sum, but one hell of a money maker for that facility.
Your case is very similar to mine. I also have the crazy mother in-law that is always trying to dump fuel on the fire and blame me for my wife’s terrible behavior. They are both BPD for sure and likely NPD too IMO and the apple did not fall far from the tree. Niether one would ever consider admitting they have issues or seek help. As young as you still are if you especially do not have kids I’d get the heck out of there. I’m 11 years older than you but only married for 11 years and have 4 kids. If I was 29 and no kids it would be an easy choice to get out if I had it to do over. My only chance of relief is my wife has talked of leaving the house by herself and leaving the kids with me. If she would leave the relationship and leave me the kids then I could move on in peace and she might have more peace as well because taking care of the kids is somthing that puts her over the edge. I know she will not be happy like she thinks she will because life is not the fairy tale she thinks it should be.
The mother in law is still a problem…. and my wife is back in the hospital. I’ve called her a few times to talk it out and make it work. She wont return the phone call… of course I’m the bad guy. Now my wife calls me and says that she has cut her mother out of her life. This most recent admission I’ve made the choice to start looking at divorce. Now I feel that my wife will have no one to go to. I love her soo much I just can’t live with this. We’ve been married for 4 years and together for 11 years. Even in the beginning of the relationship I kept telling myself that shes just having a bad day it will get better. Worse is the direction it has gone. So much time has elapsed.
I would not count on her Mother being out of her life being a long term deal unless the Mother dies. My wife has put her mother on the crap list a few times as well but in the end it is always them against me. Based on what I have read here it seems the wife will do or say most anything to get the outcome they want. Not you or anyone else is going to make them (BPD Wife) happy. If my wife says she is leaving again the only thing I’m going to say is good luck. Our household is so much more peacefull and functions so much more smoothly when she is gone working or somthing, it is not a coincidence.
Hey Chris … additional thoughts:
If the proposed residential treatment center is directly related to the diagnosis of BPD, read up more on the statistics regarding cure rates for people who go into therapy to try to cure this mental disorder.
DBT is apparently the best hope, but it’s a hope. Read also about Marsha Lineham. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marsha_linehan
If there was someplace these people could be cured in one year, I think it would be like the cure for baldness. Every guy would have a thick head of hair, and every loving spouse would be getting second mortgages to cure their loved ones in a year.
Everything I’ve read says it takes years and years of incredibly intense therapy and even then, there are no guarantees. I can’t find it right now but some where I read about what percentage still profiled positive for BPD after 3 years, 5 years, 10 years of therapy. It wasn’t encouraging.
And you had to live through all those psychologically and emotionally destructive years not knowing what the results would be.
You should also consult: http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/publications/borderline-personality-disorder/complete-index.shtml
Providing your wife can even identify the BPD behavior. Don’t forget that this is normal for her….a life long condition. Know this from my sister. Inappropriate behavior, social gaffes, over sensitivity, bouts of intense anger, paranoia….the list goes on. She will have to admit to the problem and realize that only years of hard work will help and she will still be BPD. Suicide attempts, self mutilation, and even addiction issues. Sorry….tough road. Speaking from experience and then I met a man whose ex-wife was the same so I understand.
My wife just got readdmited to inpatient from the outpatient area. The therapist said this is one of the worse cases that she has ever seen. Also said that she doesn’t look like shes trying to get better. I feel like this isn’t going anywhere good for me. I feel like if she does get a little better with treatment my life will still be just as bad because I have to deal with everything.
I’m finding out more every day about my wife’s past. Apparently this isn’t her first bout with being hospitalized for this problem. She kept this from me!! We’ve been married for 4 years and we’ve been together for 11 years. This happened when she was in high school and was hospitalized for over 6 months and apparently in college she was self injuring when we were dating. When we were dating we were always tip toeing around her bad days and I always told myself shed get better. It hasn’t gotten any better just worse in fact worse fast. I talked to her case manager today and told her we need to look at options other than her returning home because I can not take this anymore. My heart is consistently racing, I can’t control my emotions. I feel like I have been forced on a roller coaster ride where some one else decides where I get off. She just informed me that she has cut ties to her mom who has been driving a wedge between us. Of course she does this after I inform her case manager I’m done. I haven’t told her yet, every time we talk she cries and says no one loves her. This breaks my heart because I love her so much, but I think this is going to end up killing me (emotionally). I want to end this!! but when I think of her my heart breaks.
Chris, just a suggestion.
You should probably start a forum account and post there to discuss your situation.
There are more people there to talk about this with you and the forum works much better for this type of discussion than the blog.
I am just finalizing a divorce after 25 years to a woman who fits many of these criteria. I always was so confused when she turned from a caring, completely empathetic and sexually charged partner into someone who witheld sex and always told me that it was my fault. I didn’t do this or that enough and if I did she would want sex more often. In 25 years of marriage I never ever once heard an apology from her that wasn’t instantly followed by a long description of why it was still my fault anyway.
She blames me for everything and has alienated my adult children from me. Although we have been separated for three years and I am in a relationship with a wonderful woman, I still struggle with guilt and my ex still throws the phrase “you turned your back on your family” all the time. She has never ever acknowledged that I left her, not the family.
Will I ever be able to get over this guilt?
Hi Eric,
You didn’t “abandon” your family. You divorced an emotionally abusive woman – an ADULT. It’s not like you left her in a basket on the church steps. I also assume that you have had to make financial provisions for her by way of spousal support (i.e., severance pay for being a crappy wife). She ought to feel guilty, not you.
Instead of allowing your misplaced feelings of guilt to take over, challenge these feelings and beliefs as they arise. Did you tell your wife while you were still together that her behavior was/is hurtful and you would like her to stop? If so, you gave her fair warning to make changes. Also, why are you still communicating with her? Do you have children under the age of 18? If so, I suggest you looking into parallel parenting instead of co-parenting (parallel parenting article on the S4M website – https://shrink4men.com/2011/07/25/parallel-parenting-you-cannot-co-parent-with-a-high-conflict-abusive-and-crazy-ex/). If you don’t have kids under 18, is there any legitimate reason you need to communicate with her? If not, I recommend you go No Contact and quit allowing her to spew her emotionally manipulative venom at you. You don’t have to continue to be this woman’s emotional punching bag/doormat/toilet bowl. That’s why you got divorced. Drop the rope.
If you would like some more support for these matters, please check out the Shrink4Men forum (see above tab).
Kind Regards,
Dr Tara
I’m in a relationship like this but can’t leave because our 2 year old son. I hate everyday of my life which is sad as my boy is the world to me and I should be enjoying his life.
Leave now or leave later. It will happen and it will be more trauma for your son later. Besides that….your dysfunctional marriage will not benefit him.
I could answer yes to 12 questions on top. I’ve been staying with her for 7 years and have 2 kids. I feel like getting out of this hell but don’t want kids to suffer and so still with her.
My life is already messed up but I want to advise those who are with such a crazy bitch without kids, leave her right away before complicating life further. If you’r engaged not married yet, don’t hesitate to call off the wedding…these are my 2 cents! The biggest mistake is I kinda knew of her behavior before marriage but still didn’t realize what was right for me. Such an a***le I am.
With her, she is in general still better person except when it comes to my folks. She gets crazy with anything about them. But my folks kinda important in my life and I don’t want to be disconnected from them. She is aware about herself acting odd and tries to improve.
But she has her own limitations that she can’t control her impulsive reactions. She is seeing CBT therapist and recently therapist concluded she has BPD symptoms. With BPD from what I know it’s really changing one’s personality, changing the way how you look at things, how you take events that happen to you and that’s why so tough for anyone to recover. Not sure how things lead further…
Is it normal for them to always talk about every little detail that happened during their day when they get home? I can’t stand that. So on top of being kinda crazy on a daily basis, today she’s supposed to finally quit smoking o.0 She’s not been up for 1 hour and she comes to me saying that she’s angry with me and that I should give her cigarettes. She also mentioned something about killing me, although she had a slight smirk. I’ve been thinking of leaving her, but now I’m just kinda scared. She used to cry often but it that stabilized, she wont take care of her self like eating properly or exercise. She seemed to be in decent shape when I first met her, a bit over a year ago. Funnily enough, I’m the one edging away from our sexual life, it bores me and I’m just not attracted anymore. She has a bunch of debts from her past marriage on top of it all. But somehow I just can’t help feeling guilty about leaving her, she doesn’t seem to have a whole lot left in her life, if I leave she’d go live with her parents at 34. So I feel super guilty, but at the same time, super unhappy. Support?
Dave, I’m sure you’ve heard the saying Your Lack of Planning is Not My Emergency. She’s an adult, and if she has to go live with her mother, well that’s the bed she’s made for herself, so let her sleep in it. There’s absolutely nothing to feel guilty about. Besides, it sounds like your relationship has run its course and fizzled out. That often happens, and explains why we often have several relationships before settling in with a decent woman. I certainly don’t see a future for you two; do you?
Thank you .. at least you made me laugh .. I ticked eleven, and she’s a therapist and yoga teacher .. nine years now of rages at least once a month (apparently nothing to do with her period !) .. does putting up with this make me madder than her ?
Phil,
I have noticed as well that my wife is most off the deep end in that PMS time frame but she won’t even admit there is a correlation let alone get help for it. She asked if I even liked her and I said sure for 2-3 weeks of the month, the rest of the month when your a crazy person I don’t even know then not so much. You can pretty much tell by the calender when she is going to erupt and you can see little signs and changes in her behaviour leading to to a bad time starting to happen. The problem is the bad times have gradually taken up more dates on the calender than the good ones and it gets to the point there is no escape for it. Nothing worse than coming home from work and knowing she is in bad place and dreading the yet to be known chaos that will soon follow. If it was just her i’d drive away and not look back but i love the kids and the only thing worse than me getting the brunt of her crazy is the kids getting it. No way I can have a situation with her and the kids without me as she is a terrible mother with no regard for common sense saftey for the kids and does not have the ability to care for them with compassion and love. Them and her without me would be a horrid existance for them.
Speaking from experience on both sides….my children, who are now adults admit that they were actually better off when I left their abusive father. Steve’s daughter lives with each parent on a 50/50 basis and can now benefit from the difference between a functional, loving relationship and what she lived with before. Her mother is in a relationship that may well be as dysfunctional as her marriage was, but hopefully the balance between that and ours will benefit her now and in the long run. It took Steve’s ex-wife 7 to 10 years to stop trying in the marriage and finally show her true colors so if that is true in her new relationship, then his daughter will benefit from that. I don’t think that a bad relationship between parents is ever good for the kids and may disable their ability to have a healthy relationship of their own.
I answered yes to 14 out of 19. My wife drives me fucking crazy every other day at least. I want to make things work because for some STUPID fucking reason I still care about her even though she makes me want to kill her or someone else or even myself on a weekly basis. She’s like a child, everything is the end of the fucking world if it doesn’t go her way. There’s no compromise, there’s no grey areas or in between. It’s fucking bullshit.
Hi Drew,
But she’s not a child and she is especially not your child. I encourage you to figure out what needs trying to take care of this abusive, ungrateful child in a woman’s body is meeting in you. Figure it out, figure out how to address those needs in a healthy way on your own and get out before, god forbid, you have a child with her.
Kind Regards,
Dr T
Hey Drew, don’t hold back, tell us how you really feel.
I remember having similar feelings. It gets a lot better when the ex is in the rear view.
You’ve got to wonder what is wrong with a person who continues to accept abuse…..don’t you?
Yes Shirley I do wonder. However, I was programmed from a young age to accept bad behavior, e.g. ‘all women get moody sometimes’, ‘You need to be a Man and stick it out for your kids’, ‘happy wife happy life’, ‘when Mom is happy, everyone is happy’, etc. etc. all BS. It took me a long time to wake up and start setting firm boundaries. It was like I was in a fog or a dream. When I finally stood up and set the boundaries, I could not believe the escalation in bad behavior on her part. Dr Tara was right. Believe it or not, it was the marriage counselor that helped me figure it all out. I am thinking that the counselor helping is pretty rare based on what other guys are saying here.
So yeah I wonder, but I am not judging. Some people, I think, want to stay asleep because it is easier. It was really really hard to get out. And I am still figuring out normalcy.
I guess in a way it is like Stokholm syndrome. Forgive my mispelling but I am sure most are familiar with it. Sometimes it is just easier to live with the devil you know. Perhaps a fear of being alone, or ending up in an even worse situation plays a role. The excuse of it is better for the kids doesn’t wash when looked at rationally. They are now learing that this is how one treats a spouse & be they male or female they WILL likely repeat this behavior.
Like Dr T I would recomend to anyone living this hell to document EVERYTHING. Every crazy behavior. Digital recorers can help. Video divices with time stamps must be able to run 24/7 so you can show it wasn’t edited.
Most judges & family court advocates can then see how damaging it would be for her to get full custody. Yes courts are still biased toward women to get custody but they are not allowed to overlook insane damaging behavior.
In the end it isn’t until we actually do muster up the resolve to end the madness that we can start to think with a clear head. I was in a LTR with a woman just like this. I got out before it got to god awful but that’s when the real trouble started. It took 6 months of PURE HELL AND her going to jail for violating a protection order before it finally stoped.
But I can tell you this It was WORTH IT. Every minute of the madness. There are sain rational women out there who will actually love & honor their husband. If the fear is of being alone or getting into this mess with another woman keep in mind that we now we know the red flags to look out for.
Best of Luck
Ron
Steve also claims that when he finally started ‘fighting back’ that her viciousness towards him increased but when he still didn’t allow her to play the victim…..it was six months and she found another man.
Mine found another man before I could finish packing my bags. Really, I was still living in the house.
S_L_S … You’ve got to wonder, and wonder I do.
It’s a mystery. And as someone who is no wimp, who is educated, patient, caring … and who tolerated a disordered mess of a woman for way too long, at the distance of a year now I still shake my head and wonder … what the hell was I thinking / doing / trying / hoping / believing ???
If you’ve never been there yourself, you’ll never know. It seems simple and obvious. It’s not.
It’s not like suddenly one day, a stranger walks up to you, punches you in the face, and you fall to your knees asking for more.
It’s far more sinister, insidious, and it would seem – calculated. It’s not in a realm, as men, we’ve been educated to watch for deception, fraud, manipulation, abuse.
It’s the example of the frog that sits in the pot while the water slowly boils. Nothing happens overnight.
(And as I experienced with the previous woman, that I married, it can certainly be kept hidden until the wedding ring slips over the ‘on’ switch, and by then I was pretty invested.)
But with the mess that ended last year, hooks are set in place, weaknesses are defined, emotional operands are identified. It develops over time.
Additionally, the ‘right type’ of guy fits wonderfully. A guy quick to temper and fast to fight will slap out a bitch’s lights with the back of his hand and it will end pretty quickly for each of them (probably him in prison) … and believe me, that woman was certainly begging for it sometimes.
I’m the type that was raised to never strike a woman, be supportive, patient with her ’emotionality’ … typical cliche cultural upbringing that never warns you about the rotten creatures running around out there as well.
In my case, there was an over-belief in giving the ‘benefit of the doubt’, when believing things said … that ‘love’ can fix all emotional troubles …
Add to this – these women will create a role customized to fit what a guy is looking for. Beyond attractive, she had a classical education in arts that matched mine, she enjoyed the same music, cycled, enjoyed dogs, was outdoorsy, hiked, had a Masters Education, feigned a spiritual interest, enjoyed cultural activities – she fit me well and that was probably because she tried to. So, they sweeten the pot incredibly.
When the wacko started to manifest, there already seemed to be a lot in the balance to make ‘adjusting’ worthwhile. And from there, the water starts to heat up. And the frog stays.
A lot of that programming has been re-written. I have yet to see what will happen when/if there is a next time. I certainly have learned to spot the wackos now … and boy, sometimes they seem as thick as black flies in summer.
So finally your question, while it seems obvious enough, ultimately fails in its simplicity to recognize the true complexity of the situation.
It fails to recognize the degree of manipulation, lying, and craziness that a man needs to come to understand he is actually a part of.
There’s no training for that, a guy has to find out however he finds out, however long it takes. And the longer he stays, the weaker he becomes, and the weaker he becomes, the less likely he is to make a big-effort to change, or to challenge.
Even then, once the lights go on – no one really believes they are in love with someone with a mental illness; No one is prepared for such a situation if they find themselves in it.
This website is one of the first ‘courses’ men can take to start to realize that.
The question “what is wrong with a person who continues to accept abuse” … runs the risk of seeming to blame the actual victim of the abuse.
Human psychology and human relationships are very complex … instead, pray that the abused person comes to actually understand their situation clearly, and, if present, see any past patterns that may be working on them as well.
And then, pray they manage to escape the abuser, and escape their belief in their love for that broken human trickster.
Well this website provided Steve with much needed closure. He was at a loss to understand why and how he was so villainized when he tried so hard to make everything right. Did anything he could to please her and avoid that confrontation and her displeasure……silent treatment for days, withholding intimacy and love, insults. He was so relieved to realize that he wasn’t crazy but that she was and also realizes that the balance provided by shared custody (50/50) of their child would be healthier for everyone.
Everything the other responders to your post mentioned.
I never thought about what I’d experienced in terms of “abuse” until I came across this site.
Perhaps if physical violence had been involved, I might have.
However, it wasn’t and you don’t come across much in the MSM re: emotional or verbal abuse … and when you do, it usually has something to do with male abuse against females, so it may not “click” with a guy.
There isn’t much a guy is likely to come across in their everyday activities, e.g., reading the news, that might give them a hint that they’re a “victim of abuse”.
In my case, I just happened on this site by accident through a search that had nothing to do with my partner. I would never have even thought of searching the web re: the experiences I had with them.
I get the impression that many folks on this site never discussed much of what went on behind closed doors with friends or family … so there was little or no opportunity for someone else to say “hey, that sounds kind of abusive to me” that might have triggered a “maybe there’s something seriously wrong in my relationship” in us.
Anyway, as people have expressed very well, it is far more complex than people realize.
Certainly more complex than I understood back in my (much) younger days when I’d read a “wife abused by husband” story and think “well, why the hell doesn’t she just leave”.
I think the “why did I stay” question is an important one to ask because if there is some part of our personality that might leave us open to abusive people, we need to understand and deal with this so as to, hopefully, not have the experience repeat throughout our lives.
Samson,
What I figured out…finally…is that I likely stayed because I grew up around disfunction. A somewhat angry pissy father who kept my family on edge much of the time….I just figured thats how life was. When I met “crazypants”, deep inside, it was familiar and stayed. Add in a physical chemistry, and my approval seeking personality….wham! I was a F’d puppy from the get go…..
I have been in a relationship for 3 years now my girlfriend bottoms out the scale matching every single symptom of (NPD) I have stayed in the relationship this long because of our 15 month old son. She said her dad abused her at the age of 4 until she was about 10 . She went to her moot her for help at the age 9 about the abuse her father denied it calling her a liar as her mom took her dads side. I don’t no if she is lying are telling me the truth bc of all the other lies she has told . What do I do ?
Gary, get out of there. Leave. Read Shirley’s comment below; you’ll damage yourself and your son by staying in the relationship. The history of lies and deceit has to be broken, and you’re the only one that can do that. Good luck! – Julian.
15 out of 17. umm shit, I think I broke my brain. 2 kids under 3 and a wife who acts about the same age. Yelled that she hates me as the pizza spilled when a truck hit a bump today, hours after she spent a good part of the afternoon telling me if I was a real man I’d stand up for myself and just leave her and the kids. Fuck my life…
Your kids are under three, so I’m ‘assuming’ that your relationship is under 5 years. Get counselling if you want your relationship to work….may not work…but try. Just don’t let 20 years slide by, like my Steve did, thinking you’re the crazy one and in the end, you damage your kids with an example of a totally dysfunctional relationship.
Omg. You actually know my wife?
Mine only matched two points for sure but I always give the benefit of doubt. I think the split would have been easier had she met more of the signs. Thankfully I was only in the relationship for a year and a half. After reading the posts here I thank my lucky stars that I resisted the pressure of putting a ring on her finger and moving in together. She actually gave me timelines of when this should happen. I stumbled upon this site because I was looking for reasons she was so controlling. She always had to sleep on a certain side…always had to have the remote control…etc. I really didn’t care(figured they were just quirks)The event that made me search the internet(more out of curiosity) was one night in a hotel room I grabbed the remote while she went to the bathroom. She wanted it back. I wouldnt give it and she started wrestling me for it. This was all in fun with both of us laughing but she wouldn’t let up until she got it back. I finally gave it to her as I was just messing around but I had a strange feeling that even though she was laughing something wasn’t right. She NEEDED that remote. It was kind of past the point of just playing around. Even though she was laughing she seemed to be kind of panicking that she didn’t have it. On another note she wont leave the bedroom/house without full makeup on. If someone came to the door she would run to the bedroom if she didn’t have makeup on.
This article and the responses are enlightening to me. I have been reading through all your responses over the past few months and I feel for all of you who are going through the same hell that I find my life has descended into.
My story: I have been married for 20 years to a woman who scores on all of the markers in the article and then some more. I have four beautiful children (the eldest is from my wife’s previous relationship – more on this later) despite the fact that their mom is a psycho. Her upside is she is remarkably beautiful even at 50 and remarkably good with young children.
Her downside is everything else. I have not sought out a divorce for many reasons – the sanctity of family, the sanctity of my marriage vows and the deep love I have for my kids.
I have some other markers to indicate psychological problems that you, as the husband, may encounter if you are married to a CB:
– Does she maintain a set of double standards – one for her own actions and life and another for everyone else’s , including yours? An example (one of many): My wife has been married four times according to common law in Ontario, Canada. She lived with two different men on two different occasions for over a year between her first husband and me. She only acknowledges being married twice and divorced once. That would be fine by me except that, when the topic of her divorce from her first husband comes up with third parties, she will ALWAYS say, “My husband is also divorced.” as if to stake some moral equivalence in or marital history. The truth is I was once engaged to a woman but it was called off long before there were any nuptial. Only in the mind of my wife is being engaged the moral equivalent of being married while being in a common law marriage has no equivalence.
– My wife will pass swift judgment on others while ignoring her own shortcomings. I no longer point out when she disrespects people who have been divorced that she has been divorced at least once and as many as three times depending on whose standard you use.
– Are her sisters Crazy Bitches? My wife has four sisters. Each of them has been married and divorced (legal or common law) at least twice. Photos of family gatherings over the years are a collection of men who have had the good sense of moving on in at least one case, committing suicide. Ex-relationships are marred by a combination of restraining orders, lawsuits and assault charges against the sisters. I am the last man standing from the Christmas dinner photo of 1990. Family gatherings have ended up in cat fights, food fights and, on two occasions, the police being called. I no longer attend when the sisters get together and I am often vilified for it.
– Is/was her father a bastard? My wife’s father was the root of much dysfunction in his children. He was a cowardly bastard who often beat his wife and children. This is one of the factors that has kept me in my marriage.
I no longer attend weddings. When the person residing over the service gets to the part about “Speak now or forever hold your peace.” I find it difficult to keep my mouth shut.
Wow Noah. Very honest. You sound like an intelligent and moral man, very much like my Steve, although you are more aware than he was at 20 years of marriage. He spent most of his marriage, except the last year, thinking he was the bad guy or crazy to think that he might not be. In the first six months of our relationship, he continuously apologized if there was even a hint of displeasure or criticism from anyone. He is much better now and he has realized that we can try to objectively discuss any issues and there won’t be any blame. He was paranoid, always looking over his shoulder for the next axe to fall, driving home from work wondering what situation he would have to deal with. You describe your wife as Steve describes his ex-wife in regards to her judgmental personality and lack of accountability for herself. He describes her as someone who is always wronged by someone else, and then spends great time and energy on planning how to “pay them back” and is teaching their daughter the same. Everything negative is someone else’s fault, never hers. Never anything positive to say about anyone who threatened her or had any power over her. She had daily 3 hour naps and had to be home for ‘her show’, Jerry Springer, for years, but claimed she was overworked and unappreciated. Never had a job outside her home since before the first child and never went back to work even with 10 years between their two children, the oldest now over 20 and the youngest, 11. Steve says she changed radically after the first child. She justifies leaving her marriage because once Steve actually gave up jumping through her hoops in the last year, she labelled him an abuser. Always the victim. She too is quite attractive, and spends a great deal of time on her appearance but always over doing it with provocative dress, false eyelashes, heavy makeup, etc. In her younger years, her flirtations would incite her husband to come to her aid….apparently she loved being fought over and considers herself quite the temptress, but she is actually very insecure when out of her own element. I actually knew her then and know this to be true. She is also very good with young children, but it seems that she uses their childhood illnesses and little hurts as an opportunity to demonstrate what a great mother and martyr she is. Their daughter at eight, had been taught to be terrified at the sight of a drop of blood, a minor cut, scrape or little ache, and any other little symptom was highly exaggerated. A headache for example, was the onset of meningitis and a sunburn was the imminent onset of cancer. When I moved in with Steve, there were poison warnings and health alerts taped to the inside of every cupboard door and she apparently would spend hours researching imagined symptoms. Their daughter would repeat that her mother said “you came that close to losing your leg”, kind of thing over a little fall off her bike. The family doctor recently admitted to Steve that he had always dreaded a visit from his wife and their child because the child was terrified of any injury, sunburn, insect bite…..and therefore him. She is much better now that there is some balance in her life, and she is old enough to know better. We have focused on minimizing reaction to minor illness or injury. A recent childhood illness caused the mother to insist that Steve could not care for their child when she was sick and that she should stay with her. Two weeks ago, we heard her on speaker phone to her daughter tell her that her father and I didn’t care about her like she did. When I asked the daughter why her mother would want her to believe that, she said in all sincere confusion that she didn’t know why. Our fear is that now the divorce is final, and she has no power over Steve, that their daughter, no longer a little girl, who is beginning to speak up for herself, will become the ex-wife’s new scapegoat and provide her ‘victim’ status, We are hoping that their daughter will not follow in her footsteps, just as Steve’s ex adapted the behaviors and mentality of her own psycho mother but….you know what they say: “Like mother, like daughter”.
By the way….just for the record. Steve and I got re-acquainted many months after their separation, while his ex found another man while they were married. This “no-fault Ontario divorce” is costing Steve thousands a month in spousal support and she is living with another man which won’t even be considered a material change at the time of review, because the relationship existed at the time of the divorce. WTF.
I said yes to nearly all of them. I’ve told her to leave several times but she refuses. I’ve broken up with her and she keeps coming back. I can’t even go to the store without her calling every 3 minutes. How can I make her leave?
I have been in a relationship with this woman for two years. In the past I’ve tried to break up with her and she threatens suicide. Recently she has started a campaign against my daughter. Whenever I have my daughter the CB does her best to make my ex-wife take her back immediately. My daughter (five years old) has said she doesn’t feel welcome in my home. Nothing I do makes the CB happy. I work, come home, clean, and cook. When I am done cleaning she still complains that the house is a “f@cking pigsty” The food I cook is “too fattening, seasoned wrong, not what she wants, not the food that she usually eats.” She yells, curses, and generally causes havoc. Then she immediately apologizes and says she will do better, usually through text messaging. I am not allowed to visit my friends and even when I do she calls constantly and starts fights to get me to come home. She constantly insults my family. I’ve told her numerous times to leave and she wont leave. I just want her to leave. My mom and I bought this house together and my mom now lives with her boyfriend and left me to take care of everything. I’ve considered leaving my own home just to get away from her but then what happens after i leave? will CB stay here and make my family miserable? will she burn the house down?
I have just left my ex after a year… we lived together for the past 6 months and almost all the points on the list i can tick “YES” to!.
I have moved back in with a family member till i get sorted and luckily there were no kids involved. I slept well last night apart from when i woke up at about 3 am thinking “she” had just shouted for me to make her a drink… i got out of bed and was apologising before i remembered where i was and that i was now FREE!!!
It feels weird not being constantly nagged and told what to do, she has texted me once saying “im shocked and amazed you have not asked me how i am! guess it shows how selfish you are!” …………. she kicked ME out of bed and told me to leave at 4.30AM yesterday… total fruit-cake.
/JM
I am totally shocked to have found this. I am relieved to know that it’s not me. I just called her a Drama Queen the other day and now she throws it in my face. When her and I lived together I did feel like I walked on egg shells. She is so tapped in the head.
I answered yes to 6 of these questions. My wife and I have been married for 13years and have a 2.5 year old girl and one on the way. I love my little girl to death but I wish I could go back to 2007 when my wife moved out and I told her I could not do this anymore. That only lasted for about 2 weeks though because she kept calling and telling me she would change. haha I’m a fool. I should have known from the beginning that she was crazy,for example, she slapped me at our bachelor/bachelorette party for basically standing next to a girl. Guess who’s idea it was to have a joint party? For instance last night we were outside and she gives me this look, we all know the look, because I looked over at our neighbors house. By the way she is jealous of the lady that lives next door. Well, no one was even outside over there. So I just shake my head basically in disgust and we go into the house. I can tell something is wrong with her. So my dumbass asked, “is something bothering you” she replies, “I saw you look over there”. When I tried to say something about her insecurities, she blew up. In front of my daughter she tells me to shut up. I continue to try to talk to her never raising my voice and this time she says, stop talking and shut your mouth. I had one last thing to say to her and it was, ” I can’t believe your saying this in front of our daughter.” This happened last night and I haven’t said one word to her since. What a BITCH! And they wonder why we cheat!!!!!
i answered yes to most of the questions. I now understand I need help and an seing a therapist. As i consider my first 22 year mariage (to a BPD in retrospect), then my six month fling (to a BPD in retrospect), and now my failing 20 month marriage, (oh ya to a BPD) i somehow am attracted to these abusive women. Crazy scary, so I am now exploring in therapy why? Not why BPD, but why an I attracted to them. I hope I can learn this about my self! Scary, very scary!
Jalf,
It isn’t that your attracted to BPD types. They are attracted to YOU! My guess would be you are that prototypical “Nice Guy”. There is nothnig wrong with that, I am that guy also. You may even have a little of what I like to call “White Knight Syndrome”. You see the damsil in destress & you want to help her. It is basically a good trait but these types will forever take advantage of that.
BPD types see that as weekness & somebody they can easily bend to their will. Someone who will feed their never ending drama & somebody who will rescue them. The aggressive “macho” type man wont put up with their BS & they KNOW that. So they intentionally target men they think they can manipulate.
I had an ex GF who became so abusive, demeaning, degrading, over the top jealous, the whole nine yarrds that I had to get out. It took some backbone to do it. It also caused months of pure hell being stalked, harrassed, threatened, etc. culimnating in her going to jail for violating an order of protection TWICE.
The second time was FROM JAIL She was dumb enough to call my house & leave a threat on my answering machine (back when we had those things) from the county lockup. Luckily they usually aren’t the shapest knfe in the drawer & they honestly see their actions as, normal, justified as what “any woman would do” But I can tell you from personal experience that it was worth every second of it just to be rid of her.
All that said I won’t let the actions of a few bad apples change who I am. I am still that “Nice Guy”. Always considerate of others & their feelings first. There are normal, sane women out there who appreciate that in a man & wont take advantage of it. But I had to dump that whole “White Knight Syndrome” So the trick becomes learing how to watch out for the red flags of a BPD VERY early on & run like hell. I have come accross it a couple of times sice crazy bitch. But I KNEW how it would end & ran for the hills.
Going to see a therapist would be a GREAT idea. Try to find one who has experience in dealing with Cluster B personality disorders. They can educate you on things to watch out for. They can teach you how to get past the whole “White Knight Syndrome”. Some part of you may feel the need to recuse the damsil in destress. You have to keep in mind though that the damsil will ALWAYS & FOREVER be in destress no mater what you do. As soon as you solve one problem it will be met with another, then another & it NEVER ENDS. Always keep in mind that the damsil job is to knock her knight off his horse & stomp him when he is on the ground.
Best of Luck
Ron
Ex-wife has 15 out of 19…I’m free but my children are still suffering…if you are reading this page before you have kids then don’t have them and get free now because any kids you have will suffer for a lifetime….luckily both mine are boys so at least they won’t become like their mother!! 🙂
Yes, but unfortunately, there’s a possibility they may pair up with someone like their mother as adults and find themselves in a relationship just like dear old dad’s.
lol well I answered yes to pretty much all of them… I met her oly 9 months ago and it was wonderful, then challenges of life happened and her job was made difficult for her and I tried so hard to get her to see that it would all work out fine yet nothing I ever said was good enough…then she quit smoking and I did too, but she turned into a monster and if I so much as asked for the milk, I was torn into about the tone I asked with… Naturally Im a soft speaker, never really raise myy voice for anything because nothing ever makes me that mad… Anyhow, the whole time she was quitting smoking which was about 5 months.. (so we started dating, then 2 months later she is quitting smoking…so now at the end of 7 months) I have done nothing right from the dishes to laundry to helping with the kids (3 of them all hers and beautiful little ones) we faught so much her oldest son was turning on me beacuse I would stand there so confused when she would lay into me, now her daughter who is 3 has really no respect for me and her oldest son is always talking to me like im an idiot. I kknow this isnt manly but I was to the point where she would go take a bath and I would break down crying in the kitchen, wanting to run…as far and fast as possible
.. my problem is that I love these children and she has said when I tried to leave that she will give the kids to their fathers…who are drug addicts… I have met them and yes they are so I know she’s not lying about that but I feel soo trapped and it’s only been 9 months now..
Ken
Ken – man to man, I have three words for you: Get Out Now. It will not get better and the only end-game to this story is more suffering for you.
I answered yes to every single one of those! I’ve been with my girlfriend for almost 4 years and, for the most part, its been utter hell! I’ve lost contact with almost all of my close friends, I hardly ever see my family and never have time for myself. My career is also taking major strain as a result of her issues and hang-ups. I feel like I’m a shadow of my former self. Its sad man. I’ve tried breaking up many times but, its practically an impossibility…what the hell do I do?!
Hey Reece …
RE: “I’ve tried breaking up many times but, its practically an impossibility” … that sounds pretty familiar. And actually, not ‘practically’ impossible, but for you right now – impossible.
I’m not sure what exactly was responsible for me finally – once and for all – walking away from my psycho-abusive-ex. after about 4 years as well flushed down the toilet with her.
And this requires a rock-steady conviction when she starts her inevitable gimmicks to try to suck you back in. It will all be roses, roses, roses … and the words you’ve been dying to hear.
I remember reading a failed sucker-punch from the ex after I was out – “I’m incapable of giving my heart to another” with a link to a ridiculous, melodramatic rock video • Barkley – Who’s Gonna Save My Soul (of course, there was no comment about her having no problems giving her body to others).
Similar to the ‘cluster’ of persona fragments she is, I had a cluster of things happening: I read this site religiously for a while, (and the GettinBetter.com site); I found a therapist I was comfortable with and worked with him as well; and I started to look at myself and what I believed was possible with this angry, faux-charmer of a woman I was destroying myself trying to emotionally stabilize (c Sisyphus).
If you’re like I was – her issues are now your obsession. I was literally obsessed, somewhere else I wrote that it was like being brainwashed in a cult. The drunken conviction chaining me to her was the belief that if I just finally figure out something or get this particular thing right – I’d be home free, and she’d be back to ‘normal’ (as if she ever really was).
At this point, we’re not our best resource for evaluating our situation, gaining perspective, objectivity … but it’s really all – literally – A L L – about what you currently believe: Change your beliefs – Change your life.
Maybe for example: If I leave, she’ll find someone else; I’ll never find someone else; I can fix it if I just (fill in the blank); Maybe it really ‘is’ all my fault; I’ve invested soooo much already – it’s a waste to leave now; We have things bonding us (lease, co-loan, bank accounts); We have so many things in common …
To externalize all you believe and start to get your thinking mechanisms working in a straight line again, I’d start to journal like a fiend.
Write everything you believe down on paper – and then challenge yourself on each item: is that really true, has that always been true, how much is based on fear, imagination about the future, and how much do I really know about the future (quick answer – you don’t know the future – so don’t use fear and imagination to write it before it happens. Really, you don’t know the future.)
All you can really accurately say about the future today is – the future will look like the past couple of years, over and over again, except worse and worse.
At some point the fog starts to clear, stop drinking the cool-aid though. We have to confront our fear, our beliefs, the ideas driving our decisions. Document it all to yourself – on paper. Document her abuse – example after example.
This will start to help you stand back. Don’t be uncomfortable with the idea of talking to a therapist, read everything on this site …
If you do, nature will start to take its course and you’ll start to move back to balance, health, happiness, and eventually you’ll walk away from throwing yourself on this emotional chainsaw and calling it love.
wow.. reading all this makes me feel better that I am not alone. I am not sure what to do though, sometime I just wish I was dead. if it wasn’t for my 1 year old daughter, I would have been gone already. I just know if I leave she will do everything she can to make sure my relationship with my little girl goes south. I am so depressed about all this, which is just like it was mentioned above, is not like me. i don’t know what to do….
So many people today live through…and survive a separation or divorce. People adjust and if you are committed to a relationship with your daughter, then it will happen. She needs a man to abuse. Not her child.
I am a big fan of mgtow and a few other mens sites, I do highly reccomend them also, (I’m a female, btw). It has astounded me for many years, the way women do these things, as I grew up in a very functional, loving enviroment, with older adults that did not “play” these types of games. I learned many things from some “not so nice” men after having left home, and never really understood the “game” they played, because I didn’t have the same rule-book or upbringing they did. I had to realize, many people are brought up in some unbearably disfuntional lives, and I always wondered if something was maybe wrong with me. I have long known, I was very lucky to have the loving parental examples and families I had.
The thing that totally breaks my heart and has reduced me to tears at times, is some of the views some men have adopted in regards to women, is that they now have HATE for all women. There are very demeaning remarks, (on some sites) and they seem to pigeon-hole, stereo-type, and berate ALL women, because of the damaged ones they have encountered. It’s very understandable given the horrors they have endured, and it still breaks my heart. I do feel it is most important, that men and women stop feeding and perpetuating these terrible behaviors.
Dr. Tara, is there something, anything, good nice men and women can do? I feel terrible that any persons has to go through horrible experiences, and would rather no one experience these things, yet they still happen. How can awareness and knowledge be brought out into the open? We are all HUMAN, and the divisions of “us” against “them”, doesn’t seem like it works. Is there ever going to be a way to bring understandings about all these types things to PUBLIC light, or is most of the world going to remain insane and in the dark?
I know I am not perfect, but I care enough to try everyday, to be a better person.
I am a big fan of mgtow and a few other mens sites, I do highly reccomend them also, (I’m a female, btw). It has astounded me for many years, the way women do these things, as I grew up in a very functional, loving enviroment, with older adults that did not “play” these types of games. I learned many things from some “not so nice” men after having left home, and never really understood the “game” they played, because I didn’t have the same rule-book or upbringing they did. I had to realize, many people are brought up in some unbearably disfuntional lives, and I always wondered if something was maybe wrong with me. I have long known, I was very lucky to have the loving parental examples and families I had.
The thing that totally breaks my heart and has reduced me to tears at times, is some of the views some men have adopted in regards to women, is that they now have HATE for all women. There are very demeaning remarks, (on some sites) and they seem to pigeon-hole, stereo-type, and berate ALL women, because of the damaged ones they have encountered. It’s very understandable given the horrors they have endured, and it still breaks my heart. I do feel it is most important, that men and women stop feeding and perpetuating these terrible behaviors.
Dr. Tara, is there something, anything, good nice men and women can do? I feel terrible that any persons has to go through horrible experiences, and would rather no one experience these things, yet they still happen. How can awareness and knowledge be brought out into the open? We are all HUMAN, and the divisions of “us” against “them”, doesn’t seem like it works. Is there ever going to be a way to bring understandings about all these types things to PUBLIC light, or is most of the world going to remain insane, in the dark, and keep hating?
I know I am not perfect, but I care enough to try everyday, to be a better person.
God bless you, alotbetternow. The vast majority of MGTOW don’t hate women but they do use salty language. If you have 7 live hand grenades in a box of 10, you treat them all as though they are live out of a need to survive, not because you them. And with so many brother walking around with missing limbs, it’s out of a sense of duty that we get the word to other brothers and avoid the life altering damage.
I answered yes to all points.
I left her two months ago. In actuality she kicked me out, only this time I did not go back.
I had been with her for 8 years, married for two. Thankfully no children.
The worst part is that the two “sides” to her were so completely polar opposite and extreme that I actually don’t believe I will ever meet anyone as wonderful as her “good” side. But her bad side, those points listed on this page, they destroyed me.
I don’t know If I have any advice to give as I’m barely into the divorce, but I’d have to say that I knew that she had BPD for about a year before we married and I thought it was something that could be defeated with hard work and perseverance. Everything else I have accomplished in my life didn’t come easy, it came with hard freaking work; why would marriage / a relationship be any different? The problem is that relationships are one of those things that take TWO to tango. Part of being a couple is working through things TOGETHER. Helping EACH OTHER become better people and better mates. One person putting in a majority of the effort just flatly does not work. It has to be 50 / 50. Period. All of these points run counter to the togetherness of being a couple. After awhile you are just going to burn out, no matter how much you think you can take. I went in with the flawed belief that she would work hard to better herself just like I was willing to do. Like so many other people here, I was very wrong. It’s hard to grow as a person when you are busy blaming your mate for everything, and it’s hard for them to grow as a person when they are busy reacting to emotional BS that is generally untrue.
I wish I was alone here. This is a horrible experience that should not need to be endured by anyone.
After 12 years I wish I could tell you guys who are in the early stages it gets better but it doesn’t. The countdown until my son turns 18 is 7 years and then I’m over and out.
I was in a relationship with a woman like
this for about 4 months, it was HELL. Im
Glad to be free now, and i would say yes to about half the questions ( identified herself as a “DIVA”, cold and indifferent to affection, I was walking on eggshells, distanced me from my friends, found myself excuses for her.) Couple days before we broke up, my father saw first-hand how she was speaking to me and mentioned to me that she has no respect for me and how badly she treated me. Couple days later i got the courage to tell her i was “done”. She reacted non- chalanty at first then began to rage at me for being over- emotional and did not want to accept any responsibility on her part.. Initiated NO CONTACT, and havent looked back since.
Oh crap… I have been in denial because I’m in love with the person I met 5 years ago. I’m going to therapy to fix myself and still no luck. I feel like I’m bending over backwards so far that my back is breaking. I actually wanted to kill my self because I’m so depressed because of how shitty of a person I am and now I’m selfish. I only wanted to get away permanently from her. Whats funny is I have lots of friends who tell me I’m pretty nice.. she has none and continually uses sex, my kids, my weight (just lost60 lbs which I’m great-full for her unending harassment) and anything possible against me. I love her…. Im FUCT
Matt, the problem is that you’re in love with the person you met five years ago, who was definitely not the person you know now. These women rely on the classic “bait and switch” ploy (also known as Dr Jekyll & Ms Hyde), and will switch back to the sweet Dr Jekyll if they think they’re losing you. But rest assured that the Ms Hyde personality is the only real, enduring one.
Of course, absolutely everything is your fault in her twisted world. Years of this attitude will wear you out and make you feel terrible about yourself. Try to get a break from her somehow; take a vacation and visit faraway family or friends. You need an opportunity to at least temporarily clear your head so that you can convince yourself of the truth and the only sane option you have: she’s sick, you’ll never fix her, and you really have to leave as soon as you can.
Good luck, brother!
I answered yes to 15. Been with her 2 years now. No kids but we have a mortgage together. We work together. Our lives are so intertwined that leaving would be very difficult. Some days I just want to leave. Just disappear. Leave everything and just go. Days like today. She flipped out this morning because she couldn’t find her sweater. Instead of asking me if I’d seen it she just went into a bitch fit. It was great at the start. Now it’s hell. She’s like a totally different person. I feel like I’ve been tricked into this. I’m angry all the time. I think I’m depressed. I don’t get much sleep. I’ve tried talking to her. Told her what the problem is, but it’s like talking to a wall. I don’t know how much more I can take. I’m a really easy going kinda guy but she takes me to such a dark place. The worst part is that I left someone else to be with her. I had it so good with the last one. This is the price you pay for cheating I guess.
Hey Paul
“… really easy going kinda guy” … is the food of choice for these types since we make it so easy for them to behave outrageously and never throw it right back in their face and hold them accountable. Guess who pays the bill for that in the long run?
Re “leaving would be very difficult” … Be careful what you tell yourself, because you’re listening and likely to believe what you think.
From what you write, I would just change that comment a bit, “leaving will be difficult” … Then add “but staying will be much, much worse.”
And, you don’t have the benefit of knowing the future (as I wrote somewhere else) … so don’t fill in the blanks with imagination.
You have no kids, so you have a mortgage, that’s just business, paperwork … guys around here would kill to be in a no-children situation with their abusive, exhausting female joy-sinks.
Change the language, change the options … we choose from the choices we think we have. You have more options, like ending it, getting out, and starting to enjoy life again. You don’t get these years back. Be glad you found this site and can plan your exit. Don’t waste time. Next July 4th you could really have something to celebrate. Good luck!
I said yes to all the questions. Getting a divorce after 28 years of marriage and two boys. I was an idiot – now I see the light.
Thumbs up to mgtow.com also. However, tread carefully on mgtowforums.com; browsing the posts, you’ll be surprised at how many intelligent and thoughtful former members have been banned. That’s because there’s at least one oversensitive, not so bright, and highly bigoted moderator who ejects and bans members at the drop of a hat. I know from personal experience.
I also wish that their language was more refined. They’re doing themselves a great disservice and damaging their credibility by their overuse of foul language and pejorative terms like “americunts.” However, you will find a great deal of experience, insight and truth on the forums.
Thank you Dr. T and the myriad of posters here for keeping shrink4men professional and respectable.
Well I was able to say yes to 10 of the questions. My wife is a recovering addict to pain pills and booze, (which she refuses to quit), and I thought when I met her I had found the love of my life… Until the day I said “I do”, thats when everything changed. Now I hate being in the same room with her for very long because I know she is going to start a fight over something! Now I know why her ex slept in a seperate bedroom, because now so am I! Shes nuts! Been to over 5 rehabs and she is great when she gets out, but then a few weeks later back to the same old shit! As soon as I am able, I am taking my dogs and I am out of here!!!
My wife fits 11 of these. Tried counseling which works for the same duration as the caffine high from a coca cola. There is the wonderful woman I married and the psycho who shows up periodically and randomly. We have two beautiful kids so I bear it. Ces la vie.
Okay, so my wife is totally crazy and is definitely a bitch. What do I do now though because my kids are angels and if I leave then I’d be (at best) limiting the time I spend with my little girls. Either way I’m screwed! Life with a bitch or life without my dear babies.
yup, she’s bat shit crazy and I married her
God help me…
I can say with zero uncertainty a resounding yes to 18 of the 19 questions. And I’m not a perfect 19 for 19 only because the last question (stalker behavior) has been manifested differently than described here. She doesn’t try to track me down or show up unexpectedly per se but she does rifle through my belongings from time to time; wallet, gym bag, work pack back, car, etc… even reading my journal…
I have been married to this woman for 14 years. God it hurts to even say that and to think of the anguish she has caused me and my kids.
Disregarding the target rich environment indicated by my 18.5 out 19 above there is an interesting twist/behavior of hers that I have always found profoundly confusing/troubling/psychotic… down right sick really….
She suffers from chronic back pain (which is legit BTW). I have been there with her through 11 back surgeries and three unrelated surgeries. I have cared for her, taken time from work to care for her as any self respecting man would/should. I have treated her kindly with love and compassion and tenderness during all of her medical issues (not to mention that’s how I treat her all the time) and NOT ONCE complained about it AT ALL. Not ever! Not once!
I am a good provider, always have been. I take care of her at all times.
This is what I don’t understand: whenever I get sick or injured (which is rare BTW) she treats me with an utterly profound contempt that leaves my head spinning. I don’t understand it. I simply can’t understand it. I am confounded. Throughout our entire relationship she has suffered through many many medical procedures (all of which have been moderately severe) and as I stated above I have always cared for with compassion and kindness. She has even told me so on numerous occasions. Yet when something goes wrong with me, recently I broke my foot playing racquetball, she treats me like I just had an affair. I’m having a hard time even trying to explain it it sounds so other worldy. It’s like something from the “Twilight Zone” utterly surreal and bizarre. She is simply down right mean, mean and nasty, contemptuous, short, she gives me the cold shoulder, use any phrase you can think of or any behavior you can think of to describe a woman who utterly despises a man and that’s her with respect to me if I so much as come down with a cold. Good god in heaven, I broke my foot in two places and my ankle in a nasty spill playing racquetball and she would hardly even talk to me all weekend. No “how are you honey”, “can I do anything for you”, “let me sit with you”, etc… nothing, not a damn thing. And then when she does make a feeble attempt at conversation it’s just to give her an opportunity to bitch at me for going to the ER at 10pm. “you should have waited until tomorrow and gone to patient first”. I broke my damn foot!!!! in two places! and my ankle! IT HURTS, so I went to get it fixed.
For my 30 years as an adult I’ve never had anything more than the flu. But in the last 18 months I needed surgery on my wrist from an injury received playing softball, had kidney stones (didn’t see that one coming, and certainly don’t recommend it ;-), and just last week broke my foot. In the 14 years we’ve been married all I’ve ever needed from the doc is antibiotics for the flu while she on the other hand has a frequent flyer card with every hospital in a 50 mile radius. And she treats me like utter shit when I have anything and I mean anything at all. If I have a headache and take Advil she acts like I’m a gigantic pussy and then makes it her personal mission in life to make sure I don’t take to many….
I’m not a sports freak. I played softball maybe 4 seasons in the 14 years we’ve been married. I play racquetball twice a week if it’s a good week, and I work out at home on a bowflex. That’s about it… so it’s not like I’m one of these guys who abandons his wife and family in a vain attempt to relive his high school glory days….
I swear to god man, I don’t get it.
Here is the only thing that I can think of to try to explain this. Her mother is a 72 year old overweight smoker who wouldn’t go to the doctor if her life depended on it. And ridicules anyone who does and belittles they’re illness if they do. I think my wife having been raised by this ugly monster has stored up all that ugly and channels it and all the contempt that comes with it at ME especially, and also others but conveniently avoids those deliberations when the subject in question is HER!
you must be thinking what a load of BS right about now. Whatever, This is the HELL known as my life…. trains departing All Aboard….
I love this site, I love this page, I love all you guys who have bothered to share your experiences.
3 months ago I said to my dad “In 1 months time I’ll either be engaged or separated”,
3 months of walking on eggshells (Sorry 12 months of 18 walking on eggshells),
18 months of how my best mate has never made an effort with her,
18 months of how my family like her more than me or how they pick on her and make her feel like crap, she can say both comments within the same sentence ( I’ll be honest they’re probably said an hour apart )
6 months of passion, best 6 months of my life, as far as that goes anyway
Then 12 months of 1 night a week, I’m not putting my mouth there, no dirty talk, no sweet nothings, only 3 lines in the bedroom
“Have you got a condom ?”
“Where’s the condom ?”
“Put on the condom ?”
She was on the pill, but imagine if you will a woman who marked 17 out of 18 normally, then 34 out of 18 on the pill, she’d bleed twice a month, not that it actually makes a difference as she was always angry.
Anyway I digress,
last night after my mums birthday she said my mum was picking on her, the first time she said it I said “I’m sorry she didn’t mean anything”, conversation then consisted of parent bashing (mine), and stupidly I offered to take her out the next night,
obviously she then had plans which she hadn’t mentioned but they magically got cancelled when I made plans of my own.
So this is it, last night I slept in the front room, and this morning I dismantled my surround sound system and other techie stuff, so there’s a pile of my crap in the front room,
today I’ve thought about her all day, so much I did a random search for crazy bitc and found this site,
I love the woman, and I want to have children, but I know if we do she’s going to be the angry shouty parent, have no patience with them, and I’ll have to choose between the children and her, I’ve chosen my hypothetical children.
Wish me luck when I get home
…don’t do it dude. Trust me,..pack up your techi stuff & freakin’ RUN…..
She will be a terrible parent and you will hate your life 2x as much as now. Get out while you can.
14 on the YES list. I’ve always wondered what I did to God to make Him send me to this person. 32 years, gets worse everyday. To many threats to do anything about it.
My god…. I thought I was alone…. I hate my wife so much it’s starting to affect my work, etc…. why does she treat me like this????
Do you think that she blames you for everything because she is unable to accept responsibility for her own failures, disappointments, and her unproductive life? She certainly, is not to blame so therefore it must be your fault and she is a martyr for putting up with it. This is the way these women truly think.
Well I first read this about 2 years ago and decided to put together a plan of action. Missing the companionship and sex wasn’t really an issue since that all ceased years before. We’ve been sleeping in seperate bedrooms for over 10 years. My snoring, then my apnea machine was too loud, then she said her all night TV watching seemed to be disturbing me so out of concern she said I should go back to the other bedroom. Well I’ve worked on getting myself back into shape, no more apnea or high blood pressure. We are nearing 30 years together and my planned anniversary present to myself for #33 is to have her served with the divorce papers. I would have left earlier but since we own and work ( at least one of us works) at a business together I would have been left penniless. So two years ago the plan was implemented. Every month $2,000 has been paid on the mortgage and $3,000 grand has been stashed away in cash somewhere secure that she knows nothing about. At the end of the 60 months, five years seemed like a short time compared to the misery of the previous 25+ years, there will be no mortgage left. and I will have around $200,000 in cash. It is nowhere near what I should have if things were just split 50/50 but the will to fight has been stripped from my core. I won’t be rich but I will be free. I will be able to say here is the house, I don’t want or need anything from you or our business and just walk away. If I spend the rest of my days living in a trailer near a river in the middle of nowhere it will be a vast improvement over the lonely miserable experience I’ve had with her.
Best of luck to you and make sure your soon-to-be-ex and her attorneys do not ferret out your stash of cash or she will no doubt fight you for it tooth and nail. Breaking free of such a miserable and abusive relationship takes a lot of courage. Much strength to you!
i was wondering what was the problem with my wife. now i know. i do everything for her but its never good enough for her. thanks
… well this would explain a lot……
Oh my God! You just described my wife to a T! This is unreal! I thought I was losing my mind. But I truly realize she is a crazy bitch! She does all of these things you mention. It’s as if you were a fly on my walls the last 15 years! I actually feel a little better about the situation now because I know she’s outta her mind!!!
Thank you!
I am sooo glad I found this webpage. Its good to know I’m not alone in this. 11 years of marriage, 3 out of 5 kids we have are from our relationship. She was abused as a child & I trully love her, but it is getting to be unbearable. I am a disabled Vet and constantly home now, so the ‘craziness’ is even worse. We sleep in different rooms and I usually move about the house on eggshells. The crazy thing is that everytime I try to sit her down to talk things through, like grown adults, she turns on the tears and accuses me of the very same things, that bug me about her,…how freakn crazy is that….seriously hoping to have a cardiac arrest soon so I have my peace…..crazy pointless life I’m in,…..wtf
I answered 16/19. How pathetic am I? Especially after 27 years of marriage. I put up with her abuse because I had sympathy for her since she was sexually abused when she was a child. Now she is asking for a divorce. She has ruined emotionally, physically and now financially (she has never worked). Very bad since we have two young boys. I am trying desparetly to pick up the pieces of my life – one day at a time. All of you out there – GET OUT NOW!!
I have answered 11, Thanks for putting this up. I have a 2.2 Year old daughter, i am just waiting for her to grow up a little more so that she can recognize me in a crowd. My wife has made me to part away from my friends, relatives… Even though i have a beautiful house i cannot call my freinds and relatives for a get together because my wife doesn’t like it. She always has reasons for not calling them. Even if i go to see them, she has problems and will call me every hour to check if i am coming back.
The pity is she has fought with her own father / mother, and is with no talking terms with them.
I really don’t know when i can leave her…. Please somebody help me and tell me how long should i wait before my daughter is old enough.. so that i can leave this monster.
man this post and these comments! i read most of the first page (took a while), then skipped to page 15. we’re all a bunch of poor saps.
i answered yes to 7 (very close to 9). sh1t is messed up.
my gf and i are so up and down, like one dude said, when things are good, i’m actually optimistic about being with her forever, but when they are bad, they are REALLY bad. like wanting to commit suicide bad.
weve been together almost 5 years, and just moved in together a few months ago. my DUMB ass actually thought it would get easier when we moved in. what a joke!
no matter what i do, i am in trouble, even if i don’t do anything. im like nervous so much. i say sorry about 50 times a day, it’s pathetic. when i do something she doesn’t like, i profusely apologize over and over. but if she does something that i don’t like, *i’m* in trouble for being mad at her.
i could go on, man i have enough crazy sh!t that has happened between us to write about 30 paragraphs.
the only thing i have going for me, is that we’re not married and we don’t have kids. but now we have this lease for another 9 months. what a mess.
im not fully cut off from my friends but i see my friends a lot less than i used to, it’s really sad.
i am 36 and sometimes i look up and feel like my youth is slipping away. i dont even have an overall point with this post, just venting. at least it helps to see i’m not alone.
Yeah, my wife has a lot of issues, but its all because of stuff that is done to her. She is a perpetual victim and does not deserve any of this, or so I’m told. She has been going to counseling for 10 years and nothing has changed. Her dad left her, 1st and 2nd husband too, now its my turn to plan my great escape. I’m just counting down days until I’m free, out of school, and not in her life. Her and her kid are psycho messes that can’t take care of themselves, but berate you for all that you do or are willing to do. Like they say the nut doesn’t fall far from the tree and boy are they right.
mine trips on me daily and i am half way across the world! i cant do anything with out being yelled at. i cant have any friends that are females! i cant drink with out being yelled at. i cant even have certain guy friends or hang with my friends if their girlfriends are around. what should i do?
Why did I not find this website before marrying my wife? Nearly 5 years of emotional stress and now with the help of friends and family I am getting divorced. What worries me most is that she refuses to get help even after I have blatantly outlined that she is ill. We have a 2 year old and I am so worried about her growing up with her mother. I can see this happening over again with her next victim and my daughter having to live with it.
I ticked over 12 points on the test, when I first read it I felt like someone had been recording my experiences. She has made me ill and ruined the marriage. It is so sad and depressing but all I can do is get out and leave my daughter to her craziness. The (UK) law is so biased towards the female I have no chance of custody.
so be it………………
I answered yes to 16 of these and i was curious about the the sex starting out great than turning into rare acourences !? Its exactly what has happened but im wondering why this is related to having a pyscho girlfriend?
I got 13 of 17, Call me stupid, but I’m sticking it out. The kids will be better off if they have a buffer. I hope that’s not untrue.
That’s kinda where I’m coming from. I’m at 15. I feel like not sticking it out and doing everything I can will only ensure multiple failures for several, even many, others.
Matt, psycho women are all about manipulation and control. They will use any tools at their disposal to achieve this, and sex is one of their favourite weapons. The sex is great at the beginning because she’s using it to lure you into a relationship with her. Once that is done, sex is reserved only for occasions where she’s trying to manipulate you or get something out of you (an exotic vacation, a new car, etc.).
Dear dr.t,
My name is michael. im from holland and im 22. today i had as we call it over here the last drop water in to the bucket for it to spill over. so i google how to know if your gf is a bitch. ive bin with her 2 years. if i look back i could only say yes twice to your quiz. now i can only say no 1 time. ive tought about leaving her multiple times. but i still love her. i cant talk about this with her cause she will freak out. she always turns shit around that its my fault but 9/10 its her own like all the mess in the house, she whines about it while i only own the tv,computer,surround system and my clothing oh an my romantic king sized bed. if i point this out she still blames me. she became my shadow. i used to smoke weed to relax. i wounded up in the hospital because of the wrong mix gave me a heart attack. she tells people it aint true while that day i found jesus and felt lucky to survive. if your entire boddy is purple and heart rate is 200 im sure youre about to die. Now i relax by gaming or playing guitar. guess what she wont let me for 1 fricking minute. my eye bags became double. my doc says stress can also be in your sub counciousness also depressions.1 rly big thing i noticed i laugh always i joke about everything but when i come home my face changes to lifeless and empty. its because the mirror shows me this cause i dont feel the change. i dont know how to leave her but when i start feeling more fdup i wouldnt know what to do please help me i feel like im the problem. am i? or is she mentally ill? p.s sry for the bad english.
Regards,
Michael
the Netherlands
I answered 8 of those questions. My wife left me and I hav ebeen fighting to get her back. She doesn’t wanta be married doesn’t wanta a divorce and doesn’t want separation. She came and took her stuff out of the house. what am i to make of this
I answered yes to all of these and could answer yes to one hundred more.
No matter what I do I’m punished for it, it doesn’t matter what I do. Today I tried doing something nice for her by preparing this huge lunch, and yelled at me for an hour while the food that took me 3 hours to prepare got cold, she made me throw it out after she was done yelling at me. She kept telling me how wrong I was for doing it because I would make the kitchen dirty and I’m the worst maid she’s ever had, refering toall the other men she’s been with most definitely, I forgot to mention she used to be a huge slut, I didn’t know about it until 3 months after we started dating and I caught her with my best friend. Then she kept telling me how I hurt her so much when I do things like this and tells me to stop messing with her and when I tried defending myself she kept rolling her eyes and chuckling everytime I said somethung. Then she kept cutting me off and saying, “so are you done breaking my heart?”
I answered yes to all of these and could answer yes to one hundred more.
No matter what I do I’m punished for it, it doesn’t matter what I do. Today I tried doing something nice for her by preparing this huge lunch, and yelled at me for an hour while the food that took me 3 hours to prepare got cold, she made me throw it out after she was done yelling at me. She kept telling me how wrong I was for doing it because I would make the kitchen dirty and I’m the worst maid she’s ever had, refering toall the other men she’s been with most definitely, I forgot to mention she used to be a huge slut, I didn’t know about it until 3 months after we started dating and I caught her with my best friend. Then she kept telling me how I hurt her so much when I do things like this and tells me to stop messing with her and when I tried defending myself she kept rolling her eyes and chuckling everytime I said somethung. Then she kept cutting me off and saying, “so are you done breaking my heart?” “Haven’t you hurt me enough for one day?”. She purposely sets me up and tries to trap me questions that have no right answer, they always end with making me look like I think she’s fat or hideous or a bitch. And when I don’t do nice things for her, she flips on me and when I say I didn’t do anything she says “exactly”. Its a catch 22. I haven’t been happy in 3 years, she destroyed my trust in women when I found out how much a whore she really is, and the trust of everyone in general to a lesser extent. But if I question her she demeans me and makes me look like a bastrd, her favorite thing is to get me upset in front of her family then publiclly berate and humiliate me in front of them when I try and defend myself. If rainbows aren’t shooting out of my ass she makes me feel awful, because I wasn’t happy. She answers questions for me, talks for me. It goes on and on everyday, I lost my friends because of her and her family hates me because of the manipulation tactics she forces on me outloud at family gatherings, then says she just wants everyone to love me when she tells me what theysay about me when I’m not around. She tricked me into getting her pregnant, so I couldn’t leave her, after I tried leaving her, she tricked me into taking her back and gave me anything I wanted and that sort of thing, that lasted for about a week until she started with the “all I do is give and give and you don’t do anything for me”. I’m only with her for my son, who she won’t let me parent unless its her style of parenting, if not then she makes me look like an abusive father. I love my son but something has to give. I’m enlisting in the marine corps this winter, I would’ve, should’ve done it when I was 17 before I got too deep with this monster,I’m 20 now, but she wouldn’t let me. She even made herself think I was going to marry her and take her to live on base, she won’t let me choose my MOS(military occupational specialty) that I would love to do, which is artillery, but what I qualify for depends on my test scores, but I’m hoping. Anyway she thinks I’m going to be able to choose what I want andalways talks about us living on base and all that. Secretly I had to scrap my original MOS dreams of a firefighter/aircraft recue because I can live on or off base for that meaning outside the barracks meaning shed be able to come with. I want artillery because I have to livein barracks and may even be deployed, the farther from her the better I am. I just know that when I leave for mcrd san diego and tell her its over (the one place she can’t phiscally come after me) when I get home my son will be gone and there will be a bill from child support. No matter what shell always be in my life one way or another, sucking the money and life out of me for our son and her own twisted game. I’m afraid to leave because of my son, as bad as it sounds sometimes I wish he’d never been born, soonce I leave for good, its for good. No ties. Nothing. Just horrible horrible memories. When I do stand up for myself, and try to walk out the door, she hits me and bits me, spits in my face throws things at me, heavy things that she knows will leave cuts and bruises. But if I call the police shell just start cutting and hitting herself and crying crocodile tears, and whn the police show up and see a guy with the physique of a bodybuilder standing next to a girl broken down cryng on the floor with cuts all over her, ill be in the back of a squad car so fast it’ll make my head spin. I’m stuck, even without her manipulation and narcssism and sociopathic tendencies tearing my mind and heart to confetti, I lose. No matter what for the rest of my life I will be in a lose lose situation because she will come after me using my son as bait or just cause, using him like an accesory, that innocent little boy. Id say I’m at witts end but that happened a long time ago,
Dan you win when you leave! just do it and enjoy life.
Dear Lord why did it take me so long to figure this out? I recently ended the second BPD relationship in a row I’ve had…this one was for about 18 months. I answered a solid yes to 12, I was introduced to this young, drop dead beautiful, fun, successful woman by a friend of mine at a big group outing. It was very intense and passionate right from the get go. The biggest Red Flag of all times though I ignored…my friend that introduced me to this beautiful woman called me after he found out we went on a date together and was mortified, he tells me straight up “I cannot vouch for this woman, I would not suggest you date her”, he then apologizes and admits that he told her that evening we met that I was wealthy…bingo, she was on me like a fly on you know what. How damning is it when a person who is a close friend to both of us warns me to stay away from an unstable person. I won’t ramble on, but what a ride it was. There were fits of rage that she would justify because she is Maltese ” we love hard and we fight hard” …uh no, normal people don’t fight every other day. Normal people don’t leave you because you didnt go to her nieces’ soccer PRACTICE! She would constantly use a old injury as an excuse to treat me poorly because of selective memory loss and constant migraines. I really feel like I dodged a bullet…her previous boyfriend is actually in prision for fraud stealing millions just to feed her ego and lifestyle I’m sure (she proudly wears that Rolex everyday he bought her even though she knows it was stolen). Free at last, there are nice girls out there I’m sure I will find out, becareful they are really good at fooling you!
Fifteen for me. That’s a lot more than two, I guess.
My situation was a little different…Probably worse…because of my low self esteem? ADOPTED her daughter…moved to where her work was….had two girls with her…remodeled a 1920’s era farmhouse while commuting 2hrs. each day and working @ least 60hrs. a week…I love to work hard and push it…but nothing I did was good enough…thought I was stressing myself out…! But realized I was being treated like shit…..the harder I worked…the better I did…the more she would pull the rug out…sabotage…I could never let my guard down….she would purposely screw up plans…lie….gave up making vaco plans n had her do it…then when we went she would still act like she wasn’t having a good time!
If you FEEL like you are doing something wrong all the time and can’t explain it…get away and see what happens…magic! She is constantly trying to mess w/me now that we are divorced…n I have had to learn to accept it…can’t reason with her or change her…she’s screwed! Gotta stay strong for my girls…the ex is sleeping w/her 27 year old boyfriend in the house I practically built! She’s 38…
Wow as soon as I saw “does she fly into rages without warning over relatively trivial matters” I new this was about my CRAZY wife……. She tells me she don’t want our child to be raised in Chaos but She is the Chaos. I guess it started with her drunken mother teaching her how to be a drama queen and cause Chaos for everyone around her. She cant even go to the dollar store without getting into an argument. An argument with the manager. What a CRAZY BITCH. She also got into an argument with every teacher my son has in school, the school principal, and the school nurse. This stupid bitch argued with the manager of Walmart about not taking something back and she didn’t even get it there. I should get an award for longest time living with a Crazy Bitch……
unfortuately your reward is her!! good luck with that my man.
OMG, I said yes to 13!!!! I was wondering “Was I the crazy one.” That’s OK, the divorce is going full force.
i feel like venting, here is a list of things that have occurred in my relationship/marriage with my personal crazy bitch:
– She wanted a bigger diamond on her wedding ring, 1 day after I proposed.
– She begged for a Luis Vitton bag, I struggled to get one for Christmas, then she returned it, because it wasn’t the one she wanted.
– Yelled at me for Valentines Day flowers that were delivered in a box.
– Upset that her 3 dozen roses, hand delivered from a florist fully arranged was smaller than a co-worker
– Brought her the ” SUV of her dreams” and it set me back a lot. Then she complains that it had high mileage. she was ashamed to show anyone..
– We bought a $300K home, i paid the down and closing cost only to hear “I never really like this house”, we should have bought a bigger one.
– We both have kids from another marriage. Hers (in her opinion) are angels. They are smart, well behaved and beautiful. Mine, well they are not attractive, bad, not bright, have no manners.
– She often likes to remind me of her old boyfriends, Calvis, who supposedly has a 9″ penis, Darly her ex, who is 6’6″ tall and what’s his name who she just loved.
– Unless we listen to her music then everything else is stupid or awful.
– Sex is reserved for when she feels like it, weeks in between.
– She always is accusing of cheating. If i’m 10 mins late coming home the CSI question start.
– She complains that I take too during sex. Why can’t I be a minute man she says.
– The last straw was when her family members decided that they would physically assault me and she did nothing, Hell she blamed me and wanted me to apologies.
Well there is a lot more, but I’m moving out tomorrow, and filing paper ASAP.
I can only say to all here get out…NOW…whether you are married, have kids…whatever…get out…folks arent helping their kids by giving the example of staying in an abusive relationship to “protect” them…My own story was that I loved her so very much…she was mentally ill…tried to kill herself ect…I really wanted to help her…eventually, she filed false abuse charges and I had to plea…now on probation until 2015…but at least she is gone and we are done…it took that for me to finally end it…once out and on the other side, then you can see what it has done to you…it’s the only way…now, if someone said to me I would either have to go to prison for a few years or go back to her I would take prison…there are NO excuses…just get out…there is no working it out, there is no recourse other than completely excising her from your life…sorry, but that is the truth…
I work all day to come home 2 nagging wife. Can’t go out with mates
We constantly fight infront of this kid’s. I’m always the bad guy. She doesn’t work and only had the baby st home during the day. House always a mess and statesvshe is very busy all day. She watches tv most if the time.
I sleep in a diff room &stopped degrading myself by having sex with her.
Used to smoke the ganj (behind her back) to deal with Her constant yapping. Stopped for a week and have no outlet anymore.
Would love to leave her, and I’m sure she would wanna leave me,but I don’t have the guts to face borth families also my two cute kids. New she was going to give me hell before I married her but did not have the guts to get outta the engagement.
I live with the enemy!
Ppl think we r happy but r not.
She dragged me to therapy but had to change after the therapist stated that we both have to be willing to ‘change’. She thinks she is perfect and only I need changing.
Could state a lot more but just makes Me embarrassed and sad.
Gluck all u married men suffering and hats off to any man that had the balls to leave!
Help! I answered yes to 13 of these points. I’m now terrified. We’ve been together for the best part of 20 years, married for 8. We have an amazing 10 year old daughter who I love more than anything/anyone. Last year my wife graduated as a mental health nurse (ironic?) and could not get a job in our home town (due to government cut backs). She managed to find a job in the private sector 400 miles away. Me and my daughter did not want to move, but did on the promise that it was just for a year until she got some experience, now 1 year on she has a ‘better’ job and wants to stay. I told her I want to go home, as promised, now she’s leaving threatening to leave me as I’m jealous of her success and I’m trying to hold her back. I just want to go home. So my daughter and me are going ASAP. Fuck you! We’ve both had it with insanity.
well thats depressing… basically all except 2 of them
From New Zealand. I have found myself married to a complete nutcase, manipulative deceitful down right evil infact. I’ve been to a shrink a good one too, I have the male equivalent of battered wife syndrome. Oh yes I’ve gone for day’s and week’s to avoid her grasp. In fact without exaggeration I can say I have married the most evil woman I have ever met why? She got pregnant very soon after hooking up, I was already divorced with children and did the right thing as I didnt want to be without a family. Now I cant leave the kids with her. I left not long ago..she attempted suicide and was put away for a while. now she’s medicated but nothing has changed…I want out she has driven me broke is lazy and hatful I wish she had of killed herself. I sure have wanted to kill myself. I actually hate here but cannot leave because she is capable of anything…how bloody sad.
sorry to hear your dilemma bro, try treating her like a retard, read as much as you can about tolerating BPD sufferers and get out when you feel safe and for gods sake take the children. She needs help, lots of it but it is not yours to help her. Keep a journal and go and make some police reports so your side of the story is documented. Please be compassionate and patient during this difficult time. We are in similar boats so don’t quit paddling.
I just left my fiance of 2 years. turns out, she had schizoid personality disorder. for months I couldn’t understand why she lacked empathy or remorse or feeling. too often would she be guilty of these “crazy bitch” criteria, and too often would she make me feel like it was my fault. it was hard to get her out of my life… I loved her. we had so many things in common (i have nothing in common with 99% of the population) and when all was well, I was so happy. but enough is enough. tonight I find put sue has been fooling around behind my back, so I kick her controlling ass out. does she go home? no, she goes straight to the coworker who she has bee n rolling around with’s house for the night to do God knows what. my heart and pride are shattered, but knowing that there are many other guys out there in similar situations, but with more severe consequences, I have to try and tale control of my life again. I just don’t know how to do it. I don’t have friends or many support groups and have a lot of social anxiety so I can’t just go out and live it up to feel better. I need help, but I don’t know who can help me or what I can say. please, somebody help me. I’m so incredibly depressed.
I answer yes to all of them with an exeption of one, also she is always telling me that she heats me and that she could have any other guy hen she wants, the problem is that she is really hot, but the way she treat people is really bad she has been in many verbal and physical figths and since she is 18 she things that her beauty is always gonna help her, I JUST to be a really confident guy before meeting her, but after all I did for her(really good things) and her menthal agracion that says that I am not good enough ( even when I am a 22 years old with a really nice job and a lot of friends) I been feeling really depress lately, and even though i still have feelings for her I am gonna break up with her.
I
Is there some record on a score?
Is it common for NPD women to fake a pregnancy? My “girlfriend” claimed that I got her pregnant and she had to abort as a result. Needless to say it was 100% my fault and I got RAGED at like nothing I’ve ever experienced and she ended the relationship as a result. Truth be told, we did have unprotected sex (I pulled out “just before”) which was stupid, I know, so it’s possible. But a couple things don’t add up.
About a week before her first period was due after we’d had sex for the first time, she said she “knew” she was pregnant. I know women can know this but this would’ve been literally about two weeks after our first sex and before she would’ve missed her period. Sure enough, the time came and went with no period.
We did a home pregnancy test and the results were inconclusive. I don’t recall how that happened as it was nearly a year ago. I called a clinic near my place and they told me she could come right in for a test that would take five minutes and was 100% accurate. She refused this kicking and screaming because it would’ve been “too stressful” for her. She later did a home pregnancy test with her sister at home, I wasn’t there. The result was that she was, she said.
When the day came for the abortion I told her I wanted to be there and she refused, only her sister “was there”. I did a lot of research on the subject and found out that it’s mandatory that the patient have a check up a week after the procedure. She confirmed this. A week later I asked her (she was hardly speaking to me at this point) if she’d gone for the check up and she said “for what?” I reminded her and she brushed it off. A week later I inquired again and got the same nonchalant response. As far as I know, she never went.
She dumped me over this even though I told her I’d stand by her no matter what her decision was regarding the pregnancy. Months later she told me she’d broken up with me because she wasn’t over her ex. I told her that I thought it was because of the abortion. Her reaction was “oh ya, that” like she’d forgotten all about it even though at the time she made it very clear to me that I’d ruined her life as a result of the pregnancy and she hated me vehemently for it and would never forgive me.
Like I said, it is possible that this really did happen but things just don’t quite add up.
Common to fake pregnancy? Don’t know if it’s common but it’s certainly not unheard of. Fake pregnancies are wonderful tools for them to lay on the guilt at no risk to themselves. They don’t have to really be pregnant, they only have to instill enought doubt in you that they might have been.
If she were really pregnant, I don’t think she would have balked at proving it. Why are you with this woman?
Mellaril; I’m no longer with her. She dumped me because of that event. It was so strange because one moment she’d be talking, rather screaming about how I’d fucked up her life because of this and moments later prodding me by asking what I’d think if she had the kid and it looked nothing like me.
My wife tells me what a great husband I am one day and the next day tears me down over something stupid like reading a magazine while I’m taking a shit. She will zero in on the silliest things and blow them way out of proportion and make me feel like the worlds biggest piece of shit over it. Defending myself only pisses her off more. She tells me that I should be a certain way with our kids (who aren’t even mine), feels like mind control. She got super jealous when I wanted to join a gym, stating that she doesn’t want me around “sweaty hard bodied women”. I can’t even hang out with my friends without being accused of “going out with the guys to pick up pussy”. I’m not a cheater, I’m not promiscuous, but damned if I don’t wish I was with someone else who won’t treat me like a piece of shit.
prime time BPD.
My wife left me a month ago.. she used to blow everything out of proportion. And almost everytime she would threaten to leave me. This is the 2nd time and I believe she is gone for good. I don’t know where she is and she has my cell # blocked. My soon to be ex has dumped every man she has been with. She has cheated on all of them too.. Although she is very attractive she has huge self esteem issues and has a princess complex.. she is very shallow and self centered. I her mind it’s all about her. She could care less about me and that what hurts the most.
I must admit that I didn’t read this entire thread from the beginning but what I have read inspires and depresses me at the same time. I’ve been married 33 years. The roller coaster has been spread over the entire period. We’ve been separated briefly several times, came very close to a divorce once (still not sure why I didn’t make it out of the relationship then). Now my wife is close to being out and out a bitch on a daily basis. I answered yes to the majority of the questions above. I’m pretty sure the roller coaster is broken and hanging upside down at present. I feel like an absolute failure for being where I am now, married to a woman who has mentally abused me on and off for 33 years. I’m on an antidepressant to deal with my life. My friends and I hang out without my wife– dinner out, plays, concerts– because she dislikes everyone of my friends. What now? Do I try to fix the marriage again– give up another piece of myself? Can I successfully start over at age 55 with the massive mental baggage accumulated and strapped to me? We have a grandchild now and another on the way, and i’m afraid if I make a wrong move, I’ll be shut out of their lives. Of course, there is much I can’t put into even a long paragraph, and I’m not sure if I’ve presented my predicament well enough for helpful replies; however, I would appreciate and accept all replies!
Joe, you still have 30 yrs to live at least, less if you stay, take the chance and get out, it’s obvious what prevails if you stay. can it get worse if you leave , hell no. Life starts at 55 for you . you will never regret leaaving a prison or a woman like the onw you described. Go now!! good luck bud.
Thank you. You awakened me. I’ve been feeling like my life is nearly over, so all I could then do is regret my decisions. Perhaps I still have a chance to be happy. I happened upon this site purely by accident because to vent I googled, “my wife is a bitch.”. That burst of anger then slowly merged into a plea for help. And now I feel my resolve to make a change in my life strengthening. Again, thank you.
What if you knew that in a year you would be dead. What would you decide now? YOLO….you only live once.
If I had but a year to live? Why didn’t I think to ask that question of myself years ago!
Let me start out by saying how thankful I am for Dr. T and all the contributors to this site. I have been married for 4 years and have a 3 year old daughter. I work 6-7 days a week to provide for my family and allow my wife to be able to stay home with our daughter. None of this is good enough, nothing is for her. I feel so alone and lost. I am always made out to be a crazy, uncaring, unstable, angry man Reading through the post on this site has been a God send as i finally can relate to other men in my situation, and is helping to put things into perspective. I answered yes to a majority of the quiz questions and did a lot of reading on NPD and this is exactly my life. After my wife’s last fit of craziness in which I was told that “I am a disgusting person that she cannot stand” I have gone into silent mode, only speaking when spoken to. Now she is questioning me daily on whats wrong…Seriously? How can you even ask me that question? She is such a narcissist that she seriously thinks the reason I am not speaking to her is because of work stress or any other number of things that do not have to do with her. It could not possibly be because after 4 years of marriage I am tired of being your door mat. I am tired of being dragged into arguments over petty stuff that then blows up when i disagree with her and turns into me being told to leave the house or the police will be called and she will tell them that I am physically abusing her or my child, which i would NEVER DO. Open your eyes woman, it is you and your narcissistic behavior that is causing all of this. I am tired of being made out to be the bad guy, and at this point I am just going to work coming home and taking care of my daughter and going to bed. My health is suffering and although I have never had a drinking problem in the past I seem to be drinking more and more to just get through the night. I want to leave but I love my daughter and cannot imagine not being able to see her everyday and hug and kiss her when I get home from work and tuck her into bed at night. It brings tears to my eyes just thinking about losing those precious times. I do not know what to do. I feel trapped. I feel alone and desperate. Thanks for your time.
My Steve was married 20 years with a grown son and an 8 year old daughter. Since their separation, they have shared custody on a half and half basis. It works and it gives the child two perspectives and at least one non-dysfunctional parent.
considering showing this to my gf and showing her the 13 that i picked, any thoughts on doing that.
She won’t recognize them in herself and will accuse you again….of putting her down.
Bad, bad idea. She’ll fly into a rage, turn everything upside down and blame it all on you.
Yeah, my wife exhibits all of them but the lipstick — on almost a daily basis. 9 long years now, two great kids, which I fear will become messed up by her outrageous behavior. I know she is mentally ill, she doesn’t. Borderline personality disorder is a terrible thing, which matches up symptom-wise with these questions. No one can possibly understand unless they are going through it. Word to the wise–do not have kids with someone who is truly crazy unless you are willing to be tormented for the rest of your life. I’m fighting the good fight because I love God and my kids. I do my best to love my wife by trying very hard to remind myself she has an illness, though that is certainly not easy to remember. I often feel like a coward for giving in to her manipulation and selfishness for the sake of my family. I also fear that were I to divorce her, and attempt to get custody fo the kids, she would kill herself or worse.
I will say that, strangly, I find some solace in knowing I am not the only poor guy out there that is going through what I am. I have no answers…except to pray and trust God to help me get through today’s crisis.
Please listen to me, Tony. Go to MGTOW.com and read. I am in the exact same situation but there are techniques to minimize her crazy if you’re determined to stay. You’re not a coward for standing in between her and the government family court system that will take your kids and give her half of your income. That’s NOT being a coward. MGTOW.com and read. And keep coming to this sight because Dr. T nails this subject better than anybody. God bless her and God bless you Tony!
Wow, good to know I’m really not alone. Mine was sweet and bubbly around people, but at home I could do nothing right. Always complaining about something, arguing, picking at me for every little thing. The if we go out in public I’m accused of staring at other women often. She even told me she hated going out with the girls because she would see all the women and get jealous when I wasn’t even there. I checked off 11 on the list, and there were a couple more that we’re borderline I didn’t Count. I luckily escaped about a month ago. She had started getting verbally abusive in arguments telling me I was pathetic and boring and had no personality. I told her that was wrong. Then she went on her rant about being over it all which she would usually wake up the next morning like nothing had happened or apologize slightly. This time I said I was over it too, got up the next day and found a place to rent, then met the movers at our place the following day and moved out while she was away. After years of frustration, I’m labeled the bad guy among all of her friends…which were basically all the friends I had by now. It is still tough, but I know I did the right thing by getting out.
I answered yes to 17/19, i cant get her out of my life. It hurts so much.
I can pick out at least 5 that fit my wife. Smh. Funny thing is, her mother is actually pretty easy going, and from what I have seen, doesn’t give her husband alot of grief. (though he does get a little) But, their two daughters can be REAL hellcats!! 6 years in and I don’t see things getting any better. The emasculating behaviors, the blame, the antisocial behavior, the blatant lack of gratitude for anything, the lack of reciprocity over all…….I can’t see trying to raise children with this woman………A truly scary thought. I have accepted that no person can really change another person, without them being willing to change. I was an idiot to have had such positive expectations. The truth was there, but, I didn’t have the foresight to appreciate it. Awakening is better late than never, though. I’ve had enough of this particular headache for one life.
Grah – “I was an idiot to have had such positive expectations. The truth was there, but, I didn’t have the foresight to appreciate it.”
You and about 150 million other married guys. Don’t beat yourself up, your story is all of our stories. To the man, married guys have experienced what you’re going through. Keep reading Dr. T’s sight, plug in to Elusive Wapiti and MGTOW and learn as fast as you can. Understanding your situation and what to do about it will give you peace of mind you haven’t had in years. God bless you, brother.
Wow-I thought I was alone. I lead a very stressful life due to my job-made even more stressful by the fact that I not only have to deal with a wife who can’t handle trivial matters and criticisms, but knows she has mental health issues, and still fails to recognize when they come to the fore and cause problems. I can’t tell you how many of those questions I answered as being correct for her, but it was over half.
For the first 6 months of marriage my wife would hardly get out of bed, and when she did, would only wear pajamas around. After she nearly broke me, she decided that the only thing she (we) could do to make her happy was to uproot 6 years of my hard work and move to her hometown where she could get a job (and I couldn’t), though she had a job here and failed at it… because she never lifted a finger to work at it.
I am at wit’s end, and it’s only been just over a year. My fuse grows shorter every day now. She changed completely when we got married. She went from being fun, caring, nice, appreciative and open to things that I enjoy doing, to the most ungrateful, rude person I’ve ever met, who hates doing anything that I suggest (and the whole time I’m accused of not being open-minded). You’d be better off expecting a mountain to step out of your way than expecting her to apologize for her behavior. All I can believe is that everything prior to marriage was all an act to rope me in, and when she got me, she unleashed the hounds.
We’ve tried marriage counseling, but the entire time it was her complaining about things that happened in the past as to why she acts the way she does now. The counselor barely had anything to say to me, even when we had one-on-one sessions. It is everyone else’s fault that the princess doesn’t get what she wants or that the princess lashes out at anything. She’s a perpetual victim, and now, according to her, I’m her perpetual tormentor.
I keep hoping that things will change, that her move to her hometown would quell the demons, but they’ve only intensified and multiplied. Her change from pre-marriage bliss to the current state of affairs is nothing short of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.
I have most of them on the list. Sex is non existent now. When I suggested counseling, she said that the problems with our marriage were not the result of anything she did. My life is miserable at home. I take any chance I can to take work trips to get away from her. She is nice to everyone until she walks into our house- then let the misery begin! Nothing is ever good enough- yells all the time- alienated from a lot of my friends. I am trapped. I have 2 kids and I can’t leave. Life really sucks!
Lived the same life your living right now ,I waited till my daughter turned 18 then I left , divorce final last month , think about it long and hard sometimes it might be better to get the kids out of the situation along with yourself , for our own good you need to either leave or learn to live ignoring all the crazy shit , its no fun either way but those are your choices , good luck.
I’m the daughter. We need a Dr. Tara too! Info so accurate it’s a bit surreal to me still. Wish my dad could read it but the denial’s too thick this many years in.
Hi Amy,
While I don’t write too many articles for the adult children of PDs and sociopaths (and should do so more often), we have lots of men and women on the forum with disordered and abusive parents. I encourage you to check it out — http://www.shrink4menforum.com.
I answered yes to so many of these questions. I tell myself everyday I have to get out. But my self esteem has been that badly damaged I go to walk out and find myself stopping everytime, I need to find my strength again and just walk away and never look back. Wish me luck.
I answered yes to all but two of these questions. 🙁 But I have a better question. Why do so many guys let themselves be tied up with crazy bitchy self loathing insane bitches? I am starting to believe that this is just how women are. Mostly because I have not yet got a hold of a woman that was any different. If I ever do I am damn sure not letting go. 🙂
If that’s not a rhetorical question:
•Why Men Are Attracted to Crazy, Emotionally Abusive Women (February 17, 2009)
She yells raises her voice at any given time,just cos iv missunderstood what she she has said??? That’s not normal behaviour.im treading on eggshells most times.im nervous around her.she has to have everything her way…so very controlling.weput the Xmas tree up.and I put the decorations in the place????? Help……
wow..I get 13 of them. lucky me. what do I do. we have 2 kids…she has 2 kids from a loser ex that love me. I feel for them but she’s all over this list and I can’t take it. what the hell is the right thing to do?
My Steve was left without a choice when she left him for another after 20 years of hell. He was so whipped that he would apologize for everything and anything. He describes how he arrived home each day from work with a churning stomach wondering what new disaster he would find. He is happier now and beginning to realize that he was not the problem but was actually the victim. Funny though, how she claimed to be the victim for 20 years and blamed it all on him. Their daughter can now benefit from a normal relationship between Steve and I and hopefully we can compensate for the other, although she demonstrates some of the same behaviors as her mother, particularly the negativity. If you try to stay involved with the 2 kids, you may be able to help them, if not now, then later when they have a say.
Good lord! I really feel for the men on here, got to this page on a random trail of web bread crumbs, and all I have to say is first if your stuck in a relationship with a crazy, get out!!!! Secondly, for them men who do get out or are in the process, congrats!!!! Remember, men have the right to be happy as well!
Ty Abigail, I got out years ago and enjoy being a father to my sons. I feel sorry for those guys that convince themselves that they should stay and ignore the craziness.
Shit, marked 7 symptoms…
Here’s a notice for all reading this. Beware, that she’s also bashing her ex. Saying things like; he was abusive, chested on her multiple times etc.
My story:
Lied to about how many times married
Lied to about where we would be living
Would not compromise on any thing. Vacation, where to spend holidays, etc.
In the ten years of my relocating to this area, i made not one real friend; i’m someone who is personable, and never had this problem.
When i did make friends, she didn’t like them, and was spending too much time with them. I would only stop for a beer with them on my way home; 20-30 min.
Worked on her car all day, she goes out to dinner and brings me nothing to eat.
I spend money on lavish gifts for holidays, birthdays, and she gets me nothing.
Tried to kill herself; though feeble attempts, in front of me twice when i tried to leave her. I now no longer trust anyone, live a lone, can’t make friends as easy as i use to. I’m also in therapy to help with all of this. She flies into rages with our daughter, and myself, has a new BF, which i’m sure she’s priming to do the same to.
After having only seen her once
I googled “why is my gf a bitch” after dropping her off at home out of spite and a sort of sadness and disappointment. After doing so I stumbled upon this.
Just so everyone knows Im a 20 year old fulltime student and fulltime wageslave.
Anyways, I think I love my girlfriend and we’ve been together for a year and this is my 1st serious relationship. In my 2 other relationships I got tossed aside after 1month when she got back together with her ex and in my other 4 month venture I ended up dumped when she found somebody similar to me with a “real future”. Both these girls were solid a 7/10 aesthetically and really nice girls that I could really get along with, while im pretty average guy. Anyways about a year ago when I was really down this one girl came along and wanted to be friends. I didn’t have much going for me and I went along with it. This girl was a bit less attractive tho. Id say about 4/10. And I figured maybe a girl whose a little less pretty would be a bit kinder to me, I was never much for looks anyways. Its not like she’s hideous or anything. Anyways the relationship works far better than any one that I had experienced before. I just feel like we get used to each other the more critical she get of ever thing I do. She’s so possesive too. I can only see my friends when she’s at work because she cries if I don’t spend my time with her. My time is limited too. I barely ever have any for myself with school/work. There are moments where I just feel like breaking it off so I don’t have to deal with her. Then there are other times where I feel like I love her despite everthing. She’s just so varied I can’t keep up :c
I don’t know what to do. Even if I were to call it off, I feel like there would be no way to end it softly and I wouldn’t have a chance with anyone. I really don’t have much to offer and I don’t want to keep getting jerked around by different girls. I just wish my girlfriend was less crazy and possessive. I’ve talked to her about it several times and everytime she either cries or agrees to it and then forgets within a few days :/
Hay paco, i can relate to your expirances. When you menshioned “being dumped for someone with a real future” was that something your ex said to u or is it a case of u personally feeling u don’t have real future ?.
Try not to feel u have nothing to offer and like u would’nt have a chance with anyone. A lot of girls and guys are very quick to fall in and out of relationships in there teens and early 20’s and Your still very young yrself.
Where your at right now in life will change and the way people view you will change with it. I can remember when I was 20 a lot of girls were’nt interested in me it always seemed to be some other guy getting the girl. But as time passed by some of those girls started to see me differently to how thay did befor. I had grown as a person and what thay looked for in a guy changed too. Im friends with some of them now where as years ago thay didnt even wantbo know my name. You might feel abit down about things right now. But beleave me things do change for the better.
You menshioned feeling down when your currant gf approched you. That I could relate to as my ex approched me when I was having a bd time of things. I have read others on here say the same thing. Seems to be a way of attracting theses types. Anyway I hope things are going better with ur gf. Keep ur head up. Don’t let yourself get down.
Its been six months since I left my BPD wife of 14 months. Thank God, Life does get normal again and so much better. I also had a marriage for 22 years before this 14 month marriage, both to BPD’s. Took a little therapy and work to figure why I am a two time BPD loser, but it has gotten a lot better. For those of you out there still in relationships with a BPD, get out! Trust me, get out, there is life afterwards, and it is good!
Ultimately, I blame myself for not being strong. But here is my story. I started seeimg my GF and told her I don’t want a GF, just friends with benefits (as I had just left a long term relationship). She would agree with me and say that’s all she wanted too (she told me she was just recently divorced). After a month or so my mother starts pressuring me to make her my official GF, little did I know she was talking to my mother and manipulating the situation. I gave in to my mother’s logic and made her my GF. After this I found out she was still married and the husband was still staying at her house. I had been going to her house and fucking her, while her husband was at work or away for work. I freaked when she told me, I thought this guy was gunna kill me. As it turned out, he didn’t care and was literally leaving the situation…soon. (Should have seen the signs). Very early in the relationship we went away on holidays together, I thought it was weird but she made out there was something wrong with me if I didn’t want to do these things in life. ( fuck I’m a fool). There I tell her of my upbringing and how I did not want to be married or have children at this time if my life. She agreed. To cut a long and tragic story short, she manipulated the situation and I agreeed for her to move into my apartment in the city. Within weeks the apartment wasn’t good enough and a replacement had to be found. (Fuck I’m a fool). I get another apartment much to my dismay. I had broke up with this chick a few times before we lived together and while we lived together. Each time i took her back cause she was hot and fucked my brains out. My friends warned me about this chick and told me never to cum inside of her. Guess what I did and guess who stopped taking the pill without telling me! Two apartments and a baby later I’m still here. I love my son and that is the only reason I am still around. She knows she has me trapped. I can’t explain all the things that happen, it’s too much and it’s my reality I’m not trying to convince people. But for a long time I believed her. I thought I was the problem. Also the sex is dead now, I wank more than I fuck, an when we do have sex its me pursuing it and getting rejected. its just boring as well. No more reverse cowboy or karma sutra shit, most adventurous it gets now is doggy. No more sexting when we apart. It all just changed.These woman exist and are on the prowl. Educate your sons about sex and types of women. Learn from my mistakes. Stick together boys, cause society will only blame the man in the relationship. I will post more later it gets worse, this is just background info!
don’t do her anymore bud. she’l’l continue the crazy making and make another baby and then you’ll be in dbl trouble, get out when the boy can pick you out in a crowd, when she badgers you and grabs/hits.pinches you , get police reports on any physical abuse you will take. she is/will probably not allowing you to take your baby on your own or to your family. read as much as you can on BPD and understand that she is not attacking you personally, just living and thinking/reasoning all wrong and convince yourself that most likely she will not change . Remember that being a Dad is such a great priviledge and know that when you get away from her your next life begins. Make sure you apply for immediate custody/parenting time before she bolts and goes to social services to make you look like a monster and then it will be months before you see the child. Ask for 50% time with the child, unless she is breast feeding the time may be a bit less but do not bow into that one weekend every two weeks shit. you deserve half parenting time especially as kids get older. Get a different job if need be.The mother will be a good example to the boy of a woman he does not want as he grows up and appreciates you more and more as being the stable one. Your pain is going to be his gain my friend.You have describe a BPD relationship exactly and it seems that you are clever enough to safely pull the ejection seat lever when you have all your ducks in a row. learn to breath when upset with her and keep extra shoes in the car when she chases you out. your not alone bro, not by a long shot. some good reading and links at mgtow.com
I can relate to your wild sex in the beginning of your relationship, towards the end of mine, my ex-girlfriend would just lie there like a piece of wood, no passion, no kissing, no noise and I would have to ask her for it. I told her you make me feel like begging and her reply was that she was not satisfying me and she would then cry. I fell for this behavior, soon I was afraid to ask for anything from her. I did not feel like a man and I started to question my sanity. I believe when you are with someone that you love, it is mutual, you both want each other, however since I did not need her, she felt that the magic was gone. I started to shut down emotionally and started to get stress and over react to anything, I was not myself, I kept making excuses for my ex, I was living a lie in hopes I could make it better. Well that was then, now I am on my own, my girls have seen a huge difference in me since I ask my ex to move out. The only scary thing I am dealing with is that she still wants to see my children and that scares me, it also makes my kids feel uncomfortable as she kept telling them that she was going to leave me and not say anything to me. This is inappropriate and my heart goes out to the mental abuse she put on my children. She is a monster in disguise and I am so glad I told her to move out! I should mention that my children seem relieved that she is gone, watching their dad walk on eggshells for the last 2 years out our 4 years relationship must of been tough on them. Now they get to see their father the happiest he has ever been in ages.
Thanks a lot for posting this. I have seen Hell for 11 Years. 1st thing that she did was cut me off from my friends, then convinced me to leave the family and strike out on my own. Even worse made me stop paying the Insurance premiums and Housing Loan EMIs because it was an unwanted legacy dumped on us by my Father and was eating into the monthly disposable income.
I had a child with her in the 1st yr of marriage and the blame for it was mine, hence sex was stopped as punishment. She also has a black tongue and curses my family at the drop of a hat. My Mom had an accident, dad got paralysed, I lost jobs and finally did not get back to work, till she had no more ornaments to sell.
I thought she would get the point; however having moved to the 7th city in the past 11 years, she is still at it. Lazy as ever, no friends to call her own, spitting venom at me and the child. The house is a mess and I am to blame, the Savings are a mess and I am to blame, Sex is a mess and I am to blame, the daughter is a mess and I am to blame….
I have had enough and since I can’t just run away, I will make her pay for the rest of my life. I am writing this to let the world know that I DO BLAME HER for what I am about to do.
Don’t do what you are thinking about doing. Yes, you can run away.
Running Away?? From the extreme North to the extreme South, to the extreme East and now Extreme West… I have been running through these years. No friends, no family, no place to call my own… a slave of this woman’s moods, eccentricities and utter nonsense. I am going to the Himalayas and will throw away my Cell Phone (just waiting for it get a little warmer there 🙂
I read this website because it gives me strength. I’m not alone, thanks Larmo. I could continue to tell stories about what happens, but it is so draining and i know the answers i will get already. I’m just glad I’m not the only one. This is a great site for guys to vent and give advice to each other. I really do feel I am with a histrionic or borderline GF. i I I think its severe, but I don’t know how to gauge that – Doc? I can tell you though that this has destroyed any possibility of future GF’s. If I ever leave this woman, I will be a confirmed bachelor.
I am married to a person almost identical to the one you describe, and am able to identify 12 courses of conduct as described in your article above. She makes it incredibly difficult to end the relationship for various reason: No job, her car is not in her name as I pay for it, no house of her own and a child (from her previous marriage) at school , and of course no money. In other words, she has nowhere to go or to stay.
She regularly threatens me with other issue as well, which I am not going to discuss here, just to get me to drop the divorce proceeding. She has an array of colourful descriptions of me, amongst others:
1) Fucking useless fat piece of shit
2) Useless fat fuck
3) No wonder you were given up for adoption, not even your mother could love you
4) I want a man to fuck me, not a fat blob of oil
etc. etc.
I need help to get out, but don’t know which way to turn…
My apologies for the graphic descriptions above, but they are her exact words – there is absolutely no embellishment.
Thanks for reading this post.
Wow I got 17 Yes, Just not the lipstick one I don’t really get how that one fits. But add on Physical violence And threats to make my life a living hell, and just plain refusing to get out of my house while I support her, Makes her the Top 1% of the crazy bitch’s ever. I am really stuck between a rock and a hard place, feeling like there’s no way out. I just know I will be much happier alone.
If you want her out, talk to an attorney to begin the eviction process. Also protect yourself. These women are most dangerous when you’re ending the relationship.
I got a yes to them all! You just gotta love life. My stories are too many.. and depressing. But somehow I keep on plugging away hoping for some glimmert of change. I work out of town and when I took a cab home (because she refused to pick me up at the airport). I stood outside the door with my bags for quite a while before I was able relx and go inside.
To be honest, I think my GF would answer ‘yes’ to a few of those questions if asked about me; I sometimes get worked up over trivial things like not being able to find stuff because I think she’s ‘tidied it way’ or something. However, I still think she’s a lot harder on me than I am on her. The thing that get’s me most is her complete lack of accountability. If I’m in the wrong and have upset her I admit my mistakes and apologise unreservedly, perhaps explaining how I felt at the time. When she upsets me she gives a kind of grumpy, childish forced apology and then list the reasons behind her behaviour that illustrate why it wasn’t really her fault and often a reaction to something I have done. Last night we got into a big fight and I attempted to leave the house. She kept grabbing me and refusing to let me leave. I did shout at her, something along the lines of “let me fucking go!” As a result of her attempting to prevent me from leaving my upper body is now covered in nasty scratches. She also ripped my favourite T-shirt apart. This morning when we discussed it, she made out that it was all an accidental by-product of her grabbing me and it’s wrong for me to make her feel bad about my injuries. She also threatened to cut herself last night and actually took a knife out of the kitchen! Because the only third party in the house is her daughter, who automatically takes her side about everything (she did not witness the fight by the way), I am looking in the mirror at all the nasty scratches on my body but still questioning whether it really was all my fault. I didn’t lay a finger on her or damage anything I just shouted at her (she also shouted at me) but it seems like I’m still the bad guy. Every time we have a blazing row I’m always the one who cheers up first and offers the olive branch. Because she continues to sulk, sometimes for days it puts me into the role of the ‘grovelling boyfriend’ who is begging for forgiveness, even if it’s not my fault. She never comes across with a heartfelt apology or a peace offering – it’s always up to me and I’m getting sick of it!!!
Tom, she is violent and cuts herself. She is a stage 5 nutter. It is only a matter of time before she calls the police with a bullshit domestic violence charge. If you do not share a child with this woman get out, get some help for yourself as to why you tolerate this kind of behavior from an intimate partner and don’t look back.
A violent woman is no different than a violent man. What would you tell your sister or a female friend if her boyfriend did what your girlfriend did to you?
I have yes to all but 3. This is crazy that there are so many guys stuck in this situation. In hinde-sight, I did it to myselves. I am the nice guy that did what I was supposed to do. Get married, raise a kid, buy a house, take care of the household, work hard, treated my wife like a princess. I think my actions are reasons for the abusive nature of my wife. She is spoiled to the point where she is unable/unwilling to stop and be thankful for the things she has, she only wants to focus on what she feels is lacking in her life. Whether it be emotional or more tangible. To resinate a common theme from every guy who posted on this site – ‘It’s not HER fault, there can’t be anything wrong with HER. She is a princess. So, it must be…you. You must be the reason for her unhappiness.’ After almost 13 years of marrage (years 7-8 are the worst), I can’t create happiness within another person. She must be responsible for finding pieces and parts of her life that will give her happiness. I have encouraged her to get out and join clubs or take classes or anything that would make her feel happy. And I can tell you that an unhappy person will be unhappy no matter what. Divorse or no divorse, unhappy is unhappy. In an evil way, I take some satisfaction in knowing that unhappy is unhappy no matter what happens with the marrage. But then again this the mother of my child and somewhere in that mess is a woman that I did fall in love with and still do love. So, I wish she could be happy.
At the risk of sounding like a complete a-hole, I blame our modern era for women not being happy in general. Most women are irrational, flighty, emotional, and only serve to create problems for men. They grace us with their ideas, friend problems, work troubles, and feelings that have nothing to do with anything. Am I a terrible listener? Or does she talk too much without saying anything? I can’t help but offer my advice because I am a problem solving- man.
Women have so many choice in this modern and progressive world that they have trouble focusing in on any one thing and being happy. It is like being at a candy store, and trying to decide what candy to get when there are so many options. And everyone tells you from the time you are a little girl that you can do or be anything. You can have any and all the candy in the store because you are a princess and you deserve it. This is not true. You can’t have any type and/or all the candy you want. It will make you sick. You won’t be able to afford it. Image the disappointment on that little girl’s face when she finds out that she can’t have any and/or all the candy. She must choose from a limited set of options.
Now fast forward 25-30 years and see the same look of disappointment on her face when she figures out that life is a lot like that candy store. The princess bubble begins to crack in her early to mid 30s. She must regain her royal status. Which is why the balance of power in the household has shifted. Women now believe that they are equal or even that they are in charge of the household. Roles are no longer clearly defined and there is a struggle at home to define those roles. Yet, someone must be the head of the household, the tie breaking vote, and the ultimate final decider. Men, husbands, fathers, have been immasculated and stripped of our role. We can’t be in charge of our own household. And we will be damned if we will ride the rollercoaster that would be a female head of the household. This struggle creates an unhappy household and eventually will create a single parent household. Women talk about working as a team. Everyone on a team is happier when theirs roles are clearly defined and there is a team captain. It’s only when those team roles are defined and accepted can the team function and win.
My wife is described down to a T on almost everyone of them. She is totally negative in almost every aspect. Its almost as you know her , in the discriptions on the quiz. Im not an angry person or an abusive person i just deal with it. Dang i need some help. Thank you
I knew she was crazy thanks for confirming that I answered yes to 13 of the questions
Yes, yes, yes.
I’ve literally used almost the exact words in your first sentence in the quote above when explaining the craziness to my allies.
Turns out all that going along because you’re easy going and care about her and want to make her happy, and you’re not obsessed with trivial things and are proud of the fact that you’re a flexible mature grown-up who’s keeping his eye on the big picture, etc., etc., ….well all it did was encourage her need to control EVERYTHING.
And when you finally say, hey, it’s my turn to get my way on something, she looks at you like you just landed here from some planet.
You can give them 92% of what they want, and they’ll shake their head in confusion as to why you don’t want to give up your last 8%.
Exactly mirrors my experience with my super controlling ex wife (and now, allegedly, ‘co-parent’).
I read this article ten time already.. I am so speechless… If I only read this 8 year ago. There is a word someone up there said: door mat.
Whooowww…. I am such a door mat, punching bag, you name it… damn I am so fucked…!!!
A lot of these traits fit my (soon to be ex) wife to a tee! 18 years of marriage to a narcissistic bitch will take it’s toll on you for sure! If it wasn’t for my kids, I would of left her years ago. I became a long haul trucker just to keep away. We’ve been split up for less than a week and I’m ready to have a party!
So, guess I’m in the same boat as so many of you guys, actually makes me want to cry knowing I’m not alone.. I could answer yes to almost every question .. 9 years of this and feeling like a shell of my former self(the good version) …. 2 young kids and a longtime together= hard for me to pull the plug on the whole thing… I feel like the little bit that’s left of my soul/self is dying daily because of this.. I am 31, a great father and by most women’s standards highly desirable … wtf am I doing trapped in this is a daily question for me..
A girl I just broke up with was a 10 or more from that list…also I don’t know if this should belong on the list, but she had a habit of going through my personal items, my cell phone, my luggage, etc. I don’t know what she’s looking for, but it’s almost pathological. She had warned me that’s how she is and I would have to accept it if I want a relationship with her. At that point I should have just ran like hell out of there, but I’m sure like many other men in this forum, we all wanted to believe that she could change, or that we could somehow put up with it. I learned my lesson and finally ended things before more time was wasted.
I answered yes to 11 of these. fml, shes’s really great at times which makes it such a mind trap, and then a flip can switch and day turns to night.
14 hits in the list at the top, plus all three of the ‘when you hold her accountable’ test. Thank God I didn’t let her help out when I bought a new place to move us both closer to our work and her kids…I would be in a deep hole now if I had!!!
It’s going to be hard in a way, feeling like the bad guy when I toss her out on her skinny ass, but I have to trust that the empowerment is going to be amazing in the longer term. I’m tired all the time, drink way more than I used to, and haven’t trained well in several years. Time to go back to being ‘me’.
My biggest thanks go out to everyone for posting your experiences, and along the way, helping me with mine.
she answers yes to a few of them, but what about what I like to call a stage five cryer. I got in this relationship about a year and half ago and well I have a 4 month old already. lol. she has a 6 year old from a previous relationship.I thought everything was amazing and was happy to have my first child, bought a house with her and the whole shebang. but slowly even early on started to notice things. like the crying. crying at just about any disagreement so that I am instantly apologizing for something Im not sure I even did. They can even be conversations calm quiet conversations which most are. I’m not a yeller I very quiet even if Im pissed. there are other things her ex husband after 8 years and a child was caught cheating with his best friends wife. So early on I immediatly shrugged the little jealousy s off. and that she had told me she basically raised her other daughter alone cause he was gone all the time for work and what not. And now I work 4 tens and home the rest of the time. since the baby was born I have not left the house aside to go play hockey once a week. But yet I get that ‘ I never help, I do it on my own’ ect ect.’ which is not true I find that I m very involved with my daughter and step daughter. sex life is now really sad even when we have time. And I can’t stress this enough the CRYING. I mean if I disagree on how she does the babies sleeping habits, how she goes about discipling her 6 year old ( a terror I might add, no discipline at all before I met her and coddled like you wouldnt believe) it turns into the poor me cry.
sorry for the spelling mistakes and the rambling of writing , but do you think I may have a problem here?
My Wife had 12 of those. I have two sweet beautiful girls both under 3 years old. I come from a divorced family so I can’t put them through what happened to me because I know how much it upset me growing up. I guess this sounds extreme but I’m willing to die(emotionally) so I can be with them everyday and they can grow up with a father in the house.
My wife lays the “Your not the same man I married trip on me all the time. We’ve had sex maybe 10 tens since she was pregnant with our first kid, three years ago. She shoots me down all the time because she says that she has lost the emotional connection with me. And this behavior did not start with her having children, she was like this since I’ve known here but I was brainwashed into thinking it was my fault. She cares nothing of my feelings and if I criticize her she just turns it into what I did wrong or just wont talk to me or threaten to kick me out of the house. It is always about how I have to change for her.
Also, I’m from and work an hour away from where we live now. Ive had my job since before I met her and at her demand we live literally two minutes away from her parents. So I commute to work everyday and of course she give me a hard time about working to much and not getting home on time. I’ve made all the sacrifices and now Ive been turned into a doormat. And now guess what? “I’m not the man she married”… she killed him off long ago…
Well Doormat. While I sympathize, your wife has already noticed that you are not the same man she married, and your children will also end up with that “emotionally dead” Dad. What is best for them? They’re only 3. Children are very adaptable and they deserve a Dad who is happy and can therefore be the Dad they deserve.
Wow I’m screwed,, mine has at leat 4 traits.She acuses me of being with her for sex.I get it once a month if the stars are aligned.She’s a GF, Has a son, divorced.Realy i tell her getting yelled at , talked down to,disrespected, almost daily.I dont live with her,i have my own house,never married.I put up with all that just to have your cookie once a month.If i listed all the things i have done for her in a year and a bit,, well for what?? whats your opinions??
Thanks for leting me vent
Not married,no children between you and you are staying in this relationship. GET OUT now! Then get help, and learn why you stayed in so long. I was in your shoes, I was foolish enough to marry her. I almost let the relationship destroy me. Run now! Don’t look back! Run……
My wife just told me she could do 100 shots of tequila and she would still remember every detail of what she said…I am always wrong ! Do I have any chance for this marriage to work?
I just broke it off with my girlfriend of 3 years because she got drunk and attacked me. i went out for the first time in a long time with my brother. i never got to go out with him because she wouldn’t let me. i went out had a good time. but one of her friends was out told her i was chatting up a girl. she seen me from afar talking in to a girls ear as you have to because clubs are to loud well pretty much her friend said i was chatting her up. iv never been and will never be unfaithful but just because i talk to a girl in the club im chatting her up. she punched me spit at me kicked me tried to grab what ever she could to hurt me. i just held her back she punched me in the face a few times doh but it didn’t hurt. she was always projecting her stress on me and always moody. when she is hungry she is hard to be around. i always walked on egg shells with her. she would blame her job and college for the way she acted towards me and always made this relationship really hard to be in and work on. she never worked on it with me it was always by myself. i did everything for her to try and make her happy but she never done any thing back for me. after attacking me afew days ago she is going to get help. she is studying to me a Councillor herself. but she is going to go to counselling herself. i still want to be with her even after all of this. i don’t know why my brain still wants this. a big part of me wants to let her get counselling and if she gets better then start up the relationship again. but my family know what happened and they say get out of it for good. but i cant switch off my feelings its sad and stressful and im just lost….
I feel for you as I have been there. Except I went a step further and married her. I was attacked on several occasions as well, verbally slaughtered and blamed for her emptiness and sled esteem problems. Needless to say, I divorced her after 14 months, that was last June. It was hard but the best thing I ever did! Abusive people break the marriage covenant! They are sick people, they will not change if its caused by mental illness like a Borderline Personality Disorder. Do yourself a favor, get out, get out now! You deserve to be treated with dignity and respect, she is abusing you. My counselor told me when I talked like you that I sounded like a battered woman. He was right, because I had been abused. Drop her now and run. Trust me, she just find another guy like you and beat on his soul! Good luck!
thanks for your reply. This is the first time she hit me doh. she has lost her head before but not hit me like she did that night. she was very drunk and she said she cant even remember doing it to me. but she knows she did something terrible to me. last time i seen her she was very down and begging me to stay but i havint talked to her in afew days now. i know the best thing is to just leave it and get on with my life but there is this bit of hope. iv seen the good in her. she is good to everyone else but when it comes to me she is not. she treats me like her dad. like im supposed to do everything for her and not get anything in return but thats not how a relationship works. she is so moody and just always puts a downer on most days because she will lose her head over stop things like forgetting to post something or thinking she lost money when she hadnt. these things change her mood and then from that it causes me to walk on egg shells and it just causes stress for me and in the end we fight. just dont understand people like her atall.
Run for your life!!! I say this from experience – it will only get worse… I have been through your exact situation and am still in it only because I have Two young children with her-otherwise I would be out in a hurry and never look back.. take your life back and forget about the glimmer of hope-its a false hope and I finally learned that after 9 years of hanging on to that hope… I envy your chance to be free and clear… eggshells hurt to walk on when your feet are already bleeding from walking on them for so long… you can do better!!
it would be great if it was as easy as just going but she lives really close to me and goes to the same clubs bars ect and sure even after all of this going on i miss her. sounds fucked up but its true and i dont understand that atall. she is never like this usually but it seems she just lost it that night from many things. she said to me its not my fault its her problems and i know that myself. thats why she is finally going to therapy so she can get through her insecurity and trust issues. she is one of these girls if everything is going good she will find something to put that joy and non drama situation in to a big dramatic stressful one. she seems to push me away and always has when things are going well
Glad to see you respond back. If I may suggest a book before you make any secessions with. It may not apply, but based on much of what you have shared I think it may very well. It’s called “Stop Walking on Eggshells” by Paul T. mason. It helped me to walk away. Without it I would have held on to hope and stayed in a very abusive relationship/marriage. Read it, learn and make a decesion based of information not feelings of hope. I believe in hope, only hope in God though, not my fellow man or sister. The book is an easy read, and for men that have been through what we have been through it can be eye opening to a whole new world of understanding. I learned it was that romantic sense of hope in me that abusive woman preyed on, used to keep me in the relationship, that I could help them change, all the while I was the one changing, letting them deeper in my heart while they tore me apart….think about it…
Your Friend,
Jim
yeah i can get that. Im never going to walk on egg shells again that’s for sure. i went to talk to her last night and she was still in bits over it all and i still care about her and all so i felt it was best i forgive her so she wouldn’t be hard on herself after all these things happen all the time and she is doing the right thing by going to counselling and getting help with it and i told her to keep well away from me until she sorts what ever it is wrong with her. i said maybe in the future we can be friends and that she needs to keep going her stuff as in work and college and all. she needs to just get on with it like i am. i didn’t want to be dragging hate and anger through my moving on period so this was the best thing to do i think. it makes me sleep better at night and not have all this hate and anger for the way she treated me. Now she has to deal with it all herself and i am free from all of her stuff and can start to pick up the pieces.
Bravo my friend! I am happy for you and how you are able to move on. Good luck with the next relationship and I pray you and I pick well next time!
I honestly answered yes to 15 of these questions. I will not use the word hate or allow myself to hate anyone. That is such a waste of my emotions. We have an 8 year old son together and my mission in life is to protect him from her. She is the most beautiful and sexy woman I have ever seen and her entire life has been about her looks. She beleives men will do anything to be with her sexually and uses it. When the day comes that I am not with her anymore I will simply pay for sex when I need it. I can never risk this again. You never see this coming during the time you fall in love. It hits you like a freight train when she lets her guard down.
Sad in Alaska.
Me: “What’s the matter. You seem upset.”
Her: (in a snotty tone) “If you don’t know, then I’m not telling you!”
And I believe she went on to say I didn’t make sense shortly after that. . .
More than 10 from the list here. Unfortunately I married her and had 2 kids. I feel bad for the kids, having to live with her. Judges don’t award custody to men because the mother is a crazy biotch.
Hi guys, I can tell you with complete confidence 95% of married guys out there are screwed one way or another, ours being the extreme case of course.
I read all your strories here and i feel sorry for each and every one of us. The only reason we are in such a bad situation is because the laws allow shit like this to fly. i believe laws should be inforced for deadbeat husbands and abusers, but are very few left now thanks to the laws. Now we have the opposite affect, abusive and very aggressive wives. Why? I’ll tell you why. Media, governement, and upbringing. Woman are always portrayed as sensitive victims and that have to be respected and taken care of no matter what. It’s always about the womans needs and how men are born to serve woman. In history woman have always had the short end of the stick, but for the last 30-40 years it has come down to woman haveing all the rights and men haveing no rights when it comes to family and marriage. While trying to protect womans rights, which i’m all for it, they cancelled any rights men have even if it means your wife is a crazy bitch from hell who is not looking for the welfare of for her family.
I have been married for 20 years, it has been a fucken nightmare. I can relate to all of you here. I gave everything while I was married and it was never good enough. Never cheated and always trying to please. Being married has left a scar that will never heal. The only reason I stuck around for so long is because every time she would throw me out because she was mad at me she would use the kids as leverage to reel me back. This happened countless times over the years.
My kids are older now, so it’s over! She still calls me and says she loves me and wants me back, but i will never make that mistake again! I am about to lose eveything i worked for all my life because i left for good, but it’s well worth it.
I would rather lose everything while I’m alive than lose everything and i’m dead. At least I can be there for my kids.
If you have no kids, RUN and never look back.
My guy was married 20 years too, and Ontario family law says each partner gets half which is exactly what happened. If you own property, then the numbers will be based on appraised or market value so don’t do what they did and pay lawyers for 3 years, cause the lawyers will let you! There is a spousal support calculator online that will help you to determine what support she is entitled too. There is also a child support calculator for the same purpose. My guy shares custody….3.5 days here, 3.5 days there and it works! It’s actually something you get used to, and the child benefits too.
All I can say is it if you can then get out of your situation.
I am the same as many in that I will never walk away from kids, they are my world and I will live through whatever life and my wife can throw at me until they are old enough to leave home, then I will look at my situation and decide if I need out or not,
If I do then it will be with no hesitation.
If however you have no kids and are here then you already know you should get out of the relationship.
Excellent article, but I must say, the comments are also very informative. Actual examples are excellent samples to be warned by. I’ve been married to the same and only woman for 38 years. Married her because she was (is) gorgeous.She went kinda crazy 20 years back from a serious hormone imbalance during menopause, leveled out, been like a steel trap since, but tolerable… she has recently gone weird on me again. I saw and understood all the signs 30 years ago, but stayed in denial or usually just blew it off as being a “woman thing”. I entertained myself with my big boy toys and gallivanting about the globe. I’ve been able to stay with her because I took my marriage vows seriously, I am still hanging in there. I’m not perfect, and added to the issues I’m sure. The part that drives me nuts is her friends all see her craziness, but won’t confront her. When I do, she turns into a screaming banshee, but according to her… there is “something wrong” with me. Oh, yeah, my wife is a city girl, I’m moving to the country and buying a farm. Seriously.
The present cult of victimhood provides a potent weapon. Hitler was first a victim and a complainer then made worse by apeasal and pandering and an abusive woman likewise will only be further convinced that you are the worm if you give her Czekoslovakia. Are you a worm or is she the parasite? however, I don’t recommend violence – at least you can stay out of prison.
Wow. I could answer yes to most of these. My wife just called me and yelled and sweared for no reason; I old her I was coming to see our son tomorrow and somehow it turned into all about her and how bad a father I am. She loves to flip situations around and blame me. I am tired of getti mentally abused. I am literally afraid of her. She is getting help but hast changed. She told me I have mental issues and she basically dragged me to a psychiatrist who confirmed that I was sane. I used to feel like i had to do something nice o make her atleast talk normally to me. now i realise i have no control over her actions. Thank god I found this site. This is the first time I have posted online.
My girlfriend constantly makes me feel like shit and when I’m upset I always feel like I did something wrong. I’ve become more withdrawn from everyone I know and love but she was the love of my life….I don’t know what to do….
First time post. I counted TEN items on the list with the woman I am in a two year relationship. Exclude items: drama queen, red lipstick, earth shattering sex, jealousy, and stalker.
OMG. What can I do?!
Wow, this site is amazing, have been realizing for some time that my wife was NPD but each and every article I read was so gender-biased I started to think she was right when she blamed all our problems on me, the “fat, old, ugly, bald man”. I can tick about 2/3rds of these off in one form or another but I’ll add a few more from personal experience:
1. Cannot walk past a reflective surface without at least glancing in it, she doesn’t even know she is doing it.
2. Only engages with female friends if they have some weakness, real or perceived, (her 3 best friends are another NPD, an alcoholic and a heavily medicated depressive) and are willing to swallow all the bile about the f o u b m.
3. Lies constantly, even about minor things which she has no reason for lying about.
4. Remains “just friends” with each and every former partner, contacts them whenever she wants to talk about the old times and the sex they had and then meets them behind my back, but I shouldn’t be upset if I find out, after all I’m “just jealous that she has friends and I don’t”.
After 7 years I have had enough of my old philosophy of “be kind to unkind people, they probably need it most” and have instigated divorce although we are still living in the same house temporarily. Hoping to get through it with my relationship with my 6 year old daughter intact but already have some indications that it isn’t going to be pretty (have heard some things about falsely accusing me of child abuse!! Good luck with that one, you really shouldn’t have threatened me with that when I was taping you, bitch). Split agreed for 1 Jul, 2 months to go and it has gone eerily quiet, although this may be because she is busy trying to line up the next victim via dating sites, calling all ex-boyfriends and indeed anyone she meets on the train/coffee house etc.
To anyone else out there in the same situation, RUN AWAY, RUN AWAY, and then RUN AWAY further. You cannot help or protect your children from within this situation, get out and get yourself sorted, you will feel better, more energised and stronger for the fight.
Wait until you start recording your conversations for your safety and sanity. Playing them back is often frightening, and somewhat depressing. And when you let her know you’re recording them, she’ll go ballistic, and claim you’ve violated her rights and the basic trust of the marriage. It’s typical behavior for an abusive liar to react poorly when they realize they are on record, and can now be held accountable to anyone that wasn’t at the moment of their hate and anger filled tirade toward you. I’m navigating these waters very carefully because she has more than once threatened to call the police because I’m bigger than her and if I raise my voice its a “violent” attack. Be very careful, all of you, men and women both.
More than half were yes when I went thru them on my current fiance. Could use more help
Run! Best advice I heard after I married a woman like you are talking about. Goes like this. If you are not willing to run as fast as you can to the alter to marry her, then don’t marry her, run in the opposite direction. Think about it!
Are You Still There….I Ended Up On This Site By Googling….”Why Does My Wife Hate Me”…….I Think Im In Trouble……Married 19 Years With 2 Kids..
Hi Tommy,
This is an active thread.
Read through all the posts Tommy. You are not alone.
i am so unhappy with my current wife she is so controlling and she is very jealous and is afraid im going to cheat on her which ive never done on anybody i have tried to leave several times and we just argue and she tells me how much she loves me and needs me should i leave her and move on i was in a 16 year marriage that i was miserable in i dont want to repeat history again.somebody give me advice
My wife fits 10. I would leave except we have two kids and she, surprisingly, is a good mom. I think we have 17 years left or less. She has a hormonal issue which I’ve gotten her to get medicated for, but every month there are rages. The good months are when they are directed externally. There has to be a villain. I think of her as the dad on Talladega Nights who has to get kicked out of an Applebees whenever things are going to well. Same thing here.
My ex-wife matches 12 of the above points. Glad I got the divorce.
I said yes to all of them .. Help I can’t get out of this relationship!!!!
These people seem to be master hypochondrians. I was with my ex in the bathtub when she felt a swollen lymph. She cried “Great! That means cancer!!”, jumped out of the bathtub running franticly into the next room whining, getting aggressive and “poor me” at the same time. I was sitting in the bath thinking “what’s going on here, who is this crazy person?”
Thanks for this article. Thank the lord. Thank you doc. And mostly thanks to all the guys that posted commenta. I read about 50 of them and feel like people i have never seen and met have my back because in one way or the other we are experiancing the same problems. Its unbelievable am happy there are no children involved. Anyhow she thinks shes pregnat once a month allways total bullshit. By the way i answered yes to everything exept stalking and lipstick. So i got it pretty fucked up. Anyhow what about if shes allways making up illneses always something hurts. This is also driving, me nuts everyday its something. Then when she goes crazy its either me or her stomach hurts. As soon as i finish writing this am free. Am just at her old family farm for then weekend. 2 days and i am a free man. Good luck to youmall
I ticked 8 of those, could have been more, but I held up. Its been 8 years now. I have distanced myself from my family and when ever my family comes up as a topic of discussion, (not that it does much), there a firestorm coming. Me spending 1-2 hrs with my friends on a week end is the biggest issue now. Luckily, my family is not with me. I’m clueless. I try everything to make it work, but at least twice a month, I end up being the “baddest man on the planet”..
At least you get to spend occassional time with your friends. My situation has degraded to the point where I may see the one friend I have left a couple of times a year. If I go for more than that it is WW3. And on the rare occasion when I actually get a pass to go hang out, I’m guaranteed a phone call about some stupid, insignificant BS followed by a reminder of the time that has been designated for me to return to my cell. I will be divorcing the bitch very soon. I’m so excited!!
Hey bro, I feel your pain. Mine is trying to distance me from my family right now. Their minor behavior trivialities have become the worst treatment she has received from anyone ever, EVER. Then we talk about it for hours supposedly because I am the one that is upset with them, not her. It is maddening. If I hang with friends she will constantly be sending me text messages the whole time and will try to cut my friend time off by insisting she needs a ride somewhere, or some other help. Here is my advice. Stand up for yourself no matter what. She doesn’t want you to spend time with your friends? That is her problem. Don’t feel guilty. Don’t give in. No matter how psycho she becomes.
So she stabbed me twice, injured my testicles, lied to the police and had me thrown in jail for bruising her arm when trying to stop her from stabbing me a third time. I had the whole thing recorded, not allowed by my lawyer. Dragged my daughter around by her hair (violently). The child protective services lady said that my daughter was too young to testify and she wouldn’t take my word for it. I provided a set of CD’s of my wife’s greatest hits to the INS to try to get her deported. The INS responded by pulling my wife in, telling her that I was trying to destroy her, and gave her immediate citizenship!
My dear wife promised me that if I ever left her or divorced her that she would kill the kids (I believe she would). She prevents me from seeing my friends or family. She is the only person I fear (and I have been in combat) because she is irrational, unpredictable, and has no conscience.
From what I have seen, the system is set against me because I have a penis. I cannot leave because of the children. She threatens to call the police for all sorts of reasons, from taking her clothes out of the washer and putting them in the dryer, to not driving her where she wants to go. Yes, she has followed through on her threats to dial 911 for trivial reasons but the cops never do anything about her.
Her most recent threat is to falsely report my father as a child molester if I don’t do her latest bidding(s) has me constantly on edge. I don’t know where to start to break free, and am frustrated because my Marine Corps training never taught me how to resolve these types of issues peacefully. I am talking to a counselor and going to support groups but just don’t have the faith that the system won’t lock me up for kidnapping my own kids and fleeing the state (or country).
The system is broken when people are judged on gender and not on actions.
Bob, my heart goes out to you, man. Keep videoing and recording/documenting everything you can. Why did your lawyer disallow your video? It may be time for a new lawyer. Which South American country is your wife from?
Your situation is far, far worse than what mine was. However, what worked for me just might work for you…It’s a role of the dice I know, but given what I’ve recently read in the neuroscientific press, it has at least a smidgeon of a chance of helping and no more downside than what you’re currently experiencing.
People that have this personality disorder are highly attracted to someone that is ALL of the following: [this is the all important list of traits that I’m still compiling. PD = Personality disordered]
1) Emotionally stable. At least stable enough for the PD to use as an anchor to stabilize themselves.
2) Prefers order and an organized life. The PD is wildly disorganized both inwardly and outwardly. They do best when there is a system for them to follow and that they can happily rail against whenever they please.
3) Financially stable. The PD doesn’t trust themselves to hold it together emotionally when on the job so they prefer someone who is able to bring home the bacon on a reliable basis.
4) Hungry for love and eager to please. The PD uses this love hunger as the method to hoover you back in over and over. They use the eagerness to please as a weapon against you. Exerting power of you makes them feel emotionally better for a short while. As they say, power is an aphrodisiac.
5) Emotionally sensitive and compassionate. The PD requires that you be emotionally sensitive so that you’re going tracking their movements up and down their crazy emotional roller coaster. Because you’re compassionate, you inherently empathize with their internal emotional plight, enabling them to vampire away at you, and mysteriously to them, you don’t let go until you’re drained dry.
PD’s are wildly certain that you’ll abandon them sooner or later, so they’re always lining up their next emotional feast if they start to see you waver or begin to look extra pale.
So from all this, you could craft a plan, but it will take a few months to carry off, and you may need to learn to act or improv comedy.
1) Become artistically driven. This will drive them insane as they begin to believe that your art making (or music making) is more important than they are. “Pay attention to me!” is what you’ll hear. Double down and sign up for some extra art and music classes. Heck, you may even join a local choir. Attend these classes and sessions regularly because your life depends on it. Practice liberally at home. If you must, get a portable heater and practice in the garage. Wood working might work, but it is too predictable. You have to get really artistic. Think surrealism.
2) Disorder your free-time. Avoid set routines like the plague. Change your bed time an hour each way randomly throughout the week, but ensure that you get ample sleep. If they wake you up at 3am (you know that they will), stumble out of bed while mumbling about something artistic and then lock yourself into the bathroom with some blankets and pillow. In the morning, say nothing about it..just smile while staring off into space as if you’re artistically inspired by something. Also, don’t come home at a reliable time and turn your cell phone off inexplicably for hours at a time. Don’t act defensive if she calls you on any of this. Just mumble and wander away while lost in thought. If she screams at you, you’ve one the daily skirmish.
3) Suddenly blow a bit of money on something crazy, like a guided tour of San Francisco. You simply put in for some vacation time and don’t tell her. Then when you arrive in San Fran, give her a call to let her know that you’ve decided to live it up for a few days in San Fran and not to worry about you. Before she gets any of the details from you, simply hang up without saying goodbye. When you return, she’ll be crazy angry. This is good. But make sure to line up a friend’s house to sleep, just in case. If you get into the dog house like this, you’re making big progress.
4) Stop being hungry for love. You simply have gone rogue on love. You act as if it has totally lost it’s meaning. Instead, you develop an intense interest in something she can’t understand like theoretical physics or economic theory. Privately, you show up for work earlier than usual or stay later than usual and use this time for walking and talking to friends and family. You may need to use a throw-away cell phone for this purpose so that she doesn’t get wise to you. You know she’s the best stalker that ever walked the planet, so take precautions.
5) Become emotionally insensitive to her. When she wails about some miscarriage of justice or about something that occurred during her day, listen to her words but totally ignore the emotional content. When you say something, it’s situationally correct but not responding to her plight. For example, “Oh, my day was horrible! I had to process blood product for 10 patients today and the machine broke and my manager blamed me for it all.” You say, “I was copying a dissertation on Michelangelo and the toner ran dry before I could finish.” Then you wander aimlessly out of the room, pondering your next creative endeavor (next move in this crazy game).
After denying her of an emotional meal for a few weeks, she’ll be cracking. She’ll threaten divorce. Take her up on it dispassionately. Don’t argue with her. Don’t defend yourself. You are a crazy, chaotic artist that has far better things to do with his time. You’ve become self-involved! She may also sleep with her “contingency-plan” guy and tell you about it. Shrug your shoulders when she tells you. You are now hopefully on your way to freedom and you’ll get to keep the kids because she’ll wig out and move on. She is the Emotional Vampire and she must feed to live. You’ve become a cold, inert piece of rock to her devoid of the sustenance that she craves. And it is an intense craving. (I got a punchy text message reply along these lines from my X. She wrote, “You will never find a woman that you emotionally connect with.” And I wrote back 🙂 (smiley-emoticon)
I realize that this is very difficult. You’ll need to take several precautions, especially with the kids. Have money stashed away. Have plans in place with close friends/family-members to take your kids if she totally wiggs out. Chances are though that she won’t. It will just appear like she will. It’s like a game of chicken or a stare-off contest. Don’t blink before she does. She MUST be the one that chooses to leave for you to gain your freedom.
I wish you the best of luck!
Hahahahahahahha. I loved the double down part. You will help many guys with this. You got it down to a science. Thank you very much!
Only 2???
I counted 15 for my first long term girlfriend who trapped me using my child as a weapon.
Still I counted 5 looking back at the third long term relationship I was in and then 2 a piece for the last 2 women I’ve known. All in all I thought those last 2 seemed rather nice by comparison!!
I love this quiz, especially about the make up and red lip stick, bang on with my ex-girlfriend! I am truly blessed, I only spent 4 years with her, the first 2 were wonderful then she started to show her true colors and the rest is history. (it went downhill) I do not have children with her however she is still medellin in my children’s lives and I told her to stop. I asked her to respect my zero contact boundary and to my surprise she disagreed. I don’t know what will happen next but I am mentally and emotionally prepared for her response, then again, she may just leave me alone?? However after reading a lot of the posts on this website, for some strange reason, abusive women like to keep hanging on to some part of their ex-partners lives?
I am a beautiful, loving and caring man, I am not someone’s back up plan, just in case your new life and boyfriend don’t work out!!!
I will keep repeating those words if I ever hear back from her.
Robert.
Every time I read a post from this forum, I keep pinching myself that I got out after 4 years. Why in the world did I want to marry my ex-girlfriend is beyond me?? I am just going through the healing stages right now as it has only been 10 weeks, however every time I keep coming back to this site, I feel a little bit better about myself. Thank you everyone for sharing!
I answered yes to most. I do not know what the hell to do. I wanna just run. Its her way or no way. A Lot of selfishness. There is only one way to do anything. Unfortunately i live with her and everything is either hers our ours. Can’t live with her. Could live without her. She is a good women but very defensive. Always the victim. Very stressful. I don’t see it getting any better. Getting to old for this crap. The women i have been with are either divorced with a couple kids or have a bad addiction to something. Whatever!
It won’t get better. Trust me. Anything she suggests that will make things better in your relationship, make her more secure, etc. is just BS. It will always involve you losing and her winning. And once she has won, she will move the goal post again, setting you up to lose even more. It will only get worse. Best of luck to you.
I answered yes to 11 questions and we’ve been married 12 years. I will never leave my kids. They love me and they need me to stay sane.
I once thought exactly as you did. Decided I could take it for my kids for the exact same reasons you cite. But you can’t do it forever man. I speak from experience and 20 years of having tried it myself. I’ll spare you the details, but when it comes, it’s the end of everything you know, and your kids are in no way spared because you stuck it out. Because status quo means that she’s not getting anything from it, and she will continue to up the ante to get a rise out of you. And in the time before she finally breaks you or even if you hold out? Your kids get to observe and learn to pattern their future relationships based on what they’re living in your house on a daily basis. My advice is to find some way to get you and the kids out if you are genuinely experiencing 11 of these problems AND counseling isn’t clearing anything up. If it really is BPD/NPD or some other three-letter delight, an honest psych will tell you straight up like they did me – it’s a question of how much you can take before you break. It’s not going to stop, and she’s not going to change. You’re not broken yet, so take your time and plan an exit. But time is not on your side.
My advice – don’t be me 8 years from now.
I want to say thanks to everyone for posting your comments here. For what its worth, it is good to know that I am not alone in having somehow married a “crazy bitch.” The article is a virtual checklist of her behavior. When we were dating, the signs were all there and I ignored them. Now the behavior has gotten worse and worse, no matter what I do, and of course it is always all my fault.
I just want out ….I just want her out….im stuck and scared and tired…
I answered yes to 10 of the questions above! She is definitely crazy. Just not sure exactly what diagnosis, if any. We’ve been married for 4 years, have a 9 month old son and its only getting worse. She is definitely emotionally abusive. I’m always the bad guy and she never apologizes even when it seems that she knew she was wrong. She flies off the rails into rages over little things like me forgetting to turn off a light in a room. She pushes and pushes me to react. I respond with the same yelling she gives me, only it’s a little less intense. Then she says I’m mean! WTF! She claims I don’t help her around the house at all! I am in the military, usually work from 6-5. When I get home I help with dishes, bottles etc. But she still seems to think I don’t do anything. She is at home all day with our son. Just installed laminate floors throughout the whole house that SHE wanted and now she’s saying she’s going to leave….WTF! over!
I feel for you. It all sounds so familiar. I’ve read several books since then such as “Stop Walking on Eggshells” and everything else I can get my hands on. The patterns that you describe are sadly very typical of BPD. Push-pull behavior. (She’s not angry about the laminate flooring. And she really won’t leave. You’ll need to either take legal action or move very at away to cause her “to leave”.). Emotional dysregulation….another criteria. In fact this one causes her to act like an “Emotional Vampire”. I recall when I was married and we’d have a major disagreement, if I caved too soon she would get really mad and say she didn’t feel emotionally spent yet so we needed to fight more. Splitting behavior. You or it’s either all good or all bad and there’s no memory of before and no shades of gray. Basically, you are her accessory and if you don’t follow her script for you then you are bad. Sadly, all of this is bad news. She very likely won’t change for the better. And the more you sacrifice your boundaries the worse it will get. You have to remind yourself that a part of her is frozen at 2 years of age and trapped in an adult body. Take a good hard look at real two year olds and you’ll quickly understand. If they have a temper tantrum, you as the adult never give in. You are kind at all times, consistent with your behavior and boundaries, and you don’t yell. You always choose the time when they are calm an rational to talk about major issues. You have to be objective at all times when you are around her. Keep a journal. Beware of her Gaslighting. (See the old black and white movie by that name). Trust yourself and know that BPD is highly associated with emotional and situational dyslexia. Her memory is not to be trusted. Compare notes frequently with other family members and friends. Don’t let he isolate you. With a kid involved the stakes are so much higher. I wish you the best. Good luck.
Wow, that sounds like you have been observing my household and writing about it! Of course she is bluffing about leaving. She will never leave because a) she has a sweet deal, you are paying for everything and b) you are her dumping ground where she can project all of her negativity and you are her whipping boy. However I do suggest that you take her up on her offer to leave. Make it deadly serious and show her the door. She will initially respond in an equally strong manner and threaten right back. You may even get lucky and she will actually leave but don’t count on it. What it will do is open the dialogue of ending it. Then your true battle begins when she backs down and starts to act like that wife you always wanted. Stick to your guns and don’t let her guilt you. It’s a trap to buy time. Trust me, I know. Once you back off the divorce train and settle back in, so will she. And the crazy bitch will resurface and you will have to go through the whole difficult process of getting things back to the brink of divorce all over again.
My ex kept threatening me to leave, then I called her on it! To my surprise I discovered that she had the house, roommates and boyfriend all lined up. I do believe I got lucky, she was angry at me for not begging her to stay. I did not realize she was doing the silent treatment to me with all the games. I was just so tired of all the drama and my soul just shut down and said, “Get out!”
After reading all these posts I do believe I was lucky! I have become so informed to BPD and NPD during the last four months. I am so aware what an unhealthy relationship is now. I am currently working on my self-esteem and worthiness issues so that I do not repeat myself, doing so will make me a better person and father.
I am blessed that now my children will not be exposed to NPD, it would of mess them up as it did me. I have a new sense of self now and I am scared and excited at the same time. I have not felt like this for 20 years, I feel like I have been reborn.
Please find the strength and courage to get out. You deserve happiness, you are worth it!
I answered yes to 15 of the twenty questions after very carefully assessing each one. I’ve been to a shrink before to discuss how to handle myself around her and my online affair that I had (had an online friend as an outlet to dealing with my wife’s insanity). I really feel for her but turns out she was married and playing around with several others. Anyway my life is shit… Wish I was string enough to walk away… Best case would be to find a nice lady to truly fall for and cherish for the rest if my life… Ah, but then I’m dreaming again…
Why not find a shrink who can help you get strong enough to walk away? You hold the keys to the cage you’re in, Charles.
Thank you for the last line Dr. T. “You hold the keys to the cage you’re in, Charles.” When I read it, it almost made me cry. It is so true and each day I now see the truth. It’s been close to 4 months of no contact with my ex and I am slowly becoming clearer. I still struggle but I am thankful that my soul is coming back.
Wow, I checked off 12 from the list! 18 years of marriage, almost all of it hell starting right after we said “I do”. For a few years, I thought it was just stereotypical marital crap, adjustment, etc. Then for a few more I knew it was something larger, but tried like hell to figure out what. Spent the last 12 years in counseling of one form or another; as soon as they start shifting their focus to what’s coming out of her mouth, she denounces them as incompetent and leaves. In 2011 a psychologist finally opened my eyes and pointed me to read up on BPD, said it was really just a question of how much more I could take before she broke me. I had a hard time getting my head around that. I spent another year with that psychologist, asking every week if I had some kind of problem, and she just kept saying, “stop doing that to yourself.” So, it isn’t like I wasn’t asking, because honestly, sometimes you wonder. And sometimes you wish you were the one losing it, because then you could just surrender and get some help and DO SOMETHING about it. But that’s the trick, isn’t it? There’s nothing you can do about it and that was hard for me to accept, mostly because of our kids.
Every talk with the spouse, before I stopped trying, was a tail-chasing experience – like trying to reason with a pissed off 6 year old. Everything was my fault, even the things she says/does. Then says I’m paranoid for “imagining” that she’s just blaming me for everything. Then says that I’m just trying to blame her for everything. WTF?!?! I mean, how the hell do you get anywhere with that? It’s a total mind f*ck, every time. When you realize that everything you say will be twisted and turned back on you in a downward spiral of no-win circular reasoning, you slowly start to withdraw and try not to say anything, which is then itself turned on you. Anything the kids do that annoys her, they learned from me. Abuses me in front of the kids. Loses it with the kids when I’m not around, tells them it’s because I won’t talk to her about “the issues”, as if the kids know or care about her “issues”. It’s past time for me to go.
Funny (not haha) thing here is the common theme of dishes. I make six figures, and she hasn’t had to work in 11 years. She had a college degree before I did and was making a lot more than me early on. She can sit at home and do whatever the hell she wants on her own schedule. And yet, she is miserable, her life sucks, she does “all the work”, everything is on her, nobody helps out. And the constant screaming about DISHES!!! When you have kids under 10 and a 5-person family, there will always be a cup or something out. If found, there will be hell to pay. If she ever has to put dishes in the dishwasher that aren’t hers, there will be hell to pay. Screaming, throwing the dishes into the sink, breaking them on the floor. Surely, her life is hell, but the hell is all in her head. I can’t wait to put this woman out.
10 out of 17, I just left her today. I have no kids but she does. I lived with her and her kids for a year and I was too trusting and I didn’t understand the signs, now because of me helping out with her debt, giving her an authorized visa and not knowing about her gambling addiction i owe 57000 dollars. I have to file for bankruptcy. But she is crazy, she lies and steals from me too. 3 weeks ago she swallowed 60 of her prescription pills in front of me, I plugged her nose and she spit up some of them and then I called the cops. She had to spend 2 days in the loony bin and oddly enough she didn’t want to leave. But it all started when we moved in together she became very possessive like getting very angry when I would spend time with my friends. Now when I look back I realize she was manipulating me the whole time, we moved in together only after 6 months because she said her landlord was selling her house and I said why don’t we move in together and we did and her landlord never sold the house.
But before that she was amazing everything I wanted but even then there was signs I would just over look. Such as her house was always a mess, no pictures on the walls either. She hates her mom too and everyone in her life keeps her at arms length. I never really got to know her friends or her family. She has road rage and would actually follow people who cut her off. She also said her ex hus would beat her and her kid and to me that was always a red flag of a crazy chick looking for sympathy . I think she is delusional too, she asked why hate her so much today, but I just found out she had 2 of my credit cards and in the past month an an half she ripped me off $6000. The more I write this the better I feel about leaving her. There should be a way of warning people about this type of woman. We should have ads like they do for pills. Like does your gf scare you, does her rage turn on like a light-switch does it seem like she doesn’t care about your well-being, well your girlfriend is a crazy bitch. I said today to a friend this past year was like the movie the sixth sense, instead me saying He was dead the whole time, I’m saying she was fucking crazy the whole time. Even though I have file for bankruptcy i’m out without kids or any more connection to her ever and not to put down anyone who has kids with a woman like this but I’m just happy I don’t. I do feel bad for her and the way she is but I have to move on, happiness is what I’m after. I think this is great article but it’s too bad it’s 4 years old and there isn’t much about this type of personality disorder to help or warn others.
This is the first time I have ever posted on the internet, here goes……….
I’m the mom of the victim, stepmom actually. He is/was a happy outgoing guy, part of a decent family that enjoys each other’s company and is usually drama-free. On the very day he graduated police college and got his badge and warrant card, his new girlfriend turned up and moved in with him. She was very sweet and adored him; they got pregnant, “a miracle!” she announced as she thought she couldn’t have kids. We all embraced her and their future dreams.
Turns out, she’d just left a 16 year relationship – the terrible things her ex did to her included killing her cat and trying to steal her dog. Her mother-in-law was evil, physically assaulting her. Her own mother never, ever, cared for her. Her father is nasty, alcoholic and gay. One schizophrenic sister fought with her constantly. The other sister hadn’t spoken to her in years. She is not allowed to communicate her niece and nephew. Her brother was unappreciative of every wonderful thing she’d done for him. Her employer was unfair, only to her. Her doctor was stupid and terrible. She has every food allergy imaginable; and hasn’t slept properly for the past 30 years because of an ‘attempt abduction’ in her childhood (a man asked if she’d like a ride to school}. She is an expert in every single thing. She has no further education, but says that she has a Master’s Degree in Social Work (specializing in grief counselling). And then she gave birth to our lovely grandson…..
Within a few weeks, our victim wasn’t allowed to see his friends, or his family or go out with his workmates. He took $50 out of the cash machine, she immediately called and berate him, then not allow him to access any money at all. Even when he works his series of night shifts, he’s not allowed to go to sleep (she has a list of things that need done immediately). One time he was so sleep deprived from working nights and having a new baby that he raised his voice in frustration. She proclaimed that he might become abusive and has not allowed him to be alone with his son in 20 months. There was not one darn thing he could do to her liking. But he still stuck by her. I could go on and on with stories that would make you say WTF???.
Our entire family has gone through hell watching this crazy witch emasculate our son. How could a normal guy, who makes his living handling bad situations and protecting people turn into such a shell of his former self? We had to wait quietly until he became beaten down enough that he couldn’t fake it any more. Last week he came and spoke to us and we welcomed him, no explanations required. This week he began taking the right steps to disentangle from her, including mending relationships with family and friends, fixing his banking, having the house valued and telling her that he will apply for shared custody. Even though we expect a whirlwind of poison any day now, our son feels better, looks better, brighter and is reclaiming his self respect. Hallelujah.
Have faith in yourself. Don’t live a half-life with a bdp. If you believe you can make it, you’re halfway there. Thanks for listening.
As a fellow victim, I applaud you for being there when he was ready for help. Not every family does that. She will use everything she can dig up to cause him to fear leaving and doubt himself. The best thing you can do is help him stay the course. Probably the most important thing I can say is to buy a very easy to use digital recorder, and for him to record every interaction with her if he isn’t already.
Thanks. Will do. Yesterday he asked her to discuss the plans for splitting up, especially access and custody. She said “I don’t like your tone. I might call the police”. So, no surprise there then!
Well, it sounds a lot like she’s given up on using fear and is going straight to the accusation phase. Again, if he is not recording these conversations, it will be his undoing should she call the police and make a false accusation. It is a must.
Yes, she’s classic bpd. Victim (a police officer), got a call at work today from the Children’s Aid Society. She had reported to them that she was scared to leave their 20 month old son alone with his daddy (reasons unknown to us). Victim offered to come discuss with CAS asap, so now can’t be alone with his son until he’s questioned by CAS next week. His lawyer says that this will backfire on her.
Any advice on how to handle this current episode? Thanks.
I answered yes to 15 of the 17 and I’ve been dating her for 2.5 years. I’m afraid of what will happen and what she will do if I break up with her. Will she hurt herself or me? Will she drop out of college? Should I feel sympathy for her if we break up? Do I have any chance at a happy life with her? I feel like she seriously dampens my free spirit, but I still care about her….what should I do?
Please somebody help
I’m not sure how you could read the posts on this site for any length of time and not already have the answers you need. The key point I would like to make is this – if she really behaves that way and you want out, IT IS NOT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY what she does if you break up with her. Those are her decisions, not yours. You’re staying in an abusive/controlling relationship because of how she might react if you leave? I mean, is there really any better sign that you should?
On the plus side, you’ve shown a healthy amount of introspection, self-doubt, and concern for her feelings. That is to your credit, but in relationships with personality disordered people, they are great weaknesses and used against you daily. If you decide to walk, you need to tap into your inner asshole and make a very clean break and not look back.
Together 11years,married 10. 14 year old son hers 7year old son ours 6year old ours. Got 13 of them yes, I LOVE her but I’m in hell. She loves me the one day and the next day she tells me what a piece of shit I am and that she wants me to f$!,’;g die in front of the children. Tells me that I’m abusive and need help accusing me of sleeping with any and every woman. But maybe get some TLC from her 3 times a month. The children is my strength but it should be the other way around ,us for them not them for me. I just want the pain 2 go away.
Yup. Married 18 yrs coming up. Sexless from pretty much day one. I couldn’t “do it” right so she gave up on sex. Losing my erection out of frustration of trying to “do it right” was the excuse she needed to cut it off for good. Kept working more hours to bring in more money, currently working 70 hours a week and it still isn’t enough. It’s my fault were always broke cause all I do is spend spend spend even though I spend very little on myself and drive shit for vehicles so she can drive something nice. She controls the money and truth is she can’t even balance the dam checkbook. Some of those questions could be answered on a scale of one to ten but she hit them all in the 5 to 10 category. Like someone said its a fricken roller coaster with her and I’m the crazy one with all the problems. I’ve comptiplated suicide because this she has made me feel that fricken worthless. I’d leave her but I can’t get passed her guilt trip that the whole worlds against her, everyone hurts her, nobody cares about her and fairly certain she would be a basket case if I left because after all that would just prove that everyone abandons her eventually. I’m 45 but I’m 70 in married years. 18 years with no sex and a strong sex drive has been nothing but hell. Now I’m bitter about missing out on all the sex in my prime years. Ya she was the sweetest thing until she had be hooked and it was like a switch flipped. Bitch switch that is. Never could do anything right after that. But I’ll probly be dead soon from the stress so whats it all matter anyway? My advice to guys dating, one or two definite yeses to those questions RUN!!!! Run as fast and far as you can or you will end up like me, a beaten, downtrodden shell of a man praying for death to come early. But what do I know? Love is blind….so F**KING Unmercifully BLIND!!! No kids involved because that would have required sex. Although probly a blessing but having children is just one more thing that selfish crazy woman robbed me of. FML!!!
Dude, if you don’t have kids, get up off your ass and GO! After what you say she’s reduced you to, why in the hell would you care what happens to her after you leave?? People like this feed on your misery. It’s not too late. Just go.
You may want to consider picking up a book on Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) for yourself. While she’s slamming you with what appears to you as her personal awful behavior, she’s actually behaving fairly predictably for someone with BPD. By learning to recognize the “Cognitive Distortions” that she’s spilling out, you’ll be much better positioned rationally and emotionally. (I’m suggesting you learn about CBT to help yourself if you are unable to leave). In your post you noted some common ones that she’s practicing on you: Catastrophizing, All or Nothing Thinking, Splitting, and the Blame Game. CBT will help you to quicky recognize the cognitive distortion and properly deal with it. Additionally it will help to reduce your anxiety and hopefully lead to better decision making. (I’m past my BPD relationship and learning all I can.). Good luck!
Get the hell out. No kids involved! Get out run! Then get help, see a therapist, it’s sick that you stayed in it this long. It’s what I did. She will never change. Never never never, RUN!
My wife and I have been together 20 years, and your story is so very similar to mine. I do better in the sex department, averaging about 3 times a year. That’s just an average, it’s normal to go a year or 18 months with no action at all. My sucubus wife feeds on my misery, like yours does. I pray for the strength to one day leave, but I just keep on hoping like a fool that things will get better. I know they won’t and am just trying to enjoy the normal days and pretend I have a good life. Just when I start to think she is settling down, whamo! The Shit hits the fan again and there isn’t a damn thing I can do about it! I feel for you brother and am suffering right along side you!
Stay strong.
Hit the nail on the head! What if she’s the mother if your child, and you would like to marry her but her attitude and negativity are tirelessly forcing you to be the evil bad guy who will eventually swallow a bullet to make it all stop cause she can’t stay happy for 9 consecutive fucking minutes and doesn’t understand that if you didn’t want to be with her, then you would’ve left a long LONG time ago?
Holy Crap – 14 out of 19. Two months out of the relationship, a visit with a therapist, and i’m still somewhat doubting myself. wtf.
This article is awesome. Thank You.
I have come to the conclusion a few months ago that my Ex-wife and most recent Ex- girl friend have pretty severe personality disorders and to make things more difficult for me my Ex-girl is spending time with my children. I must say that I am some what relieved to see that I am by far not the only one stumped by emotionally disturbed,abusive woman.The woman I am currently with is delightfully normal, hopefully no more crazies for me.
Just stumbled across this acticl while frantically googling trying to find a solution to my g/f been such a pyhco bitch. At first she was SO sweet, the sex was fantastic and constant now 4 years and 2 lovely kids later I’m lucky if its once a month. I lost count of how many items matched her behaviour word for word. I do love her but I doubt she knows what love really is. Constant put downs always threating violence from her or her cunt brothers. My life is not my own. I am terrified for my children. After most recent falling out (sons first birthday) my eldest (2 years) sighed an said to me mummy moody. It broke my heart. She saw me crying and comforted me as only a 1 year old can. Never know what to do or say for the best but I’m ALWAYS wrong even starting to doubt what I have said or done. Life has been hard to my g/f so I want to cut her slack but I am going out of my mind. Every day I wake her before work I beg for her to be in a good mood or ill be reduced to tears by 6pm and have to have my children see me as a pathetic wreck. Still soldiering on…..
My heart goes out to J, you remind me of when my narcissistic ex-wife left me and my two girls. They saw me crying and tried to comfort me. I did end up divorcing my ex-wife then I met a borderline personality disorder woman, well after 4 years of that, I finally told her to leave. I guess I did learn something from my marriage as it took my 9 years to wake up.
I am slowly getting better and I am so empowered with the information I am learning from this site and others.
I don’t know what else to say to you is that except, you have to look after yourself! If you are strong, then you will be strong for your children. You have to make make some serious choices with your life. You do not deserve to be a victim of abuse, no one does and if you don’t do something soon, you will be a shell of a man, modeling to your children that you have no boundaries.
You are not crazy, you are a man with feelings that loves your children to endure what you are enduring but it won’t last forever, you will break down and I do not wish that for you.
Get help and support ASAP!!!!
Every single one except for admitting to being a drama queen and wearing too much red lipstick! I really don’t know how much more of this I can put up with anymore.
So far I’ve only seen guys talking about their crazy girlfriends/wives. Well, I am a chick with a wife…who is crazy. Yesterday, she went off her rocker because I asked her what she wanted for lunch. She screamed at me that she didn’t know. When I asked her why she snapped at me, she said it was my fault because I don’t ever listen and she just knew that I wouldn’t think her answer was good enough and would get mad at her. This then led to her taking her phone out and recording everything I said because apparently I have a hard time remembering what she tells me or what I say. However, an hour later when she accused me of calling her a fucking retard (which I absolutely did not), she conveniently could not play the recording back.
I answered yes to 11 of the questions. I absolutely adore her and love her to pieces, but it is getting so difficult to deal with some of these things. The most difficult is when we are having a seemingly normal convo, and, in the blink of an eye, she turns a 180 and loses her shit. I try to talk to her about things, but she completely shuts me out and pouts. I ask her to please explain what she feels I did wrong, but she is always very vague, and then she will accuse me later of not listening to her because I couldn’t decipher her coded message. I’ve moved to the other side of the world to be with her, we’ve been together for 3 years right now, and I don’t really want to leave because the good times are super fantastic. We do actually have more good times than bad….I just am exhausted from her personality switching. It happens without notice and can never be predicted. I don’t know how to handle it at all. Talking doesn’t work, not talking doesn’t work, walking away doesn’t work, telling her to chillax doesn’t work, losing my shit back at her doesn’t work. I don’t know what to do. Can someone PLEASE help me.
You should read “Stop Walking on Eggshells” by Paul Mason. Then read “What Makes Narcissists Tick” by Kathleen Krajco. (You can always use IPhone/iPad VoiceOver feature or similar droid capability to read them to you from Kindle). Once you’ve read these you can search on the free peer reviewed medical site “PLOS Medicine” and search for “Borderline Personality Disorder” for deeper neuroscience articles. Although DBT (Dialectical Behavior Therapy) can notably reduce the symptoms that you describe, it is not a cure, it’s expensive, and it requires the full commitment of the BPD/NPD individual. CBT (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) is a key component of DBT. There are many excellent books on CBT. Because its all skills based, you can learn it. While mastering it will help her in the long run, studies have shown that it can make you more anxious and frustrated in the short run. You are dealing with a condition that has deep genetic roots and topped off with environmental factors that tipped her brain development in the wrong direction when she was young. It is not a chemical imbalance issue. It is structural. According to the N.I.C.E. guidelines, no medication currently available has been scientifically proven to reduce the symptoms of BPD/NPD. (Although doctors who are oblivious if the latest research will keep trying and likely also practice polypharmacy.). Because the problem is structural, it takes at least a few years of dedicated effort to forge new and crucial pathways in the brain. Success rates with the best therapy available is around 30% in a limited sense according to the diagnostic criteria. And about 10% if your success metric is achieving functional and emotional normality. So there is hope. “Best Therapy” requires a dedicated team of professionals and often includes living in a therapeutic community for a year.
I send you many good wishes.
Sorry to hear that you’re in the same boat as the rest of us. Unfortunately, not a lot of attention is given to dysfunction in same-sex relationships. My advise for you is the same as for a guy…. Get out, as quickly and safely as you can.
If you stay it will not get any better and you’ll waste years of your life that you’ll never get back.
I apologize if I sound pessimistic, but that is how I see it.
I agree with B.E.C. The best advice is to leave, and the sooner the better. And if you think I’m saying that lightly, I’m currently in the middle of ending a 19-year marriage with three kids in the mix. It’s hell on earth watching kids suffer, and it’s the end of everything I know. But in the last 6 months alone, I came close to nervous breakdown twice. I have PTSD from the emotional whip-saw you describe, and never, ever being able to relax in my own home. To put it in perspective, I volunteered to go to Afghanistan for 8 months as a break.
The biggest hurdle is getting them to admit they even have a problem or play any part in why things are bad. In their minds, what you do is your fault and you’re bad, and everything THEY do is your fault, and their fully justified as the blameless victim. They’re just responding to your many offenses, real or imagined. Most likely, they’ll continue to blame you for everything in a no-win logic loop from hell. As you have already observed, there is no correct response of any kind. Which has led me to conclude that they aren’t interesting in any kind of resolution – they want to see you hurt. As the first respondent indicated, there is treatment, but you can also see your odds are worse than Vegas. It’s sad for everyone, but at some point you have to recognize these types feed on your misery and confusion, and they are instinctively (not intentionally) trying to destroy you. Like the last psychologist I saw said – “it’s really just a question of how much more you can take before she breaks you.”
Your call. There’s a lot of life out there to live.
Check out
THE LESBIAN BORDERLINE – For the Love of Mother
By Shari Schreiber, M.A.
http://www.GettinBetter.com
I answered yes 14 Times!
60% of the time she is normal and seems to want a good life. The rest of the time she is Satan incarnate!
I just don’t know why I put myself through this!
I answered yes to all except two (the makeup question and jealously). It’s like the doctor interviewed my wife to come up with these questions. I have seen her go from crying to rage to laughter to “normal” and back to crying again literally in less the two minutes. When she is on her meds she is somewhat normal but a real time bomb when she is off of them. It’s like a nuclear powered roller coaster.
you forgot one: Does she hold you hostage with your children?
That’s probably the most important one.
omg my love is nutts more yes`s not a lot of no`s have son with her she has 2 kids that I love like my own and I cant take it any more this breaks my hart I don’t even know how to handle this guess just be kind
so i’ve been married to this woman for 2 years and i found this site and answered yes to 15 of the questions, got yelled at this morning for a missing pair of scissors. Everything I do in our relationship is wrong somehow, if I get her flowers I get yelled at for wasting money but if I don’t buy her a new iphone i’m a bastard
Similar to your scissors episode, I had a hairbrush one that was so memorable that it’s still etched in my brain nearly 9 years later (the last 7 of which I’ve been divorced). She kept inexplicably losing them and I kept buying more. There must have been over two dozen brushes in the house in weird random places that she left them. I always tried to keep a brush in one place, but after she cut the string I tied it to the wall with, I started hiding one while still buying more for her and putting them in the bathroom. One fate full day, she couldn’t see a brush in the bathroom and refused to look for one. She knew I had one hidden somewhere and she screamed at me with such intensity for nearly a half hour. It was at that point that I knew she was completely bonkers! Any vestige of romantic thoughts that had clouded my powers of observation were ripped off like a long-applied band-aid. The time for my excuses that I made to myself about her behavior was over! It never got better with her and sadly my kids have to continue to interact with her. She’s also so arrogantly stubborn that she would never consider behavioral therapy like DBT or CBT. But as a parent, knowing that she’s really a troubled two year-old trapped in an adult body has made it much easier to deal with, especially now that I’m not living with her. Parenting books for the “Terrible Two’s” have been incredibly helpful to me. My advice to you is to save yourself. You’re no good to society if she drives you insane or to an early grave. Life is too short!
Good luck.
Recently my wife got mad because her bath water was running too long, threw her phone on the floor and said I dont help with anything (screaming). It wasn’t even barely half full of water! Over and over again every day. Same story, different means if delivery. I don’t think I’ll stop being surprised. Sucks cause I have to stick it out with my 15 month old son. I’m in the military so getting custody with divorce would be tough and I definitely don’t want her raising him alone. She flies off the rails too often and over nothing.
Start documenting and RECORDING these things. After several months of it, walk your ass to a good lawyer and get your kid. You might want to have a resume ready to go at USAJobs.gov and be ready to transition out just in case, but there are plenty of single parents in the military. You can do it, but don’t keep doing what you are doing.
HI,
I am 26 and my wife is 22, we are married for last 3 years. my wife is pretty, she loves me a lot and I love her as well. but last one and half year, I dont know what happeded she is really changed. she get mad at me without any reason sometime. she call me devil when she is angry, start shouting like mad, i always has to worry about what neighbor thinking, its sound like i m beating her. she only stop when I start feeling really sad and broke. maybe hour later she come to me and apology, everything normal after that. its her college break now, she has no class. few nights ago after I came back from work, we were very normal and romantic, i tried to make silly face to annoy her, you know like most couple do when they are on good mood. but she started screaming, I was worried what neighbor will thought ( it was 1 am) asked her not to do that, she got angry after that, she than slap me, and I made a big mistake I slap her back, that pull the last button, she got blasted, tried to trough my laptop, I took the laptop away, try to stop her, she than take the fruit basket and trough that the wall, try to broke her laptop, and start shouting at me how dare I slap her, I am devil, I ruined her life, I am not a human. I was keep saying sorry, and trying to calm her down and telling her about that what neighbor will think, they might call police and thing can get nasty, I can be arrested, but she didnt stop, she was saying I should be arrested, I was in shock than. she keep screaming next 15 min and saying I am bad, My father was bad, thats why I am like this, My whole family is bad and staff… I felt very sad this time, and got emotional and could not kept my tear and told her, I know after an hour you will calm down and realize that you hurt someone, but you should know I will not be normal with you this time so easily after you do this to me. she didnt bother, I than left to bedroom.
after an hour she came to me and say sorry, but this time I didnt feel that I love her like before and cant talk to her, that night I cant sleep whole night, I cant forget her face during the time she was mad, I start to be silent with her last 3 days, he kept saying sorry. it was never happened before I have never stop talking to her more than an hour before, I could not. I never left house without say goodbye to her but i did this last 3 days. I cant forget her mad face that night and the thing she was saying about my late father who she never saw.
I still love her, I know she love me as well. I know I cant spent my life without her, I know she is not a bad girl, but I am worried, what happended to her why she gone mad without any argument or any reason, I dont know what to do. but I still does not find any motivation to talk to her just yet, But its not good. but I am really hurt by her behavior that night.
So sad to hear your story, it’s exactly what I have lived through — sadly it won’t change no matter how much you want it to.. it gets worse with time and eventually the cops will come, she will hurt you and may even end up doing worse.. I was the same age as you when my wife started getting worse (now I’m 32) and the same cycles have happened a million times over, she was hospitalized after trying to run our car into a wall on the freeway on Christmas Eve 5 years ago.. it doesn’t get better you just lose more and more of yourself as time goes on… if you don’t have KIDS–RUN FOR YOUR LIFE
What this guy said. Except I’ll say even if you DO have kids, RUN FOR YOUR LIFE, but TAKE THEM WITH YOU! I did.
You can’t spend your life without her? You might want to look into co-dependency and how that enables what you’re dealing with. Every time she rages, fakes an apology, and you accept it, she’s walked your boundaries back. If you don’t establish some firm boundaries soon, you’ll find you’ve given ground to her rages until you one day discover you have no ground left to give. In my case, when I established some boundaries for her (refused to have one-sided “relationship” talks where she could abuse me, for example), she realized she could no longer get her abuse high from me, so she went a filed for divorce. Strangely, I immediately felt relief that it would soon really be over. I almost thanked her. I might still when it goes final.
You’ll find out one way or another that you can live without the abuse. It’s only a question of whether you flushed more years of your life away waiting for someone to come make everything better. No one will. Do yourself a favor and start a daily journal. Write down EVERYTHING that happens, but don’t say what you think about it or what it means. Keep it factual – “Today she said ‘X’ and did ‘Y’.” It’ll likely help you out later.
RUN! You say she loves you and thats not the truth. I have been right where you are. And I ran! I learned later that she was incapable of loving me, its part of that craziness. Once I came to terms with that everything else in our relationship was a lie. If someone truly loved you they would not treat you like this! You deserve better, no matter what. There is no saving them either. Chances are you have dated other women like this, i know i dated several of them. I got help to figure our why I was attracting the crazy women. There was a reason and I hope to never do it again! Good luck. Oh yes and in conclusion……RUN! FUCKING RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!
Dude, please tell us the reason you were attracting crazy women, because it might save a few of us here the trouble of going through this again. Every time I go out, some absolute nutter throws herself at me.
I just came across this article and would like any kind of advice that can come my way. I’d really appreciate if the person providing me with the advice can keep in mind that I am Indian and so is my wife and despite being hindu and muslim which might be looked at as poles apart we did fall in love and come together. She had always been overly insecure about me and I was an outgoing person who had friends was interactive with most family members and had more of a social circle than I have now. I answered yes to almost all the points above, leaving aside one or two at the most. I converted to her religion as one she wasn’t willing to convert to mine and we had to do a quick marriage like in a day before we ended up facing any opposition from her family members as they believe they go to hell along with the entire family if they marry someone outside their religion. Plus they could very well say the marriage never happened and its a fraud so legally was pressure. while dating everything was great we met it was as good as being in heaven on earth she’d do anything to be with me and me to be with her, later I realized she is extremely clingy and has a superlative inferiority complex. We decided to support each other while getting married but soon after she decided to not work for months and take money from her parents who were more than happy to give it to her and talk dirty about me since she was taking it. the sex was awesome and was kind of wanted but over they last four years the constant doubting for no reason doubting with other women nd if not other women my love for her since apparently she feels she is not good for me. Finances should be spent the way she deems fit otherwise there are dramas. Has alienated herself from family and in the process I have also begun to feel that way about my family towards me and I can’t blame them at all. She wants to drink n smoke n 420 but not contribute towards the expenses for them, she threatens to take legal action for anything and everything, she threatens to leave when I turn a deaf ear and don’t fuel the argument/discussion/debate. There hardly is a time we even speak to each other, she always has to have or create a difference in opinion just for the heck of a debate when she knows my opinion is better and eventually after hours of fighting we do agree with my opinion. If I say A she will never say A she has to say some other letter from the alphabet but A. I listen to her then she goes on adding to the delusional imaginary feelings and accusations and abuses. I try to reason for such behavior there apparently is no reason why she behaves this way. If I give a deaf ear she will start yelling aswell, we’ve been asked to move 3 houses in 4 years. If I yell back I am looked at as the bad guy. everyone gives me the same advice which is to cut my losses and leave, except a few friends, plus my own emotions of being in love with her and investing all I ever had to make this marriage happen and this relationship work, plus the stigma of being a divorcee I am pretty young @ 28 and I am also sceptical considering many if not most women in todays world are a lot similar if not just like her, I dont wanna move back to living with my parents and dont wanna feel like a loser living alone and being pitied on for being a divorcee, plus the lawas in India are extremely women centric and its not like the states where one is innocent till proven guilty here you’re guilty till proven innocent so she can put cases on me I’d be charged and sent to jail and only after 6 months or so will the goverment verify if the charges against me were genuine or not, getting a job will also become extremely difficult if you have been to jail I presume. I really want to start a family and have kids, but with the eccentric and alienated behaviour I feel I am bringing in souls to a life of misery and eternal twistedness as this is what generally happens to people living with and being brought up by such a person. I mean stupid things are argued upon and hours of the day, weeks and months and years have gone by wasted over nothing, more important issues are swept under the carpet always. Complete disregard towards my parents and family and sometimes towards me, I have doubts she might be cheating and in such a way nobody can find out or know or tell me even if they do. I have to make excuses for her behaviour almost everywhere most of the time. I am being looked at as a sadist who is enjoying abuse and the abuse has become a part of my life. I am much more at peace when she is not around and I am extremely unhappy she does everything exactly the opposite of the way its told to her. If I say dont raise your volume she will shout and so on n so forth. Unfortunately for me a divorce could mean ruin as my finances will get ruined and if she puts cases on me I can end up doing time for sometime which means in all probability to not get a job in the future. I have started drinking and that has become a habit that wasnt when we had met. I sometimes feel the only way to make her shut up is by shutting myself to her. She doesnt want to go to a councellor ever. My marriage is pretty much on the rocks but for some reason the wee bit of love and attraction and not to mention all the fears of being alone, jail, financial ruin, being pitied etc. are not letting me be firm with a decision of just going to the lawyer and getting a divorce. I feel like I have trapped myself into loving a psycho and leaving would be throwing them off a cliff but at the same time staying can mean going mad to the point of jumping off the cliff myself. I still love her and I have given my best and my life to this relationship. Its sad it hasnt and is not shaping up the way I expected and I dont want to feel like a looser by giving up either. I feel super helpless.
Hi Big O,
You’ve gotten yourself into quite the pickle and I’ve given your question a lot of thought. Your friends that suggest that you get out are totally correct. The question that you should be asking yourself is “how”?
You don’t want kids with her as they will have a significantly higher chance of having the same issues that she does. A good portion of your wife’s problems are genetic and the other 30% is environment. Sadly, she’ll provide that necessary 30% hellish environment to ensure that at least one of your kids becomes just like her. You don’t want to add more people like her to our already overcrowded planet. So before I continue, find a quiet place and imagine that you are 46 (twenty years older). What would your future self tell your current self? If your future self had kids with your current wife, you can bet dimes to dollars that you’re future self would be cursing you right now. But you have a choice! It may be difficult, but you are the only one with free will and the power to act on it. So “man-up”! And I say this as a father of three kids. So I’m being sincere and trying to make up for a smidgeon of my mistake that you’re on the verge of making.
So you need out and the laws and society are not on your side. But you’re young and you have time and she hasn’t completely broken your spirit “yet”. The best advice to give someone who is a P.O.W. (prisoner of war) is to escape as soon as possible while you still have the energy to run. So now to the escape planning. You have a few clear alternatives and maybe more. Take some quiet time away from her to sketch out each alternative with the pro’s and con’s. Be serious about this planning. It is your primary mission! You must save what you can of the human race. Before beginning any of these alternatives, you must stash at least three months of money for basic living expenses with a good friend or family member. Ideally, you have a few back-up places to sleep so that you can “couch surf” if needed so you don’t need to spend much money when you’re locked out, or you need to leave for safety reasons. You should carry a voice recorder with you at all times. If she becomes physically violent with you, you’ll need to record what she’s saying as evidence. She’ll pathologically lie, so you’ll need friends to witness for you should this get dragged into court. Always have an alibi that can be legally corroborated. Only sleep at friends/family places if you’re not at home. Have a spare set of clothes stashed outside of the house, perhaps at the office. Be prepared for her to destroy your cell phone. Buy a backup throw-away phone ahead of time with key phone numbers written down somewhere safe outside of your home. I’m sure there are several other measures that you should take. For all of these alternatives, you must be strictly celibate. I can’t emphasize this point enough! She will likely try to get pregnant by poking holes in your protection or by other nefarious means. (I have a friend that this happened to). If you want to have kids in the future with another woman, you can’t get “fixed” right now, so the only alternative is to consider yourself a holy person that is completely and utterly celibate. Think of it as reclaiming your man-hood. Otherwise it is her weapon to use against you.
Alternative 1: This is the toughest alternative and it’s the long-play. It’s probably also the worst alternative, but your “current self” may think it’s the best. Imagine that you’re living with a vampire. She craves your emotional blood. She must feed. If she doesn’t, she’ll become a dried out corpse on a hell bent fit of infinite rage. (the rage in your wife’s type of NPD is the dark ultimate malignant rage type and it is impossible to satiate). So your first step is to deny her blood. Even bed bugs will die if denied blood…for three months. She’ll need to be denied for at least six months! You must completely stop having sex with her. Say that it’s a medical issue. You must remove every weapon in her emotional arsenal. You are the lone wolf. The independent one that must stay strong and celibate until you are free. If she tries to engage in an argument, which she’ll do almost constantly, you must act as if you are a Vulcan (Star Trek reference), completely rational, incapable of showing emotion. And no desire to argue with her. It doesn’t matter what she says, unless it is life threatening. As I used to say to my kids, “is blood gushing? is a bone sticking out of your arm or leg?” Good. And then you return to your endeavor of reading. You should consider reading things that have absolutely no interest to her. I suggest theoretical physics, environmental science, or cosmology. If she tries to argue with you, you can simply start reading to her or quote something from memory. String theory and calculus are great things to quote about. (I also liked the book “Imaginary Tale of Square Root of Negative One” for it’s beneficial effects.) She’ll complain that you’re not a poet. Say that you’re a scientist at heart and that you are after deeper meaning. If she takes away your books, you can simply spend time at the library. Or in the worst case, take up meditation and graduate to examining the beads of moisture that collect on the undersides of leaves. Express endless fascination at the natural world. Totally “geek out” about it. In fact, she won’t be able to take the natural world away from you because it is everywhere. Your absorption into physics, math, and nature will be her undoing. She’ll try to get the “old Big O” back by taunting you, teasing you, taking away whatever you value. Your response is to value nothing but the natural world. You have nothing but your appreciation for the cosmos. For in truth, as long as you’re married to her, you have nothing. And you need to get used to the idea that you’ll need to rebuild your wealth once this is over, because you’ve chosen Alternative 1…where you deny her blood until she starves and must find another victim to feed off of. At some point, I predict within a year, she’ll have “moved on” But don’t get cocky! She will act like she’s ready to move on just to entrap you and “hoover you” back. Continue your act until the paperwork is signed AND you’ve relocated to another city or town that’s at least several hours away. The problem is, once she’s fed for this long, she may come back to feed on you again a few years from now. She’s addicted to your emotional blood. It’s happened to me! So beware. You may wish that you had emigrated to another country, changed your name, and sworn your family to secrecy.
Alternative 2: This is the brutal, “I’m going to change you” approach, but with zero true hope of actually changing her. This alternative will make your current situation seem like paradise, because if you follow this alternative, you’re life will feel like you’ve entered a lower level of Dante’s Inferno for about six months. The key step is to combine strict celibacy with setting strict boundaries. A small physical one, like you must spend half an hour every evening walking alone. Don’t explain why. The time out is clearly not enough to get into any trouble. She’ll wail, scream, complain, and worse. You must stick to this boundary consistently like you are training a troublesome German Shepherd dog. If you slip up once, the dog remembers and knows that you’re weak. You must show no weakness. Do not negotiate! She will take any softening in your position as certain weakness and then exploit it. This boundary is the line between the world and your sacred space. She will try to violate it in every way imaginable. Hopefully you are a much faster runner than she is and good at dodging flying objects. When you return home, she may become quite violent. I recommend a bicycle helmet and adopting a broom closet. Or better yet, when the plates begin to fly, simply say that you have to leave again. She will lock you out of the house. You must have a backup place to sleep. Don’t complain. As long as you’re true to your boundary, she’ll know that you’re winning. This is war, but she doesn’t have the emotional well to draw from like you do. (you’re still strong and you haven’t waited too long to get out) Once this first boundary is working well (I give it a 75% chance of working in your circumstance), then add a second boundary. This one should be something that you do just for yourself like art, music, writing, or something else creative. In fact, expressing your creative side will drive her crazy! Creativity is the exact opposite of what they crave because you are doing something for you, not them. Sure she’ll criticize everything that you create and do, but you are not looking for her attention or acceptance. This second boundary once again is about setting a set time at least a few times a week for at least a couple hours to do “your thing”. The third boundary is money. You must reclaim control of your money. I suggest opening up a second account and putting a set amount of money into it each month for her. Don’t let her touch the primary account, which you’ll use to cover all basic expenses. You can be transparent about this primary account, showing her the monthly statements. But you need to own the decisions on it. By this point, she’ll be cracking. People with BPD/NPD hate boundary setting even though it is the best thing for their mental health long-term. She will want nothing more than to run, or move as far away as she can from you. It’s as if you’ve held a cross and holy water and she’s the vampire. She will vanish from you and even her family for a time. You’ll need to use your recordings and keep a good journal with lots of corroborating conversations with your friends so that the police don’t think that you did something with her. Once she’s gone, put your affairs in order, complete the divorce as “abandonment” find a new job and move. Give your family strict orders not to provide your new phone number or address to her, no matter what her story. (and she’ll make up a rather convincing one when she’s decided to return and “try again”)
Alternative 3: This is the safest plan, but perhaps the most difficult for you to perform. You must leave the country. The wonderful thing about Earth is that Skype is everywhere and it’s free. (I know, my kids use it all the time to Skype to New Zealand, Finland, and India). To do this, you’ll need to find a country that you can work in. If you have a Masters or PhD, you can easily get a job in Canada or the U.S. on a green card or H1B visa. Another option is to join the Peace Corp and go to wherever they send you. Remember, you’ve already lost all your money. What you’re saving is your sanity and your ability to be a father to normal kids that you are proud of. If you’re not highly educated, I personally like the Peace Corp idea. It gives you purpose, you’ll live light on your feet, and it will give you the year or three that you need to emotionally heal. Until you do, you’ll all too easily become a victim all over again. You should focus on developing your creative skills and deepen academic interests because both of these will act like giant cloves of garlic that will ward off future emotional vampires. Most of all, you must discover who you want to be and become outwardly stubborn about it. Do not be “hungry for love!” I know this alternative is the hardest because you’re uprooting yourself and essentially abandoning her. She may file legal action because you’re no longer supporting her. But the reality is that extradition is not done in these cases. (my Aunt did this alternative and he did sue. But keeping the case open is costly and after a year he let it drop.) I doubt that her family will provide her the money to keep a legal suit alive for more than a year. Once it’s dropped, you’re free to return home or find some other place on Earth to call home. It’s a nice planet. You should travel more by yourself. It’s only when you’ve become truly independent that you are safe to find the woman of your dreams.
Good luck!
This is not funny. All you people have cameras in my house and are simply replaying all the actions you’ve seen on the replays!
Of late, I’ve been refusing to engage with my CBW. It’s been working well, but I let my guard down tonight. She started on the near nightly bed time complaint and poor pitiful wife act. And I was stupid and tried to “work through it”.
Now I’m on the couch at 1 am trying to wind down.
I think most are familiar.
No contact sure sounds like a good idea. Haven’t tried that yet.
Careful here, bro. You’re denying her emotional feeding time. You’re entering the phase I started about 8-10 months ago. I told her if there was some home/family business that needed attention we could discuss it. If she wanted to talk about movies, news, the weather, or anything positive/constructive, we could do that. But I bluntly refused to enter into another useless, destructive, tail-chasing, no-win, zero-sum, “relationship” talk where she dumped sh*t on me and I was not allowed to comment. She kept trying to do it, and I stood my ground. When it became clear to her that I would no longer allow her to get her fix from me, she immediately and tirelessly broadcast a cover story to all her amazing, glorious girlfriends and sisters (/sarc), and filed on me. It was hard to watch all our mutual friends fall away and take her side – especially as my male friends cowed to their wives and went no contact with me, while their wives doubled up on inviting the ex out for “support” and plenty of wine. I was truly on my own, but that actually helped. It’s times like that you find out who your real friends are, and who is a flake with no balls. Turns out there’s a lot of nutless flakes out there. And sometimes if the only one you can rely on is you, you find that that’s enough.
At that point, whatever reserves sympathy and mercy I had for her condition went to zero. I was friendless and on my last patch of solid ground. So now I do all my talking through a lawyer and custody evaluator. And unless the evaluator was pulling my chain, it’s about to get very interesting around here.
I, like all of you, was married to an absolute emotional terror. I’m out after 20 years. I waited until my kids were over 18. I stayed 20 years for them and it was harder than doing hard jail time. I came out of it financially ruined and emotional destroyed. It’s been 10 months and I feel I have my sanity back. The only thing that’s bothering me and I feel very sad about is that my 3 beautiful children will not talk to me because they tell me their mother does not want them to have any contact with me. She is the most malicious person I ever met in my life. Everyone tells me to be patient with them and they will realize its wrong, I wonder. But it’s very hard not seeing them. Besides that I am grateful that at least I have myself back. Be strong boys!
Don’t sit back idle! Show your kids you love them! fight for them! Do everything you can legally to get them every moment you can. they will need you if they are living with a BPD! Don’t leave them with her for God sakes! Scary and sad!
Amen brother Amen
Thanks for the help. After two years being married to a controlling, dramatic bully, the last straw was when she told me to leave(December 29). I left. I’ve been unemployed 11 months. It was cold and snowing. Three days later she was apologizing. We went to a marriage counselor three weeks later. She admitted she was controlling, dramatic but not a bully. The counselor just listened, didn’t offer any advice. At the end of the session I made the announcement I was relocating to another state. She was pissed, she said she was ambushed. I thanked the counselor for his time then left. I’m broke as hell but I have peace.
Congrats, brother. I’m kind of jealous, actually, that you got out so soon after recognizing the situation. Be careful you don’t give that peace away again.
last girlfriend of 14 years gets 12 and the new girlfriend has 15 i feel like im losing my sanity why do i keep attracting these woman you start to get the feeling that all woman are like this and i now know what to do with this one it is good to know you are not alone.
Yes I am 18 and dating a 22 year old, we are deff in love. We barely fight but when we do it’s about the most stupid thing. I don’t fight back either, I just sit and tell her that this is stupid and why should we fight. I’m just saying that I want to be with her but reading this really tells a little something. I deff know that her moms a crazy bitch, I hate her. I will never break up with my women but if she breaks up with me, I guess it’s for a reason right?? (;
At least I know I’m not alone. Like so many of you, my love for my children keeps me married. My oldest child gets a fair amount of abuse, too. After being called a piece of “excrement” my oldest finally realized how crazy mom is. I could go on, but it’s too depressing. Thanks for this site. So many of these comments are so similar to what I could write.
A cautionary tale that continues, getting out is important but keep in mind repairing the damage done to your psyche through the repeated insidious abuse that goes with living with one of these people (a woman in my case) takes a lot of time and even more painful introspection if anything is to be gained from the experience. Which in my case is not a one off event.
The very first woman I knew who fit this description was my mother and strangely every woman since has to varying degrees been the same. The most recent of course was the epitome of evil is there is such a thing and even though we are now divorced and I am to a large degree safe we have 2 kids together which means the kids keep me involved in a destructive, toxic and abusive relationship that doesnt end unless I am prepared to surrender.
So after getting so mentally sick that after 26 years of continuous sobriety I nearly drank again after a period of homelessness in a foreign country, after a near fatal heart attack and having to recover alone without family, friends or support in a below standard share house environment, after being constantly bombarded by crazy insidious and intrusive thoughts of self harm etc. I started to learn what I was dealing with and started to connect some dots.
In psychological terms this is the first site I found that described my ex-wife and her tactics and behaviours as well as its impact on the target, me. But now she has our two young children to feed upon and devour, she has a new lover/soul mate. Am I the the only one who thinks it strange that a 41 year old woman would proudly display a hickey or such mark on her neck at her sons kindy graduation?
Am I the only one who thinks its strange that this same woman a brown eyed brunette would deliberately dye her hair blonde to look more like her blue eyed blonde haired children. What on earth is happening in the world where did these evil vile creatures come from. I know my ex-wife was given away at birth, adopted soon after, and she was a difficult baby. I know she was sexually abused, i know she was promiscuous a drug taker and a self harmer, I knew she had two sons from a previous 17 year relationship, one more selfish and spoiled than she was, who became her surrogate spouse when she left his father and the other older son had aspergers syndrome but i didnt know anything until we were married and had our 1st child.
Now I am slowly trying to recover, its been more than a year since I’ve seen my kids who have become weapons her her hands to destroy me. I find it interesting that the spiritual/biblical explanation has to do with Jezebel and her weaker male partner Absolom.
The one question that I need help with the most is: Does she project her feelings onto you? No, she mimics my emotions. Its like I’m not allowed to have my own emotions. This is a huge problem when she has done something really bad. It’s like “oh shit she did something really bad, she’s going to be so pissed at me.” After ignoring me for two weeks, she told me that I don’t give her enough attention.
The house has to be perfect, and she’s always cleaning. I rarely have a chance to clean and this is strategic on her part. She reminds me of how much I don’t help out every single day.
She criticizes me for not spending enough time with my friends, but she can’t stand it when I do spend time with them. I don’t want to even get started with family issues.
Does she place you on a pedestal one day just to tear you down the next? This one is dead on. Yesterday- “You are so amazing. I hope when we have kids they get your brains.” Today- “You don’t love me. You never go over the top to show you care.” We were just in Bora Bora last month. I go over the top and around the moon.
She’s in counseling, and taking meds, but these problems never go away. Its like groundhogs day. Now she wants kids…
What you describe in the first half of you message is not mimicking your emotions, it’s called (I believe) the double bind – a situation where you are never right no matter what choice you make. There is an article here on this site, I believe.
I think I just answered yes to most of them about my wife only one I found missing was refuses to do anything eg. House hold chores or even actually earn a living and hates looking after our child yet claims she wants to be a stay at home mum
OMG! are you in my house. I got a 14 and our son is a burden.
SIgh. I’m locked safely in a separate bedroom as I try to figure out why I have put up with this for so long with my emotional monster…..Record everything guys, its the only thing that can save you if she threatens to “make it far worse” and lie to the police that she feels threatened. When I pull out the recorder, she shuts up like a giant clam during a scuba tour. Best 35 dollars ive ever spent. It drives her absolutely insane to think that anyone but me could know how she treats me, so the threat of kicking me out, leaving me, divorcing me etc always gets thrown in my face if i dare record her anytime. I’ll keep recording until im safely divorced and financially secure and separated from her insanity.
Umm, my wife fit damn near every question she fits. But does she realize it? No! Im the bad guy, of course I cheated on her, not physically, now she has her foot on my neck for everything!
Ah, the “emotional affair” gambit. What a load of shit. I think this is some Oprah-esque pop psychology feminist cop out so that an abusive nutter can finally consider you a cheater no matter what. Anything to maintain the self-righteous justification for treating you like shit. You will always be the bad guy, and she will always be the radiant being of light who suffers to put up with you. The question is, are you going to submit to a lifetime of that?
After three years, going to psychotherapy and reading so much online that I’m saturated by it. I’ve ended it.
Long story short. My ex of ten years left me for another man, we were never married and have two kids 6 and 8. After the separation I was on my knees devastated. I nearly hung myself in the garage. Then I thought bugger this and joined a men’s group and got counselling. Three months later I was good, training hard, fit, feeling good.
Then I called up this girl I met when I played table tennis. At first she seemed a bit boring and quiet, but she was very attractive. It was ok from the start and I was eager to impress. I still felt guilty about being a controlling self absorbed ass in my last relationship.
There we some red flags at first now that I think back. The first was when we were out at dinner and her mood suddenly went dark. I was shocked and almost walked out. But I hung in there thinking I was being too sensitive.
Things progressed and she complained allot how I seemed to pander to my ex and let her abuse me on the phone. I explained I wanted to keep the piece for the kids. No empathy.
I spent hours in draining talks with her as the relationship went on. She was so convincing and my self confidence was low that I tried to go along with her opinions. I changed my number so the ex couldn’t reach me. Only by email.
I was constantly accused of stareing at other women or flirting. She would pull me aside and say I’m embarrassing her in front of her family over certain comments I made.
The list goes on. I love you but you make so many bad decisions. I should come first before your kids because our relations should be strong so they can see it. Your kids didn’t thank me for dinner. Why aren’t they as well brought up as my niece. You joke around too much. You don’t respect me or care. I never ever look at other men because I love you, if you love someone then then you shouldn’t need to look, I should be enough. My mother agrees with me on (whatever the disagreement was about how to work with the kids or some other topic). Look at how my sister is treated by her man, he really looks after her. You don’t look after me. When we go out you don’t look out for me enough, I’m invisible. You always want attention. You can’t but into my rental property until you settle your finances with your ex. Fair enough. You’ve taken two years to settle financed my friend did it in a year, ( even though she had no kids in that situation) Then I settled. No you still can’t buy into my house, what if you died and your kids and ex got half my house I’ve worked so hard for, I can’t take that risk. Fair enough.
We need to get married first. You sure not romantic enough, I need romance to get turned on so that we can have sex more.
On and on every day. Moody. I’d come home happy and she would be stewing about some transgression I made. Or a facebook like I made that she took offence to. Or something I said. Or because I didn’t answer the phone in a certain way to make her feel cared for.
She threw a few bad tantrums. Rampage through the house, broke things, threw things at me. So much to include I could really write on forever.
I was always on the back foot thinking I was an emotional retard. I asked her to move in with me thinking that would show my commitment and love. Bad idea. An absolute nightmare. I couldn’t keep up enough for her. I dreaded coming home to criticism and moodiness. Then I asked her to marry me. So nice. But after she kept giving the ring back over arguments I refused to return it. It was sacred to me. Not a bargaining tool to win her way.
Then I toughened up, after been thrown out of my own house a few times and sleeping in hotels. I asked her to leave. She did. She had threatened it a few times anyway. I needed a safe place. Best decision I made. I could come home and not have to sleep on the couch, or worry about a chore I should be doing.
She moved into her own property down the road that she was renting out.
Still we soldered on. Me always trying to be a better man, an understanding man. Always reading websites to try a new approach, just for her to feel happy, to have a good relationship with me.
I could really go on and on. But with psychotherapy I began to see how I looked for approval from others. Always wanted others to be happy before me.
Well her rages got too much, and the last incident when she hit me across my back in a rage over an apparent disrespectful action by me, really hurting my feelings more than the pain, I walked off.
We texted back and forth. She blamed, then lip serviced me, then got angry. Then offered to do a three month counseling agreement. Always dreaming of having a baby. She’s 37 with three abortions to different men under her belt. I empathised with that big time, and got my vasectomy reversed. He click was ticking.
Thank Christ I did not get her pregnant. It was close. I though that would finally make her complete.
I’ve blocked her now. It has been a month of separation and a fee days if no contact, so so hard to resist her. But I am struggling to imagine even wanting to be with her or hold her. After all the lies, flirting with my best friend in front of me, the constant manipulating, accusing, rages, silent treatments, withdrawal, break ups, bad looks, left stranded, hormones blah blah blah.
I don’t want to go another wasted year of trying to get please her so she can just be normal and love me. So that I don’t spend time with my kids every second weekend mulling over us, feeling like such a loser and bad man.Even though she wants to try counselling again. What’s the point. I’m a good man. Why waste my energy everyday forever. She won’t change. She is always upset and deeply but but by my actions. And nobody understands her. Nobody ever had according to her, even after the hundreds of three hour, exhausting discussions, usually ending in me finally giving in, saying sorry. Trying to day ago the right things.
See you baby. I loved you so much, with everything I had. I shouldn’t have though, you are poison, and it hurts me to be brutal. But I was never good enough. So now you can work it out for yourself. Not my responsibility, or my dream…..
Thanks guys. Hang in there. The secret is educating yourself, and a challenging proactive therapist to work with you. Get your balls back. No-ones opinions and feelings are more accurate ot more valid than yours. We are not crazy. Yes we have issues, low self esteem and insecurity, but we are not crazy. We love deeply and we can be hurt. We can grow and we can adapt. Yet we are human, and we want to have a say, an opinion and some pride. We are men, and I’m proud to be one. And Im a damb good father. And a compassionate person. And now I’m going to spend all that energy I wasted on a fools hope, on me. Geez imagine what I can do to myself with all that energy.
Peace.
You should add one more question to your list. Would you be paranoid that if you went through the list, found that every one of them was your situation , and then actually commented at the bottom of the page that there might be some way of her finding out that you made the comment. And you would lose four days of sleep and a few million brain cells as a result.
Reading this paged just popped something inside my head. I need help.
Very good add. By the end of things, I was living semi-homeless and everything “sensitive” I carried around with me in a large backpack. If I wasn’t home, it was in my car. It only took years of her cracking into my email, my relatives’ email, getting on their computers and re-setting their passwords when visiting so she could log in from her home PC to read what everyone was saying, sending copies to her sisters and mom for discussion….when me and the kids got into counseling to deal with her sh*t, she called the counselors to ask what we were talking about, asked if she should come be a part of it. Showed up at the youngest’s session and tried to listen at the door on multiple occasions. No boundaries of any kind.
Man, my story is a long one but full of eerily similar details. I am married to my chock-full-of-fun wife and have a son on the way. This will be our second child. the first being why we are even married in the first place. I have beat myself up so very many times for trying to do the right thing for my daughter and soon to be son, while all the while wondering if it would simply be best to try and be the best dad I can, on my own….
When she loses it, there are no limits to her fury and it is truly disgusting….
Wow described my wife to a t…
Yup, I’m fucked…
Had another fight again yesterday
Seems each time we talk on the phone or text that there is always a disagreement
I can answer yes to almost all of these questions
She said that for her, there is no grey section. Only black or white. And for that, she keeps telling me she’s always the evil one in the relationship.
Keeps telling me that I can get out of it whenever I want to and when I somewhat agree to it, she starts getting so sad.
If she doesn’t want that, then why would she even suggest it.
I was planning to buy a new condo and she got mad because she wanted to do it with me. Though it’s been only 2 months and she had already mentioned to me that she could not buy a new place and was not thinking of doing so for the next 2 years.
Why can’t this be a normal relationship or is this actually normal and these thoughts are all only in my head.
Also, I was checking my facebook page and from the corner of her eye she already thought I was messaging another of my friends. Not to mention, she was trying to see my login password. And, whenever I log in to my facebook, I have the strange feeling she is stalking me since I get a call or text from her asking what I am doing.
Rick_k9,
If it doesn’t feel right, it probably isn’t. Trying to see your password? That’s crazy BPD behavior. My advice: run for your life! Don’t let her sink her claws into you. I married a BPD and lost a heckuva lot of time and money (and almost my career — she made false claims of domestic violence). There are plenty of non-crazy women out there. I’m dating one right now! 🙂
I answer yes to about 10 or 12 of these. Married for over 35 years. Feelings just like the shrink described in the article. I cannot recommend divorce, but I would never say never. The unfortunate reality is that it doesn’t get better, crazier, not better. It’s kind of lonely and sad to be 60 years old, and deal with this. No advice from me, just reality from my perspective. It is not fun, and it does not get better.
What! After 30 years of craziness I find out there is a simple test to warn men before it is too late. Now I know what it feels like to be a guinea pig in a maze with no exit (the guinea is my version; my ex would likely say rat). And it only takes 3 of the 19 criteria to determine if she is crazy? I sensed that something wasn’t right but I had nothing go on until it was too late. If I’d only known, it could have been so easy. Seems like very reasonable criteria based on my experience. And the craziness gradually gets worse with time.
13 yes’s for me, over 3 years. welp…
I answered ‘Yes’ to every question. This entity came straight from ‘hell’, she was half my age but had an IQ of 132 – The night we met she came ready with a CD-ROM of photographs of herself, poetry and subliminal instructions on how I was to handle her and what to expect. – ‘I expect to be served like a Queen..for I am a LEO’ – She played the victim 5 minutes into our initial meeting – ie. ‘My life has been destroyed by men’ – etc. – claimed to have supernatural powers, had an imaginary ‘angel’ ‘friend’ who supposedly guided her and made decisions for her. – I found out she had been diagnosed with BPD, Schizoaffective disorder, narcissistic personality disorder and bi-polar disorder. She almost tore my life and sanity apart in the brief period of our friendship….only to reappear years latter with apologies for her past behaviour. I wish I could go back to that night 6 years ago and take a ‘rain-check’ on our first meeting and never had to endure the pain I have live with since she came into my life.
I answered yes to 15 out of 19. I would have added a couple of more like, if you go out for Dinner and order different stuff, she would take a bite at your food and would always love it while always not satisfied with what she had ordered. If you offer to exchange, she would never accept it but continue to act miserable and ruin the mood.
I have read a lot of comments relating to these questions and agreeing to it. I also do. I am also experiencing the same. But I am more interested in knowing how to fix it. There has to be a solution other than divorce. Because if you have kids, you would still have to deal with her on a regular basis and it would be a nightmare. So I would like to share some of stuff that has worked, to make it less painful for some of us:
1. Always act that you love what she has cooked and don’t hold back praising her extensively even if you don’t like it.
2. Act vulnerable, emotional, sensitive, a victim while discussing an issue. She loves being on the driving seat and being protective. Let her take control once in a while.
3. Give her massage, even if you hate doing it. Even though its just going to make things better only for a few minutes.
4. If she is being bossy, go overboard humorously by saying stuff like “sure, whatever you say your highness, anything for you etc.”.
5. Praise her extensively overall on everything.
6. Make a note of good things and mention them during a fight. Remind her. Even though, it doesn’t make much of a difference during the fight but she later realizes that and acknowledges it. Makes you feel a little better when she does.
7. Give her gifts, flowers and cards, also send her romantic text messages and say you miss her. It works.
8. Help her out with house chores and kids.
9. Ask her what she did all day long and act as if you are really interested in what she did by engaging in a conversation with her.
10. She wants you to fight back so fight back once in a while and let your anger out. But be careful what you say, because she will remember it forever. Then apologize and make up.
Its true, it gets worse but you cannot do much if you have kids. You can just try and make it better. You have to kill your ego and arrogance. You can just pray for things to get better.
Thanks for this site! it keept my sanity for the last few days. First of all I must say I am from Norway, and my written english is not that hardcore, more like a child writing.. so now you know that 🙂
I found this site and answered to the quiz abouve, like allmost all of them!! (not the lipstic) . I went all over them again, and truly i could underline like 14!..
Short story. We moved together 4 years ago. she 42, me 45. she had 3 kids living with her. I had none. time of joy where my son where born after 2 years of relation ship. we had struggeled before, but with this little bundle of joy everything where happy happy.
But time goes and about a year ago it where back to the normal rutine with “the list above”.
Today everything is in ruin. she tells me she has no feeling for me.. but the fact is that I am all sucked dry for money. I work during the day, and in the evning I work with different projects and overtime just to get the ends to meet. she has not worked for 3 years, and has no intention to go back. for half a year ago she came up with the idea that I move out and she could collect single-mom benefits.. talking about norway.. a single mom, with two fathers supporting her.. etc. thats a lot of money. sick system .. you get more money to be home watching tv than going to work (of course depending on salery, but with no education.. the is the jack pot for single moms).
So here I am living with someone who is to lazy to get a job.. but it get worse. she does not even play with our son, never take him out to play. she har one song for putting him to sleep.. “little sheep”. I have a tonn! (even “bankrobber” by the clash.. try it.. its very harmonic.. change some of the word 😉 ) she yells at him all the time and even said one time in the bathroom trying to get his clothes on “bastard, I like to through you in the wall.. (who says something like that to a 2 year old)?. she it T O T A L lazy.. sitting in front of the tv all day.. when she is not at mall buying stuff she cant afford. .with my card.
its hell in many ways, but i put up with it, because i would like him to be a little older before the shit hits the fan. he is very close to me. of course. I am the only one who cares for my son.. i play, learn, take him out, see stuff.. etc etc. his first word where “daddy” and it took a full year before he said “mommy”.
However she told me a week ago that she like to move out and that she would take the kids with them. its hard to picture this, so i said I could move out for a week or so. get her time to think.
I had a hard time. where looking all over internett for help.. advice etc. found this blog and it helped a lot to read about other cases.. answers, and advice. I am now (after day two) ready to go back early.. why shuld I be the one leaving the house? Its my kid, my house.. if she does not like it she can leave.. well, its sounds like a plan. .but again. what will happend to my son? shuld I fight to the bitter end? In Norway, the judge can only rule 100% cases. no 50-50 (yes, he can, but only with couples that communicate good, are good adult friends etc (this is not one of them)).
I could write more, but you get the picture. the relationship is over, now begins the fight for my only son
Roy Batty